Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (May Poll)

[datalol-jack]

Sorry but that argument has no relevance what so ever. At least we still get a vote in the UK !

Tell me about safe seats and low turnouts.

 

[datalol-jack]

* 10,000 EU workers in Brussels on more than Cameron. With their own private shopping mall... GTFO. You haven't seen the accounts for BoJo and much of the Civil Service and contractors then, or the actual EU budget, have you?
* Unelected unknown people running the whole of the

Elected and known to those who care; but like the situation with local elections and officials, the national politicians and leaders will always be more known and get more publicity.


* Absolutely no way to question, debate or vote on any changes to law or rules How do you think any EU material ends up on vellums rolls?

* Leaders are held completely unaccountable

National and European elections don't happen then? Resignations don't occur? Political ideologies do not change?

Yet those EU elected MEP's have little to no input on what the EU does behind closed doors.

* Its become a racketeering operation operation. By spending money on Arts, local communities etc makes thing its a good thing. When in fact for every £1 EU puts in, costs the UK £2.17. That's Brexit arithmetic.

We get back a significant discount back, investment and trade, which the Brexit lot are past beyond caring about now, it seems. There's no Brexit possible that gets us a magical money tree back.

Basic economics tho... We importmore than export, if 50% of our trade comes from the EU then that 50% is negative net import/output. Meaning by opening up to the rest of the world we could change in our favour. Not to mention that I doubt the EU would simply turn our backs on us.

Seriously, get us out of the EU. I cant find any decent reason to stay in. All this "but we get human rights, worker rights"... true but come on, the Tory's might go to town on all that but at least we as country can change that by DEMOCRACY! Lol,


good luck unseating them with the planned boundary changes and FPTP, especially if they get Brexit. Kiss goodbye your social security, privacy and human rights whilst you're at it.

That's absolute rubbish.... We're at a cross road where we could be governed and told what we should/shouldn't be by Europe and have a FPTP system which we are held ransom by the tory's... But lets face it, we created the NHS, welfare state without the EU, I'm sure we as a nation would eventually stand up and fix what has been lost/broken by the torys..

I was dead cert IN voter, but nothing as of yet has changed my opinion... Not that it matters as the outcome has already been decided.

Read about how the EU works, browse votewatch history, read the texts of actual EU treaties not media summaries of them, and discover how elected European governments use the EU as a permanent framework for dialogue, international legislation and trade, and do likewise for the UK; then come back with your YouTube-sourced, fact-free soup.

May I also point out that posting red vs green on blue won't be visible to the colour blind section of the population.

 

[Skunkworks]

I see Shillbot9000 is going into overdrive. Must be seeing the writing on the wall.

 

[Mr Jack]

Well I'll waste an hour of my life elsewhere then .

Here are some reviews of Brexit: The Movie:

Vice: 'Brexit: the Movie' Reveals Why the Upper Classes Are So Excited About the Prospect of Leaving the EU
Huffington Post: 'Brexit - The Movie' Paints a Thatcherite Dream Of Post-EU Britain
Brexit: The Movie Is A Libertarian's Wet Dream

And, for fear of being accused of balance, here's a review from trusted source The Express: Brexit movie reveals how SMUG Eurocrats have shot our democracy down in FLAMES

 

[antijoke]

Having just watched the Brexit video it has only cemented my idea to vote out on the 23rd.

Yes it was only one side of the arguement, but to be honest with you, it was presented well. It didn't rely on scare tactics like Cameron insists on pushing every time, if only there was a well thought out video from the remain camp, possibly they could have spent the money they did sending out the flyer on a video like this.

 

[semi-pro waster]

Either have little to no power..... EU with a simple swing of the hammer banned us from fishing in our own seas.

Argument completely pointless...

I think you're rather underselling our House of Lords, they do have considerable constitutional power to amend, delay or even propose new legislation as well as holding the elected house to account. Opinions obviously vary whether further reforms are needed to this chamber but don't underestimate the role they play in our parliament.

I don't know the answer but would the UK have been likely to limit fishing (either of our own fleets or foreign fishing boats) in an attempt to preserve fish stocks without EU intervention? Depending on your point of view it might be argued that a unified response was more likely to succeed than each country doing their own thing.

 

[Metallifux]

Tell me about safe seats and low turnouts.

Voter apathy is a problem, see how apathetic they are when you start eroding their rights. I firmly believe the Tory's gonna Tory outlook, repealing everyones rights would be political suicide. Hello workers we are going to reduce you paid holidays to 2 weeks just like the US thanks to Brexit. Even I'd vote for comrade Corbyn.

 

[ReltonBFD]

Lol @ vice link put up as a "review"

 

[[TFU] Thegoon84]

Read about how the EU works, browse votewatch history, read the texts of actual EU treaties not media summaries of them, and discover how elected European governments use the EU as a permanent framework for dialogue, international legislation and trade, and do likewise for the UK; then come back with your YouTube-sourced, fact-free soup.

May I also point out that posting red vs green on blue won't be visible to the colour blind section of the population.

I'm sure the EU have created a law about the colour we should use when writing.

The dialog of how the EU works is beyond comprehension. What we read online is it in its basic form naturally. It doesn't change the fact that the EU is in a position of too much power. It doesn't deliver what it first set out to achieve. I have gone from a strong IN to OUT by looking at as much info as possible.

 

[Combat Fighter]

Having just watched the Brexit video it has only cemented my idea to vote out on the 23rd.

Yes it was only one side of the arguement, but to be honest with you, it was presented well. It didn't rely on scare tactics like Cameron insists on pushing every time, if only there was a well thought out video from the remain camp, possibly they could have spent the money they did sending out the flyer on a video like this.

+1

Just watched the video myself today and I have firmly made my mind up.

Get out of the EU!

 

[antijoke]

I think you're rather underselling our House of Lords, they do have considerable constitutional power to amend, delay or even propose new legislation as well as holding the elected house to account. Opinions obviously vary whether further reforms are needed to this chamber but don't underestimate the role they play in our parliament.

I don't know the answer but would the UK have been likely to limit fishing (either of our own fleets or foreign fishing boats) in an attempt to preserve fish stocks without EU intervention? Depending on your point of view it might be argued that a unified response was more likely to succeed than each country doing their own thing.

Yep, didn't they recently stop George dead in his tracks with the welfare reforms?

 

[sanaxe1]

I personally think that the EU will put huge trade tariffs on us as punishment for leaving the EU and to be a deterrent for any other countries thinking of doing the same.

 

[balky12]

I personally think that the EU will put huge trade tariffs on us as punishment for leaving the EU and to be a deterrent for any other countries thinking of doing the same.

I hear this a lot. Why would they? Punishing themselves if anything. BMW for example, dread to think how many hundreds of millions we import. People will just go buy jags instead...

Not as if German/ BMW can suddenly magic another market with the demand of the UK?

Even if they do, we now have the power to open up trade with the likes of China, South America, India, etc.

 

[Mr Jack]

* 10,000 EU workers in Brussels on more than Cameron. With their own private shopping mall... GTFO.

10,000 workers on more than Cameron if you fiddle the numbers a bit, ignore the money Cameron gets paid an MP, and count expenses and allowances for EU workers but not for David Cameron.

* Unelected unknown people running the whole of the EU
* Absolutely no way to question, debate or vote on any changes to law or rules

Apart from the usual methods of democratic accountability through contacting your elected representatives in the EU parliament. The same elected representatives who vote on your part, and debate the issues in the EU parliament on your behalf. On top of that the EU also consults the public on a wide range of issues.

Leaders are held completely unaccountable

The EU's direction is determined by councillors appointed by the democratically elected national governments - who you can hold to account for their actions in the EU - or by the democratically elected EU parliament or by negotiations between national governments themselves. All three are either directly, or indirectly, accountable to the electorate in EU nation states. Even the president (Juncker) was chosen because he was the chosen representative of the largest group in the EU parliament.

Its become a racketeering operation operation. By spending money on Arts, local communities etc makes thing its a good thing. When in fact for every £1 EU puts in, costs the UK £2.17.

If you ignore most of what the EU does and simply account for cash transfers, this is largely correct, but it ignores the fact that the EU does a lot of work for the money we put in (i.e. through it's various regulatory and administrative bodies) and that we get big economic benefits from being in the EU and big economic benefits from helping improve the economies of poorer trading partners in Europe. We would be vastly worse off if we left to the EU according to almost all independent forecasts.

 

[MikeTheNative]

For me it comes down to who do I trust more and it's definitely the EU over the current government so I'm voting stay.

 

[Skunkworks]

For me it comes down to who do I trust more and it's definitely the EU over the current government so I'm voting stay.

This attitude boggles my mind.

 

[Cromulent]

We will join the EEA or something equivalent to that. It presents a major upside. We need to join Switzerland and Norway and avoid becoming part of a closer union. It will harm us if we stay in the EU.

The problem with that argument is that Norway and Switzerland still need to follow EU laws but they have no say when the laws are written up. They just have to follow them whether they like it or not.

Being a member of the EU gives us the power to influence EU laws and make them work for us. Plus being a member of the EU gives us a huge advantage when it comes to Scientific research. For instance being able to work in CERN and all the international collaboration that being a member of the EU provides. If we leave the EU we'll be a technological back water and won't be able to fund research and development to anywhere near the same level as it is now. No one in the leave campaign has addressed that particular problem as far as I am aware.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-35668682

I'm still very much on the vote to remain in the EU side of things. In fact I find it rather worrying considering what the outcome will be if we vote to leave the EU.

 

[Mr Jack]

Being a member of the EU gives us the power to influence EU laws and make them work for us. Plus being a member of the EU gives us a huge advantage when it comes to Scientific research.

This is correct.

For instance being able to work in CERN and all the international collaboration that being a member of the EU provides.

This is not. CERN is not an EU organisation and our membership should not be affected by leaving.

 

[Narj]

For me it comes down to who do I trust more and it's definitely the EU over the current government so I'm voting stay.

That's quite a short-termist view IMO seeing as this lot won't be around forever. I also dislike the current government, but we know for a fact that it's possible to force u-turns and compromises on policy when there is enough public discontent.

Our PM can't even negotiate decent reform with the EU so I doubt a crowd of our teachers or junior doctors demonstrating (and an online petition) would change any particular EU-wide policy that we didn't agree with.

 

[oneilldo]

Yes CERN that most successful of EU projects.

That BBC link is bit naughty, the title "EU exit 'risks British science'" followed by a picture of CERN with small caption "Cern is one of Britain's most successful international collaborations and it is independent of the EU"

Still not like the media etc. to try and link other successful and well regarded laws, rules, science etc. to be down to the EU, ahem human rights, workers rights etc