Poll: The EU Referendum: What Will You Vote?

[FoxEye]

only stay in if we can regulate on what public services incoming EU migrants have access to. Not fair if people arrive here and can straight away claim for housing, child care, etc.

Or perhaps our benefits are just too generous, and the system too easy to game.

There has to be a reason that people associate the UK with benefits paradise. Without that pull, you wouldn't need to discriminate.

Certain questions do spring to mind. Why are the vast majority of (asylum) immigrants housed in London, where rents are generally the most expensive? Why do you hear stories of unemployed families receiving 30k + worth of benefits? More than many people earn?

It's such stories that create the idea that Britain is throwing money at people in benefits, even if such cases are the minority it's still wrong. I'd be in favour of moving the long-term benefit claimants out of expensive London suburbs, to somewhere cheaper. Send them up North See how they like living in Blackpool or somewhere

 

[Tunney]

Certain questions do spring to mind. Why are the vast majority of (asylum) immigrants housed in London, where rents are generally the most expensive?

They're not. Only about 1.5% of asylum seekers are housed in London and the south east.

Why do you hear stories of unemployed families receiving 30k + worth of benefits? More than many people earn?

No-one is receiving £30k in benefits. The cap is £500pw for couples/single parents and £350pw for single adults.

It's such stories that create the idea that Britain is throwing money at people in benefits, even if such cases are the minority it's still wrong. I'd be in favour of moving the long-term benefit claimants out of expensive London suburbs, to somewhere cheaper. Send them up North See how they like living in Blackpool or somewhere

You want to move them where there's no jobs? How's that going to help?

 

[Avenged7Fold]

Or perhaps our benefits are just too generous, and the system too easy to game.

There has to be a reason that people associate the UK with benefits paradise. Without that pull, you wouldn't need to discriminate.

Certain questions do spring to mind. Why are the vast majority of (asylum) immigrants housed in London, where rents are generally the most expensive? Why do you hear stories of unemployed families receiving 30k + worth of benefits? More than many people earn?

It's such stories that create the idea that Britain is throwing money at people in benefits, even if such cases are the minority it's still wrong. I'd be in favour of moving the long-term benefit claimants out of expensive London suburbs, to somewhere cheaper. Send them up North See how they like living in Blackpool or somewhere

Large number of immigrants in London is probably due to higher population density (though definitely not a majority), more jobs available and poor crap housing available. Lets not pretend that there isn't really crap cheap housing in London. Might be expensive compared to up north or Wales but if the income in London is proportionally higher, then why not?

As for why you hear stories of 30k+ benefit claimers, i don't doubt there are some people taking advantage of the system (though 30k is silly) but i would guess many of the crazy figures quoted in the DM are anomalies and you hear about them because its controversial and an easy win for the media outlet. The benefit system does not need to be less generous, just more efficient in distributing money without blowing it all on administration and people who don't deserve it.

Some of these posts look like they are from a DM fact sheet and some are even bordering fox news.

 

[Mr Jack]

Why do you hear stories of unemployed families receiving 30k + worth of benefits? More than many people earn?

Because the right wing press has an agenda.

 

[scorza]

Because the right wing press has an agenda.

They can't just make things up though, despite what you may believe. That family of Somali asylum seekers living in a £1m+ Notting Hill house really are living there and that is a realistic value for the house. They might not receive £30k a year in cash benefits but they are in receipt of a benefit worth £30k a year.

 

[francky]

A lot of issues related to housing and lower paid wages are not the fault of immigrants and we should not fool ourselves into thinking that if there were no immigrants then suddenly rent would be affordable, there would be loads of housing prices and everyone would have adequate disposable income.

What needs to be tackled can be done without leaving the EU. Rent prices need to be regulated and there should be stricter regulations upon purchasing multiple properties, doing away with buy-to-let mortgages altogether. Since they were introduced, house prices have been crazy and rent has in turn increased because people are less able to afford house deposits and have no choice but to rent, giving money to those who already have properties and already earn 25k+ without the income from rented out house.

With more affordable housing, less demand for housing/rent (due to buy-to-let mortgages disappearing) i can only foresee that people will have a larger disposable income.

I just cannot see any drastic changes happening before this buy-to-let mortgage culture is done away with, regardless of whether we leave the EU or not.

I may be voicing a very unpopular opinion on here, as i know many of you likely do let out a second property. I just dont see why it is fair or beneficial to deny first time buyers or take advantage of those who can just about afford to rent so your already adequately filled pockets can be filled further while you continue to borrow money on a house you dont live in or need.

Well said mate.....while not the ONLY factor in the obscene property price rises over the years, it is most definitely a huge factor in the pricing out of young people from their 1st and second homes.

I've been looking at moving into a house, from my first flat which I bought 5 years ago....every single new build site that I go and look at has already sold a huge chunk of the properties from the small flats up to the 3 beds to BTL landlords, all off plan....so they get them at the cheaper price (as they don't really care what they look like) and then when then come to being able to look at them...the builders start to raise the prices by £10-20k because there are only a few left.

I even went and looked at a site that was nothing more than a muddy field a month or so ago.....the agent that was selling them, said most had been snapped up by the BTL landlords and only a couple were left, but the price had gone up by 10K.

So people just blaming immigration on the high price of property just isn't true....but again another factor in the messed up property market.

 

[Tunney]

They can't just make things up though, despite what you may believe.

Read The Sun today? They were forced to publish an apology for a misleading story on page 1. They skated around the rules by publishing a neutral headline (in small text) on page 1, with the actual apology on page 2.

That family of Somali asylum seekers living in a £1m+ Notting Hill house really are living there and that is a realistic value for the house. They might not receive £30k a year in cash benefits but they are in receipt of a benefit worth £30k a year.

No-one is getting £30k in benefits, cash or otherwise. The worst you could say is that their rent is below market value.

 

[Mr Jack]

They can't just make things up though, despite what you may believe.

They can, and frequently do.

That family of Somali asylum seekers living in a £1m+ Notting Hill house really are living there and that is a realistic value for the house. They might not receive £30k a year in cash benefits but they are in receipt of a benefit worth £30k a year.

Right, but the big life is in making you believe that this is a significant problem as opposed to the reality of a deeply exceptional cases resulting from other more important issues.

 

[MooMoo444]

I don't have the willpower to go and vote, but I have a preference for out.

 

[scorza]

Read The Sun today? They were forced to publish an apology for a misleading story on page 1. They skated around the rules by publishing a neutral headline (in small text) on page 1, with the actual apology on page 2.

I don't read the scum as well you know. I did read about that humiliating apology in The Indy though

No-one is getting £30k in benefits, cash or otherwise. The worst you could say is that their rent is below market value.

If you're paying £100pw rent for a property that would attract a weekly rent of >£500pw if let privately then that's a benefit of >£400pw. I imagine the taxman would probably see it that way if an employer provided living accommodation for an employee and tax the benefit.

 

[platypus]

They can't just make things up though, despite what you may believe.

Hahahahahahaha.

 

[sports_brah]

Because it's a bit more complicated than that.

Actually, there's nothing really surprising here. Research on the impact of immigration on wages hovers around a neutral overall impact on average wages but research looking specifically at low skilled wages tends to suggest a small negative impact. The worst affected groups are previous migrants.

The problem with blaming migrants for wage declines is that it ignores much bigger causes of much bigger losses of wages. It's a nice divide-and-conquer approach for the right.

Sorry but I don't buy this. We are moving as a society (well we have already moved but it takes time to fully filter) into a service driven environment and high end research.

The days of needing unskilled labour are quickly vanishing in the face of technological progress and offshore outsourcing (as a result of increased globalisation).

We need to be looking ahead as a society towards the future. Simply having more people will not help us sustain a competitive advantage. Having wide swathes of differing cultures with the net effect of reducing homogeneity in the nation will also not lead to future success.

Far better to instead focus on trying to increase the core usefulness of who we have now and successive generations rather than a cheap fix of foreign labour.

 

[Avenged7Fold]

We aren't really moving forward though, primary sector jobs are lower proportionally than ever but to be honest that grunt work has just been replaced by customer service type jobs and call centres with as little pay. Though i cant speak for other fields, physics has not seen an increase in researchers and demand for properly paid research positions have fallen.

Are you saying you are not buying that there are major economic issues unrelated to migrants? I can understand that you may feel they have a large economic impact but surely you dont think they are the single biggest issue when it comes to housing and wages?

 

[D.P.]

Sorry but I don't buy this. We are moving as a society (well we have already moved but it takes time to fully filter) into a service driven environment and high end research.

The days of needing unskilled labour are quickly vanishing in the face of technological progress and offshore outsourcing (as a result of increased globalisation).

We need to be looking ahead as a society towards the future. Simply having more people will not help us sustain a competitive advantage. Having wide swathes of differing cultures with the net effect of reducing homogeneity in the nation will also not lead to future success.

Far better to instead focus on trying to increase the core usefulness of who we have now and successive generations rather than a cheap fix of foreign labour.

European immigrants are more highly educated and more likely to have a degree than British citizens, so allowing Eu immigration is 'increasing core usefulness'.


An EU immigrant is just as likely to work for a big software firm in London earning 60K year as they are in a low skilled job, which in this day and age is customer services type roles, as part of the service industry the UK is growing in.

 

[Tunney]

We need to be looking ahead as a society towards the future. Simply having more people will not help us sustain a competitive advantage. Having wide swathes of differing cultures with the net effect of reducing homogeneity in the nation will also not lead to future success.

How does homogeneity lead to success? An insular echo chamber isn't going to make us a leader in innovation.

 

[Dave]

How does homogeneity lead to success? An insular echo chamber isn't going to make us a leader in innovation.

Devils advocate here, but it (homogeneity) worked pretty well for countries like Japan and South Korea.

 

[Avenged7Fold]

Devils advocate here, but it (homogeneity) worked pretty well for countries like Japan and South Korea.

How did it work out for N Korea?

 

[mmj_uk]

We need generous benefits here due to the higher cost of living, the trouble arises from economic tourism.. a bloke I know from Lithuania was telling me that working over there he can only earn 300 Euro's a month, he can make more than that over here on unemployment benefits or do the same work here and earn 4-5 times more.

If I could go to Lithuania and earn for example £5k per month I'd too be on the next flight with a group of friends to house share, with a view to working for a few years and then coming back to the UK effectively set up for life. So next time someone bangs the "Eastern Europeans are more hard working than British people" drum, just imagine how much more enthusiastic you would be at work if you were suddenly getting paid 4-5 times more, plus knowing that you can probably retire back in your homeland after 4-5yrs.

 

[nine_tails]

In!

 

[kitkat2015]

Out as fast as possible!!!!!

& No to allowing 16 & 17 yrs old to vote.