The Little Mermaid (05/2023) live-action Disney remake

[ianh]

Whereas your post seems to imply there is a two way ‘tit for tat’, it is not ‘two-sided’ other than there merely being sets people that disagree with each other on these issues. Instead what we have is the same sets of people desperate to perpetually make the same rhetorical points and being really ****ing loud about it, without any restraint.

Just to clarify - you say "it is not two sided" - but then you say its "sets of people that disagree" which I mean thats the definition of "two sided" to me i.e two sets of people with opposing views arguing with each other over those views, which is what we have here and matches with the last sentence in the quote, which I agree with you over. Maybe I've misunderstood your point TBH.

But it's not just that at the moment, is it? It's everybody jumping on a teaser that has been released, shouting down Disney, making personal attacks on employees and really just continuing some sort of (as @Nitefly said) rhetoric that anything Disney does is going to suck because of "woke gender politics and pedo rings"... or something. That is my point. There's little critical review of what they actually release.

Is it "everyone" or just a literal handful of people in the media, SM, and in here?

Just look at the very limited effect those people can cause because the people on the "Right Wing", who were never going to see a Disney product anyway, deciding not to watch a product doesn't make Disney lose $200 million over "Strange World", or lose $150 million on "Mulan", or lose $150 million on "Jungle Cruise" etc etc etc, that takes a global market of people of all political persuasions from all around the world saying "nope" to the material Disney currently is creating. So the idea that we should blame evil "Right Wingers in the US" for this continual slow Global collapse of the Disney brand, instead of blaming Disney themselves for making objectively "poor" products that people don't want to see as much of any more, is a strange deflection of blame apportioning to me.

It's one of the few areas where myself and VincentHanna agree - people don't watch "bad" products - and its just a huge shame that currently, most of the Disney films/series that the "US Right Wing" say are Woke, should be products that are made really well for everyone to enjoy allowing their message to reach further to wider audiences. However, they are generally the ones which are being poorly made (bad story, script, acting or direction etc) and are therefore being poorly received by everyone around the world, hindering the reach their message.

The opposite is a great example, so when something which still covers a "woke" topic such as racism and/or gender inequality is very well made with a good story, script, acting or direction etc such as films like "Green Book" or "Hidden figures" etc, it generally does really well commercially and critically, and strangely there is virtually no complaints about the "Right Wing". Yet when a product is poorly made, such as the "Batwoman" TV show or the film "Lightyear" for example, its failure is suddenly "Oh, its the Right Wings fault" rather than blaming the low quality of the product for its failure.

That act of wilful ignorance towards why something "really" failed, because the persons political leaning means that they don't want to acknowledge that their opposition may have been correct about this one product, is just silly and things on either side will not change unless the people who are currently cheerleading "bad products" acknowledge that the products are bad and advocate for change, for improvements to be made in the quality of the products they cheerleading for, but generally they seem on both sides to be ingrained with "to complain would be to agree with my enemy" and too many on either side won't allow themselves to do it, so we're left with dross in the cinema and on TV.

And please do tell what sort of impact that left wing "echo chamber" is having on forums such as these? Are we all red-pilled (or blue, who the heck knows? ) and ruining discussions on TV/films like the right-wingers? I think not.

Really? The irony of saying (to paraphrase) "the things that my side say are good but the things that the other side say are bad and are ruining things" without realising thats exactly what the other echo chamber is also saying, is just depressing

You've said an opposing viewpoint is "ruining" discussions, but don't you think the people on the "other side" are thinking exactly the same as you as well? The desire to hear only one opinion and allow no other to be heard if it "ruins discussion" isn't a discussion at all, its the literal definition of an echo chamber, thats the negative impact they have, irrespective of "sides". The most important thing is to remember, I would suggest, is to remain civil with each other despite our differences, and thats the part most of us here struggle with at times i.e. it's OK to disagree, just don't be a ****

 

[the shadow]

Still waiting for Prince Anders movie no one wanted

 

[rp2000]

blah

blah

I've been thinking about this recently myself. I 100% am posting less in the threads of TV shows or movies that interest me as a result of all the negativity in the threads by a handful of posters. Rather than describe it as left and right wing I will say my problem is the overly negative postings as opposed to the rest which is positive or lightly negative. There's even been a few threads I was thinking of creating but didn't bother with.

I suppose it's my fault as I like a lot of D+ content (Mainly Lucasfilm and Marvel) but those threads are particularly bad at times.

When I see a teaser of said film I like I like to post it, and then maybe a month later the full trailer. Beyond that I don't really read much about the films before deciding to watch them at the cinema or on streaming. I can guarantee that thread will now contain the following:

1) Quotes of anything pro/anti woke they may have said in an interview 99% of fans will not watch or have an interest in.
2) Talk of rumours of rewrites/re-filming etc which again 99% of people don't care about, usually along the lines of they had to refilm it cos it was too woke or something.
3) Rumours of early screenings that the public hated cos it was woke etc.
4) Talk of "do people even watch this franchise anymore?" (off course they do, they're posting positively about in the thread you are trashing!)
5) Talk of "do people even pay to watch this stuff at the cinema anymore" (of course they do, and they shockingly enjoy the experience!)
6) Accusations of eating pills, being a simp, being a stan.
7) Anti black, trans, gay commentary (in my opinion) unnecessarily inserted into some threads, possibly taking them off topic.
8). yeah but yeah but yeah but , Mario and Top Gun Maverick, yeah but yeah but yeah but (this one was just a joke !!)


In a few of the threads I do reply, and probably add to the problem myself, so i'm not claiming to be a saint or anything.

My favourite thread recently: How long does it take you to get to the Cinema? Totally on topic and hard for even the most ardent ****** to trash.


rp2000

 

[Shamikebab]

Honestly this subforum would have seen changes but I don't think any mods actually come in here. On a more popular subforum this thread or the Disney one which is literally just a few people posting links they trawl twitter for without comments would have been pruned long ago.

 

[arknor]

But when women and people of colour start going on about how they are only now breaking barriers, they can **** right off.

cleopatra was black, proves how far we fell. start the reparations already

 

[rp2000]

Honestly this subforum would have seen changes but I don't think any mods actually come in here. On a more popular subforum this thread or the Disney one which is literally just a few people posting links they trawl twitter for without comments would have been pruned long ago.

Some of the mods probably agree with the views so give a very light touch moderation to this sub forum unless posts are reported.


rp2000

 

[Nitefly]

@ianh - yes, I don’t think you got my point so I probably didn’t explain it adequately… I will try to clarify

You’re posts refer to there being ‘two opposing views arguing for pros and cons’. There is nothing wrong with that, inherently. That would just be ‘a debate’. Plenty of room for that on here, most welcome!

What we are talking about is a perpetual eagerness (indeed, a relishing) to use any opportunity to trash certain companies, persons, franchises, whatever - it is all over the place on the sub-forum. It’s boring at best and occasionally ominous.

@rp2000 has subsequently summed up well some of the behaviours in question in his posts above^^^.

 

[Nitefly]

When you look at other kids movies based on a computer IP in recent times - Sonic / Detective Pikachu and the like, SMB has smashed the living snot out of them in box office takings, taking 3 -4 times as much as those movies, it was also universally panned by critics - currently sat at 59% on RT. Some folks will say well it was always going to do numbers because it's a Mario movie and yet it's exceeded projections massively. Alternatively, parents just want to take their kids to see a fun movie aimed at kids and for kids with no political or social commentary. Dont forget some people have been saying the reason certain movies don't do as well as previous entries in the list is that people aren't going to the cinema anymore in a post covid world, and yet good, fun, well made movies that concentrate on story 1st seem to buck this tread all the time. Strange eh.

The Sonic and Detective Pikachu films were, I think, less appealing because of their ‘live action / animated’ hybrid nature. There is also something that suggests “pandering to children” with how those two films are presented, IMO.

Even though Pokémon is a bigger franchise globally, the Mario franchise transcends being ‘aimed at children’ and is more obviously for all ages, I think. I anticipate many people that dislike Pokémon and think of it as being ‘sad’ are indifferent to Mario.

Secondly, I cannot recall there being any social / political commentary in Sonic or Detective Pikachu.

 

[C Kent]

The Sonic and Detective Pikachu films were, I think, less appealing because of their ‘live action / animated’ hybrid nature. There is also something that suggests “pandering to children” with how those two films are presented, IMO.

Even though Pokémon is a bigger franchise globally, the Mario franchise transcends being ‘aimed at children’ and is more obviously for all ages, I think. I anticipate many people that dislike Pokémon and think of it as being ‘sad’ are indifferent to Mario.

Hmm, I can understand your point, but I wouldn't say so personally. I know when Detective Pikachu came out I took my son along to the cinema to watch it as he found the trailer funny, and had he been younger I would have done the same with Mario - he went and saw it with his mates instead (same bunch all saw Minions 2 went it came out). None of them grew up on Mario, but they all went as it looked like a fun movie. Which is kind of the point when comparing to recent Disney offerings, Disney doesn't seem to be making movies with universal appeal anymore, rather they seem content to make movies that appeal to a very small % of children and a bunch of 'soy boys' and 'blue hairs' that bleat on about diversity whenever they can. They've lost sight of what made them successful in the 1st place.

Secondly, I cannot recall there being any social / political commentary in Sonic or Detective Pikachu.

yes it was more a comparison to those 2 that both came out 3/4 years ago, before Disney seemingly jumped the shark and fully embraced their current course. Had Mario came out the same time, I would expect it to have done similar numbers to those 2.

 

[the shadow]

Mena Massoud deletes Twitter after The Little Mermaid comment backlash

Aladdin star Mena Massoud deleted his Twitter after sparking the ire of The Little Mermaid fans on Saturday. The actor suggested that The Little Mermaid will not 'cross the billion mark.'

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Efour]

Mena Massoud deletes Twitter after The Little Mermaid comment backlash

Aladdin star Mena Massoud deleted his Twitter after sparking the ire of The Little Mermaid fans on Saturday. The actor suggested that The Little Mermaid will not 'cross the billion mark.'

www.dailymail.co.uk

Is he wrong? Lol seems a weird thing to get wound up about.

 

[C Kent]

Is he wrong? Lol seems a weird thing to get wound up about.

Must be all those right wingers as they are the only ones that get wound up apparently.

 

[Nitefly]

Hmm, I can understand your point, but I wouldn't say so personally. I know when Detective Pikachu came out I took my son along to the cinema to watch it as he found the trailer funny, and had he been younger I would have done the same with Mario - he went and saw it with his mates instead (same bunch all saw Minions 2 went it came out). None of them grew up on Mario, but they all went as it looked like a fun movie. Which is kind of the point when comparing to recent Disney offerings, Disney doesn't seem to be making movies with universal appeal anymore, rather they seem content to make movies that appeal to a very small % …

This I agree with. The films coming out feel uninspired (Lightyear, Strange World) or are just a little fatiguing now with their overly played ‘emotive themes’ or social commentary (Elements).

In that sense, Mario (not yet seen it though - waiting for streaming) and PIB2 are a breath of fresh air.

…of children and a bunch of 'soy boys' and 'blue hairs' that bleat on about diversity whenever they can. They've lost sight of what made them successful in the 1st place.

In respect of this bit, I don’t think that’s true.

Take Strange World. That had a gay character in it, although duration of the character ‘being gay’ was very fleeting. The extent that impacted on the overall film was very nominal.

I watched an OJ Simpson documentary recently and on that black people in the 70s/80s (children at the time) recalled their family gathering round the TV in amazement of a black man featuring on advertisement, as in it was inspiring to those families. Now, it’s not quite the same obviously, but on similar grounds I imagine having that character being gay does mean something out there to somebody. So, if they are going to have a gay character, fine - doesn’t bother me in the slightest and if certain demographics are under represented, then I understand why they’d like to include them.

Again, that character being gay had no impact on the story.

Instead, the real problem for the film was that the film was absolutely dreadful. The most wafer thin and bland characters you could possibly imagine. A cool concept but the most uninspiring story patched onto it. This is what Disney is failing at and needs to work on. The diversity stuff is incidental.

yes it was more a comparison to those 2 that both came out 3/4 years ago, before Disney seemingly jumped the shark and fully embraced their current course. Had Mario came out the same time, I would expect it to have done similar numbers to those 2.

We’ll never know for sure but I don’t believe that Mario is pulling it’s amazing numbers because people are tired of ‘agenda politics’. The Despicable Me / Minions films did insanely well before that time period.

On a side note, if you look at a list of highest grossing films, you’ll see that many of them are from very recent years (7 of 10 of them are from 2015 onwards) - there is quite a bit of ‘inflation bumping’ going on, I suspect.

 

[ianh]

What we are talking about is a perpetual eagerness (indeed, a relishing) to use any opportunity to trash certain companies, persons, franchises, whatever - it is all over the place on the sub-forum. It’s boring at best and occasionally ominous.

Thanks for the clarification, I'd definitely misunderstood you as I 100% agree with this line in your quote above, as I think it's well understood by now that certain subjects in here will just lead to more division but apparently we just can't help ourselves.

I think why it gets to be "one side always complaining" (my term there) is that currently US film/TV tends to lean more progressive with very little film/TV created by those on the Right, and as such that will always lend itself to the same group of people always complaining with the same "it's going to be yet another poor quality product" complaint, and having to listen to that same complaint over and over understandably feels unfair to one group of people, but on the other hand it must also feel unfair to see yet more of what they perceive as poor quality product being continually pushed out and then being told "you're" the problem if they decide to complain about it.

I mean there will always be one brain-cell manlets who are genuine bigots who will never be happy unless they are tearing something down, thats just an inescapable fact of life, but I believe that the solution for the vast overwhelming majority is apparently both the easiest and hardest thing in the world to do - just make good films/tv/product which makes the vast overwhelming majority happy (and they can be "woke" as long as they are good i.e. Green Book, Hidden Figures etc that I previously mentioned) - and yet it seems almost impossible for some studios to do over the past near decade.

 

[ebilcake]

London premier was interesting, remember when they used to ask cast questions about the movie, what it was like to work on the movie, with other actors, directors, filming scenes, nope!!, none of that..... The first and only question the BBC cared about was the diversity and racism.

 

[Tony Edwards]

none of that..... The first and only question the BBC cared about was the diversity and racism.

I wonder why that might be?

 

[VincentHanna]

73% fresh after 120 reviews:

The Little Mermaid (2023) | Rotten Tomatoes

The youngest of King Triton's daughters, and the most defiant, Ariel longs to find out more about the world beyond the sea, and while visiting the surface, falls for the dashing Prince Eric. While mermaids are forbidden to interact with humans, Ariel must follow her heart. She makes a deal with...

www.rottentomatoes.com

Doesn't sound like a disaster, doesn't sound like a classic

Empire gave it 3/5 and Helen O'Haras biggest criticism was added bloat:

Many of these live-action remakes labour with extraneous detail. That’s most obvious visually, because reality (or photo-real VFX) doesn’t have the clean lines and expressive simplicity of classic Disney animation. But it’s also true plot-wise, with many new threads here alluding to details that don’t really go anywhere. Nowadays, it’s no longer enough for Ariel to lose her voice; she must give up her “siren song”, which may or may not have magical powers responsible for keeping Eric alive during his shipwreck. Such additions increase screentime without impact, and with a running time over two hours, it can occasionally feel flabbier than whale blubber.

I know my wife wants to see it, but hopefully I can dissuade her until it's out on Disney+

 

[potatolord]

... literally just a few people posting links they trawl twitter for without comments...

This is a very annoying thing in quite a few threads, across multiple areas.

 

[the shadow]

People ere still complaining i might go see it next week

 

[Nitefly]

73% fresh after 120 reviews:

The Little Mermaid (2023) | Rotten Tomatoes

The youngest of King Triton's daughters, and the most defiant, Ariel longs to find out more about the world beyond the sea, and while visiting the surface, falls for the dashing Prince Eric. While mermaids are forbidden to interact with humans, Ariel must follow her heart. She makes a deal with...

www.rottentomatoes.com

Doesn't sound like a disaster, doesn't sound like a classic

Empire gave it 3/5 and Helen O'Haras biggest criticism was added bloat:



I know my wife wants to see it, but hopefully I can dissuade her until it's out on Disney+

Ugh. Those live action remakes are so packed with insufferable bloat. Hearing about it again here makes me groan. Hardest of hard avoids!