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** The Official Nvidia GeForce 'Pascal' Thread - for general gossip and discussions **

Associate
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My theory. Since AMD will go for market share this year with price performance, nvidia will release half arsed Pascal this summer which will be gddr5 and slightly faster than current Titan and call it new ti. And they will charge for it arm and leg. And since they will has issues with HBM2, their real pascal will not come till mid next year. And that Pascal with HBM2 will be significantly faster.

But in reality, those demo GPUs, will be just that demo mock ups, to show that they have it in their hand. And real release of Pascal won't happen till later this year(autumn). All this silence doesn't sit well with nvidia.
 
Caporegime
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What will you be using for the next 6 months ?

I am kinda expecting to still be using my TX over the next year. The next gen might beat it but I wouldn't bet on it by much but when the HBM cards arrive, that is where I will be looking to upgrade. Small Pascal and Polaris is almost a given from reading all the tech sites and then the big guns to follow. HBM 2 is where we will see 14/16nm shine.
 
Associate
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They are over simplifying the underlying principles by squishing it all under the moniker of Async compute. You either Run something asynchronous or you don't, it just means that you run something out of order and concurrently instead of synchronous and consecutive to the main flow of the progam.

There are no levels to being Asynchronous, just the amount of work you perform in parallel. whether it is many threads or just a few they are still just Asynchronous, there is no level to them or amount to being asynchronous.

The comparison to hyperthreading revolves around using Bubbles in the pipeline where no work is being computed in some part of the hardware, you aim to slip work into these bubbles which is what hyperthreading and Asynch compute aim to do.

This is going down to the very grit of how superscalar processors perform work, since although it is a single core, they process multiple instructions down multiple pipelines. Usually a single thread will be broken up into multiple parts and fed down these pipelines to improve IPC, but there can be bubbles where no work is being performed, which is where hyperthreading steps in to help fill these bubbles.

This is the comparison with Async, since you are filling bubbles in the pipeline with extra work.

Also that Threading and queue depths comparison was using a very light workload per thread, so the comparison is not as direct. It just shows how many threads the processors can handle concurrently.

The real grit of the async compute is the amount of work do per extra thread you add within those bubbles, which is why they say they are not using many extra threads but still getting a boost.

It starts becoming a detriment when you try to queue up too many heavy threads and exceed the processing power left over by the bubbles, you then start impeding the process which should have been running in that time as you are taking up resources it requires. Which then leads to a detriment in performance as that original process has had to take longer to finish.

So if you are trying to execute compute threads in parallel without managing resources, you end up with an overall detriment.

It all comes down to devs and their dedication to optimise their engines. Look at Oxide, even when they are using just small fraction of async capabilities they still managed to get great performance improvements. And according to Dan baker on Twitter there is still optimisations left in async code in their engine to boost performance for GCN even more.
You can see how Oxide is dedicated to get the most out of their engine, while Hitman devs and publishers are typical today's game devs/publishers: develop game as quick as possible and forget about it and then bitch about it for a while.
 
Soldato
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I am kinda expecting to still be using my TX over the next year. The next gen might beat it but I wouldn't bet on it by much but when the HBM cards arrive, that is where I will be looking to upgrade. Small Pascal and Polaris is almost a given from reading all the tech sites and then the big guns to follow. HBM 2 is where we will see 14/16nm shine.

TBH, till the big cards come out, if you already have a Fury or anything higher then there is no point in getting polaris or Pascal. Only reason to get them would be if they do pull something out the bag and give a big improvement. But they are more than likely going to have equal or better performance than current top end for mid range prieces.
 
Soldato
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It all comes down to devs and their dedication to optimise their engines. Look at Oxide, even when they are using just small fraction of async capabilities they still managed to get great performance improvements. And according to Dan baker on Twitter there is still optimisations left in async code in their engine to boost performance for GCN even more.
You can see how Oxide is dedicated to get the most out of their engine, while Hitman devs and publishers are typical today's game devs/publishers: develop game as quick as possible and forget about it and then bitch about it for a while.

Oh yeah, things like that will always happen. Just at the end of the day there is only so much extra performance that can be pulled out of those idle bubbles. But any extra bit of performance is always welcome.
 
Soldato
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Well I've just bought a second 980ti for SLI to power my new x34 monitor. Call me crazy but sod it.

I feel very confident however that 2x well clocked 980ti will be waaaaay more powerful than any single card that's released in the next few months, and still better than any ' big one' in the next year.

And I know that's relying on SLI to be supported well, but it's a risk I'm willing to take. I've ended up going SLI for the last 3 generations so I'm well used to it.
 
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Soldato
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What will you be using for the next 6 months ?

oh is it 6 moths im going to travel like a month or so in summer , but im using atm 680 power edition flashed to lightning witch is lightning to be fair .

of course im using dell s2716dg so its bit mutch for 680 , but for csgo or some minor games it is fine when clocked

edit: tbh if those lower tears cards are like 50 % faster might even buy that and switch when ti comes out ,as previous year i went trough 970 to 980 to 980 ti
 
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Associate
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Next month is next week. :p :D

If Nvidia don't show anything... I wouldn't be confident they'd be doing well at the start of this new generation. Best case scenario, they show something much like Polaris 10 from AMD, except hopefully on a game that isn't 100% Nvidia favoured or one where all cards do terribly in DX12 (*cough* Hitman *cough*). In fact, I don't want a DX12 benchmark, so then it would be easier to speculate performance.

But good performance means nothing without good pricing... bring on next week!
 
Associate
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I've been waiting since june 1st when I picked up my 980 Ti for next week to come where we'll get some solid information on Pascal, bring on next week, can't wait!
GP104 HAS to be atleast 30% faster than GM200 why?

if GP104 was the same power as GM200 well that means GP100 will be AT BEST 40-50% faster than GM200 which would be a fail imo as me as well as many others are expecting a solid 70% over current Ti and Titan X. heck if they managed to get gtx 980 faster than 780 Ti on the same process node with nearly 50% less cuda cores and baby pascal is supposed to have over 4000 cuda cores then I seriously expect a good 30% performance boost, I'll take that (y)
 
Soldato
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Yeah shroud does look very nice, if it's real that is. Either way very hard to fake I guess. looking forward to pascal. Curious to see what they bring forward for first release. And how well they actually perform. Few days now :).
 
Soldato
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Faking is easy. Fake NX pads were doing the rounds until last week. A lot of tech enthusiasts also happen to be metallurgists, welders and tradesmen of various stripes.

Also a keynote from Toyota, CARS CARS CARS here we come.
 
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Soldato
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I will eat my hat if the pascal Ti or Titan comes out this year... I would love to be wrong however.

This was my train of thought for long enough... But I'm starting to wonder what with all the VR hardware being released right now. PC VR is aimed at enthusiast market and it would make sense for nvidia to cash in and market the big cards for the VR market.

Although, I might just be motivated by the fact that I've just checked on the EVGA website and I've got 40 days left to step up... Come on Nvidia! :D
 
Caporegime
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This was my train of thought for long enough... But I'm starting to wonder what with all the VR hardware being released right now. PC VR is aimed at enthusiast market and it would make sense for nvidia to cash in and market the big cards for the VR market.

Although, I might just be motivated by the fact that I've just checked on the EVGA website and I've got 40 days left to step up... Come on Nvidia! :D

So your hoping that the new pascal midrange will be faster than your EVGA 980Ti in 40 days time?

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Soldato
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Rollergirl
... It would make sense for nvidia to cash in and market the big cards for the VR market.

No mention of midrange there.

I don't believe that Pascal midrange would offer anything much over a 980Ti so in terms of the VR market, only big Pascal will tempt enthusiasts to open their wallets. Most people who are buying into VR already own the high end Maxwell cards.

The question for nvidia is do they see the new tech as an opportunity to cash in with high end Pascal? Or, do they stick to their usual marketing tactics?
 
Soldato
Joined
30 Nov 2011
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11,358
So why would you want to step up?

16nm is supposed to give a 2x per/watt improvement... even assuming a 1080 is "only" 60% faster than the 980 it replaces, that still places it about 30% faster than a 980ti with everything on stock settings... now you can get about a 25% OC out of a 980ti compared with stock, so it then depends on how well the 1080 overclocks compared with the current cards

If the 1080 is 30% faster than the 980ti then I for one will be selling my other 980ti and getting one 1080, and then upgrading again when the 1080ti comes out... and still end up with a nice chunk o change in pocket
 
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