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** The Official Nvidia GeForce 'Pascal' Thread - for general gossip and discussions **

Caporegime
Joined
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No it was a simple mistake by DM, in fact I think the blame should go to DP for messing up his original post, seeing as DM only quoted what DP posted up. So there you go DP it's all your fault. :D:p:D

What, I haven't edited any post.

Some people are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

No one in the public has physically held final production GPUs based on either Polaris or Pascal and both have obscured/minimalist details.

Nvidia and AMD are just marketing towards different people. Nvidia are more concerned with automotive to win market share in a 100-billion dollar industry. AMD are worried about staying afloat with consumer gaming cards with their dwindling 18% market share They have different priorities and that dictates their different PR exercises at this time.

When its time to release pascal and ramp up sales Nvidia will shout from rooftops. Until that time don't expect anything.
 
Caporegime
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The people who have seen Pascal running are under NDA so there will be no reports. Wait until April announcements.


And no, AMD did not have Polaris chips running on public display at CES. I was at CES and there were absolutely no Polaris chips visible anywhere. AMD did demonstrate to members of the press by invitation a black box running a low powered Polaris GPU.

That is great for AMD and shows AMD is on track but AMD has revealed no more informaion about olris than Nvidia has about Pascal.

This conspiracy theory of yours keeps getting more elaborate.

So all the CES YouTube vids with Polaris running are all faked to keep up the illusion of the lie?

I suppose next your going to tell us you 'may have been' one of those privi to that secret party who were allowed to see a working pascal but are not allowed to confirm because of.......... What?
 
Caporegime
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Again nobody is disputing this and it is not remotely relevant to your claim that AMD and Nvidia have revealed the same level of information on Polaris and Pascal as of this date.



Which is still more than Nvidia did because they have not demonstrated any working samples to the press.



Again with this logical fallacy.

Have AMD demonstrated a working Polaris to the press? YES
Have Nvidia demonstrated a working Pascal to the press? NO

One is a positive and the other is a negative state. So AMD have by that very definition revealed more information about Polaris as of this date than Nvidia have about Pascal. The information available on both may be scant but it is clear to anyone with common sense AMD have revealed more info than Nvidia at this stage.

Again this is not claiming Nvidia are late with Pascal or that Pascal has not been demonstrated to a select few, just pointing out the logical fallacy in your statement.

That is only relevant if you think demonstrating a working ship to the press contains more information than things like performance, power consumption, architecture, features, price, vram, release date, etc.


Sure if you think a small blackbox demonstration is a critical piece of a successful launch then I understand your point fully and I see why people might think that some hoe AMD are ahead. In reality it really doesn't mean much and it is nothing out of the ordinary what NVidia are doing. As is aid above, nvidia and AMD have different priorities right now and their marketing spiel is directed at different people and they will thus go about this in different way.


When its time for Nvidia to launch a Pascal based gaming card then they will make a big announcement, now is simply not the time.
 
Caporegime
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This conspiracy theory of yours keeps getting more elaborate.

So all the CES YouTube vids with Polaris running are all faked to keep up the illusion of the lie?

I suppose next your going to tell us you 'may have been' one of those privi to that secret party who were allowed to see a working pascal but are not allowed to confirm because of.......... What?

Show me a photograph of a real production Poalris chip then.

Where are these chips? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNA6fll2DDQ

I just see a couple of computers setup. Where are the chips to be seen?


And that booth was not open to the public I didn't have access despite an exhibitor pass. I would need a press pass to get in there. It's private suite, not a the public display booths.Exactly as I said.
 
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Caporegime
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AMD didn;t show the public Polaris though, they showed a black box. Nvidia showed a prototype, quite possibly for the same reason. nvidia shared power usage and performance figures to the public.

No they didn't, they stated some performance and power figures combined together for what is two gpus, 4 SOCs, an unknown amount of memory and a made up performance metric, deep learning flops. They exactly nowhere stated what performance Pascal had. They also didn't show Pascal, and they didn't show a running Pascal.

AMD showed a working system with a live power draw of a working Polaris GPU. Stop saying these aren't the same things, numbers free to be shared with the public... are public numbers. Numbers under NDA, are not public.
 
Soldato
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Belfast
Show me a photograph of a real production Poalris chip then.

Where are these chips? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNA6fll2DDQ

I just see a couple of computers setup. Where are the chips to be seen?

Show me a photo of a real production Nvidia Pascal chip. See how that works?

You are setting up more and more strawmen arguments, for example "see no photos of a real production Polaris, ha I was right". Your conspiracy theories that somehow AMD faked Polaris to the press are quite comical now.
 
Caporegime
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That is only relevant if you think demonstrating a working ship to the press contains more information than things like performance, power consumption, architecture, features, price, vram, release date, etc.

AMD demonstrated a chip, which showed the working power, they've spoken a little about the architecture and features.

Nvidia has spoken less about architecture and features, they've not demonstrated a chip, they've not shown power consumption or performance.

Thus AMD has shared more information than Nvidia. Get this straight, you repeatedly state they have shared the same amount of information and now your argument has shifted to how this piece of information is less than a list of lots more information.... which isn't relevant to your statement.

Not sharing every piece of information about Polaris doesn't mean they haven't shared more than Nvidia.
 
Soldato
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DP is quite correct and neither have shown us anything, so whilst DM or DP could be right, until we actually see the chip and know the numbers, it is all pretty much tit for tat.

Not strictly true though. AMD have shown Polaris in a working test to the press, Nvidia have not shown Pascal in a working test to the press. So while we still know next to nothing about both chips we do know slightly more about Polaris as of this date. That is not an equal state by any measure of logic.

This is contrary to D.P's argument that both AMD and Nvidia have revealed the same amount of info. At least we have video proof that working Polaris exists.
 
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Caporegime
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Essex innit!
Not strictly true though. AMD have shown Polaris in a working test to the press, Nvidia have not shown Pascal in a working test to the press. So while we still know next to nothing about both chips we do know slightly more about Polaris as of this date.

This is contrary to D.P's argument that both AMD and Nvidia have revealed the same amount of info. At least we have video proof that working Polaris exists.

Well from what Bru pointed out, they still didn't see the card, so yer. Personally it seems a bit silly to debate what either has/hasn't when neither are going to give out what is what till they are ready to launch. All good for rumors of course and bring them on I say.

Edit:

Arguing over who has shown what and neither has shown anything as far as I am aware is very silly.
 

bru

bru

Soldato
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Well from what Bru pointed out, they still didn't see the card, so yer. Personally it seems a bit silly to debate what either has/hasn't when neither are going to give out what is what till they are ready to launch. All good for rumors of course and bring them on I say.

Edit:

Arguing over who has shown what and neither has shown anything as far as I am aware is very silly.


While I did indeed say that, I did say that I believe what AMD have told us.

So in fact all the press have seen is a closed computer running a demo and an unsoldered card and been told it is the one running the demo. Now I don't for one minute suspect that it wasn't the same card running the demo and I'm sure the power numbers are indeed what AMD say they are
 
Caporegime
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Show me a photograph of a real production Poalris chip then.

Where are these chips? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNA6fll2DDQ

I just see a couple of computers setup. Where are the chips to be seen?


And that booth was not open to the public I didn't have access despite an exhibitor pass. I would need a press pass to get in there. It's private suite, not a the public display booths.Exactly as I said.

As I said. Don't dance around with your wording your saying its a conspiracy.

They had a display of a working GPU which they claimed was Polaris, you agree with that but say it was not Polaris and claim to know that because you were there and can make such a statement because of what unequivocally reasoned fact?

My impression is that of someone clutching at ever increasing elaborate? straws to maintain an argument that fell apart as soon as it was started, go back and read your own posts to see why I think that.

Either what they say is true and it is Polaris or they tell a lie
 
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Caporegime
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As I said. Don't dance around with your wording your saying its a conspiracy.

They had a display of a working GPU which they claimed was Polaris, you agree with that but say it was not Polaris and claim to know that because you were there and can make such a statement because of what unequivocally reasoned fact?

My impression is that of someone clutching at ever increasing elaborate? straws to maintain an argument that fell apart as soon as it was started, go back and read your own posts to see why I think that.

Either what they say is true and it is Polaris or they tell a lie

What the heck are you talking about? Are you on drugs?:confused:

Where did I say the chip wasn't Polaris? Please prove that and quote where I said it or or retract your ridiculous allegation.

You need to sober up before we continue this discussion.
 
Caporegime
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I still don't get what you are going on about. No where did I say AMD weren't demonstrating Polaris, quite the opposite, I repeatedly said they showed Polaris working on a black box to member of the press. Please quote where I have said anything else.

What AMD didn't do was show final production GPUs to members of the pubilic, just like nvidia didnt do.


At this stage all we know is it looks like AMD is on schedule to release at least small Polaris in Q3. That's great. Nvidia are on track to release pascal based solution for auto above on track in Q4. We know absolutely nothing about pascal based GPUs for gamers or large Polaris. There is not a shred of evidence that either are delayed or have production issues,

Too many people erroneously deducting that pascal is delayed because AMD has demoed a working Polaris chip. If AMD could magically sabotage Nvidia's production they would be the richest company on the planet.

In the real world outside conspiracy theory and magic what AMD has or hasn't shown has absolutely zero bearing on Nvidia's production readiness. If we are going to make wild baseless conjectures then I'll say since blind 3-legged dogs can't fly a Boeing 787 and the sky is blue then Nvidia will not be delayed. That is just as meaningful extrapolation as what people are postulating here.

Pascal for gaming may or may not be delayed, no one knows, There isn't any evidence one way or the other.when evidence appears that nvidia are failing to fulfill their compute contracts, or rumors of a necessary re-spin, or Nvidia switching to samsung due to TSMC failure etc. Then we can start debating a possible delay.
 
Caporegime
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What AMD didn't do was show final production GPUs to members of the pubilic, just like nvidia didnt do.

You keep saying stuff like this along with specifically stating neither has given out more information than the other. It's illogical and daft, you're trying to use the fact that neither did one thing as proof they have given the same information.

You may as well say neither AMD nor NVidia have produced a 3nm gpu, thus they have given out the same amount of information... using something they didn't do to attempt to ignore what people are saying AMD have said that Nvidia haven't isn't a sensible argument. You're trying to divert attention which is the absolute proof AMD have given out more information which is what everyone is saying.

At this stage all we know is it looks like AMD is on schedule to release at least small Polaris in Q3.

You made that up, nothing says AMD is going to release small Polaris in Q3, nothing at all. Once again you just state something attempting to not sound negative but using false information. AMD 100% haven't released a schedule for release so you can't in any way claim what you've just said. Every single indication is that small Polaris is within 3 months of launching and that both the small and medium Polaris will be shipping to OEMs by maybe late June at the latest. To be in back to school laptops, OEMs need final gpus shipped in mass 2+ months before the start of that period which is pretty much August in America which is generally the market all companies use as the basis for 'back to school' season.

Nvidia are on track to release pascal based solution for auto above on track in Q4. We know absolutely nothing about pascal based GPUs for gamers or large Polaris. There is not a shred of evidence that either are delayed or have production issues,

No one anywhere has claimed there is evidence of delays or production issues. You're denying a claim no one has made rather than talk about what people have said... deflecting/distracting again. Also we do know about large Polaris, AMD have categorically stated 2 gpus for 2016, therefore large Polaris is 2017... that is hardly nothing.

Too many people erroneously deducting that pascal is delayed because AMD has demoed a working Polaris chip. If AMD could magically sabotage Nvidia's production they would be the richest company on the planet.

More deflecting, no one has claimed a delay for Nvidia, nor has anyone suggested AMD could sabotage Nvidia production. Rather than addressing points actually made, you come up with complete BS then act like you're being sensible by knocking it down.

In the real world outside conspiracy theory and magic what AMD has or hasn't shown has absolutely zero bearing on Nvidia's production readiness. If we are going to make wild baseless conjectures then I'll say since blind 3-legged dogs can't fly a Boeing 787 and the sky is blue then Nvidia will not be delayed. That is just as meaningful extrapolation as what people are postulating here.

Again, all made up, no conspiracy theory, no baseless conjecture about Nvidia being delayed, more complete nonsense from you.

Pascal for gaming may or may not be delayed, no one knows, There isn't any evidence one way or the other.when evidence appears that nvidia are failing to fulfill their compute contracts, or rumors of a necessary re-spin, or Nvidia switching to samsung due to TSMC failure etc. Then we can start debating a possible delay.

Once again, no one has talked about delays except for you.

You do understand right, that saying that TSMC are 3-6 months behind Samsung in production doesn't mean a delay, and it doesn't mean a delay for Nvidia. Can you find anyone in this thread claiming Nvidia have faced delays? Or is your entire rambling nonsensical, conspiracy theory, sabotage post simply because you can't understand that saying Nvidia will bring parts 3-6 months later because TSMC are 3-6 months behind Samsung isn't a delay?
 
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Soldato
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I find it amazing how someone can be so elaborate in their posting with no industrial insight into the current agenda of these things.

One vendor (not necessarily one of the aforementioned) will have guests on record which may clarify a few things in the coming weeks for at least one of these parties. In the meantime some need to learn when to stop talking politics when they have no clue of an accurate timespan or road bumps.
 
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