The Official Prometheus (Alien Prequel) Thread

Soldato
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I will always want to defend this film because of the genre but it doesn't bode too well when you see the advert for the DVD/Bluray and it shows alternate beginning and ending - like it suggests we know it wasn't great but look at the really good stuff we took out!!!
 
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All I recall was Vickers' statement in the briefing that she hired some of the crew personally.

Given her stated unbelief in the point of the project, you might assume that she wasn't too choosy when picking her crew members.

(And in Aliens, it could be read either that the Company underestimated the threat, or all along had no intention to rescue the colonists, or something in between)

yeah thats all thats said really, vickers is basically saying hello, i just took it to affirm her position in relation to the rest of the crew.
 
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Overconfident and cocky in the same way millburn is overconfident and cocky when it comes to the snake? or a different way. Anyway, surprisingly no one has picked up on my mistake, it isnt mentioned that the marines in aliens are the best of the best, its not even mentioned why they were chosen at all. In the same way that the scientists in prometheous arent the best of the best, or the best of their generation or whatever, there is no mention in the film as to why they are chosen, do you think the greatest minds of a generation would sign up to years in deep space when they havent even been told what they are going for? seems unlikely. Weyland simply refers to them as his employees, and fifield makes it clear he's only there for the money.

If you can suspend your disbelief to that degree then good for you. Prometheus is certainly a movie that demands that of the viewer to be enjoyed.

Millburn was not being overconfident. He was acting in a way that would be totally retarded for a middle-school student, yet alone a qualified scientist of any level!

The Marines in Aliens were chosen because they're Marines. Their job was to shoot stuff if needed. The whole point was that they thought they were the best of the best, and their overconfidence was a key element of the story. In Prometheus it is implied that the crew are - at the very least - competent. The fact they turn out to be bungling clowns was a result of the poor scrip/direction and not intentional.

In short, the characters in Alien and Aliens never acted out of character. In Prometheus they constantly led to me scratching my head.
 
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Overconfident and cocky in the same way millburn is overconfident and cocky when it comes to the snake? or a different way. Anyway, surprisingly no one has picked up on my mistake, it isnt mentioned that the marines in aliens are the best of the best, its not even mentioned why they were chosen at all. In the same way that the scientists in prometheous arent the best of the best, or the best of their generation or whatever, there is no mention in the film as to why they are chosen, do you think the greatest minds of a generation would sign up to years in deep space when they havent even been told what they are going for? seems unlikely. Weyland simply refers to them as his employees, and fifield makes it clear he's only there for the money.

Your confusion lies in the fact that Aliens is an action film, which means that exposition on the marines' purpose isn't exactly required; we're not supposed to empathise with them, just Ripley, Newt and the marine dude who lives. The other marines are just cannon fodder, their stories don't need fleshed out.

Prometheus is a horror film, and we're gifted little bits of exposition on every character as the film progresses, such as the fact they have one of the world's best geologists and so on. We're told this in order to amplify the threat to humanity as a whole in the film (it doesn't matter if you're smart or dumb; the engineers want you dead, so be scared cause they're gonna be merciless and so on), but we can't relate to them because they act in such stupid ways. Granted, many horror films carry the same trait, but most horror films don't go out of their way to divulge that sort of character building only to simply annihilate it through baffling stupidity.
 
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I have no clue what the idea is behind the gang of muppets they send in Prometheus, don't really care either.

But as far as Aliens go, it's always seemed very clear to me that the marines sent were the best at what they do. To me that was the whole point, here's this team that is used to nothing but going in and wiping the floor with whatever gets in their way, now watch how easily these aliens tear them to shreds. The aliens don't win (ok nearly win) because we sent a bunch of idiots, they win because even when we send a totally badass team of marines, the aliens are that much more badass.
 
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BTW, all those folks saying this isn't in the same universe as Alien/Aliens, what's your source? I've tracked this movie in depth from the first rumours and i've never read anything which implies it's not the same universe/continuity.

IIRC, Scott said Prometheus happens before the events of Alien but it's not a prequel, the ship seen in Alien has been there for thousands of years.
 
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Aliens is the Vietnam war in space. They underestimated the resourcefulness of their enemy, thinking they could rely on technological superiority, and they suffered for it.

interesting take on it. i've always viewed the vietnam war being a car crash due to fighting someone in their own back yard as opposed to thinking you could defeat them with superior firepower but i do like your take on it (even if you weren't being serious) you could look at it as a case of the aliens making the colony their own back yard .
 
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interesting take on it. i've always viewed the vietnam war being a car crash due to fighting someone in their own back yard as opposed to thinking you could defeat them with superior firepower but i do like your take on it (even if you weren't being serious) you could look at it as a case of the aliens making the colony their own back yard .

It's very serious, insofar as Cameron has said that that's where he drew inspiration for Aliens from!
 
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Your confusion lies in the fact that Aliens is an action film, which means that exposition on the marines' purpose isn't exactly required; we're not supposed to empathise with them, just Ripley, Newt and the marine dude who lives. The other marines are just cannon fodder, their stories don't need fleshed out.

Prometheus is a horror film, and we're gifted little bits of exposition on every character as the film progresses, such as the fact they have one of the world's best geologists and so on. We're told this in order to amplify the threat to humanity as a whole in the film (it doesn't matter if you're smart or dumb; the engineers want you dead, so be scared cause they're gonna be merciless and so on), but we can't relate to them because they act in such stupid ways. Granted, many horror films carry the same trait, but most horror films don't go out of their way to divulge that sort of character building only to simply annihilate it through baffling stupidity.

I'm not confused, my opinion is its not a horror, i'm not alone in that opinion if you check imdb's genre listing for Prometheus, its adventure and scifi. Aliens genres are listed as action, adventure, sci-fi and thriller, its only Alien thats listed as horror, and i agree with those genre listings.

As for the worlds best geologist, have you created this? it is never mentioned in the film, he himself downplays his role and importance and chooses to leave when he realises they want to study dead aliens and arent interested in rocks, and he only makes it clear he is there for the money, I too would find his behaviour unusual if he was indeed the worlds greatest geologist, but he wasn't.
 
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Has anyone noticed the resemblance between original Alien mission and Prometheus, in respect to their ship being also so ill equipped with only few flam throwers and nail guns?

In original Alien they also did not have weapons.

Shaw explains this as a scientific mission but hey when you are traveling to unknown world how do you know that what you find there will be friendly?

This is quite a big assumption and very naive.
 
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If you can suspend your disbelief to that degree then good for you. Prometheus is certainly a movie that demands that of the viewer to be enjoyed.

Millburn was not being overconfident. He was acting in a way that would be totally retarded for a middle-school student, yet alone a qualified scientist of any level!

The Marines in Aliens were chosen because they're Marines. Their job was to shoot stuff if needed. The whole point was that they thought they were the best of the best, and their overconfidence was a key element of the story. In Prometheus it is implied that the crew are - at the very least - competent. The fact they turn out to be bungling clowns was a result of the poor scrip/direction and not intentional.

In short, the characters in Alien and Aliens never acted out of character. In Prometheus they constantly led to me scratching my head.

this is where my interpritation differs, based on the conversation vickers has with shaw and holloway in her lifepod, we discover there is a difference of opinion on the missions goals between what shaw and holloway want and what weyland wants. Vickers brings up the issue of funding, its an expensive mission, and you have to remember weylands goals and his issue of time, he also has an android onboard who's iq likely dwarfs anyone else's on board, dont forget his arrogance in this area aswell, he openly tells the crew that david is the closest thing to a son he will ever have, but fails to mention that vickers is his daughter, and he relies entirely upon david for anything of importance.

Based on all of this, it would make sense that the scientific part of the crew was brought on board to help keep shaw and holloway happy, would they have agreed to the mission had they known weylands true goals?, so why would he waste lots of time and money on the best scientists when he has no interest in them and doesnt require them for his goals, he just hasnt got the time for a fully fledged science mission. And to convince good scientists to sign up for a multiyear mission without ever telling them what the goals were, he's either got to dangle a big carrot infront of them, or just go for whoever is willing to take the paycheck, fifield backs this up by saying he's just there for the money.

Weyland would need shaw/holloway on board so ultimatly the rest of the science team was just put together so they would go along with it, it becomes pretty clear they arent needed, which they themselves realise hence leaving the first expedition after fifield gets angry. They are supposed to be bungling idiots, fifields fiery and unfreindly nature plays out with him getting angry and leaving the group, and millburns open and freindly nature, displayed by him trying to befreind fifield, the first thing he does is reach out to shake his hand, whilst fifields holding a bowl of soup and looking rather closed off, yet despite fifields refusal he continues to stick with him, this nature is carried over into his attitude towards the snake, where most people would simply walk away and ignore fifield, he continues to hang around with him, he should walk away from the snake aswell, but choses to try and get close to it, its supposed to be in his nature, and he thinks its mesmerized so gets closer, the deleted scene where they find the smaller eel like creature would have helped here because he isnt afraid of picking it up, and does so without problems, when he finds a bigger version he is confident he can handle it. Ultimatly weylands single mindedness in persuit of his goal and arrogance is the undoing of the mission and it plays out in different ways in the movie and this is one of them.
 
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Soldato
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this is where my interpritation differs...

That's the point though - it's only your interpretation. It could be that you're just assigning meaning where there was none and it was purely down to poor execution from RS. Considering the other areas of the movie that had issues it's hard to be sure. My interpretation is that he just dropped the ball on this one. I think he had a head full of grand ideas and had trouble condensing it all into a coherent film. He spent so much time on the message he fouled up the delivery.
 
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That's the point though - it's only your interpretation. It could be that you're just assigning meaning where there was none and it was purely down to poor execution from RS. Considering the other areas of the movie that had issues it's hard to be sure. My interpretation is that he just dropped the ball on this one. I think he had a head full of grand ideas and had trouble condensing it all into a coherent film. He spent so much time on the message he fouled up the delivery.

indeed thats why i said its my interpretation. I dont agree though that i'm assigning meaning where there was none, my opinion is that is what is meant by the script, and its not just what is said, but its also in the acting, and thats a result of some good writing and some good directing, and thats why i like the film, thats just my interpritation and opinion.
 
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Soldato
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The 'mission' could wait. they spend what, six years to arrive to that point? A trillion dollars, they couldn't have been meant to return home after a day or two.
Sure the old man wanted to meet God and ask for more life, not unlike Roy Batty going to see Eldon Tyrell.
This didn't detract from what could have been going on in the background. The science and money grabbing aspect of the voyage would have been designed to take weeks, they didn't need to rush, they didn't need to throw protocol out of the window.

Its poor writing, and poor directing, they didn't build suspense, it wouldn't have taken longer as you previously suggested, they could have had similar scenes enacted ina slightly different manner and gave more substance to the film.

As for your suggestion of a handpicked team of chaps so that they conflict and don't work well together, it makes no sence whatsoever, for their goal, having the best people aboard would help, you don't need characters to play off one another, as there isn't an endgame involving things breaking apart and disaster. Its not like 'The Company' when they sent people to recover aliens. There could be no such agenda, as they didn't have any idea of the bioweapons capable of creation by the engineers.

You might interpret it as you like but it plays out like a director and scriptwriter couldn't link their ideas together, and were not smart enough to leave sufficient clues for people to work out where it should go next, or what questions actually remain to be answered, all we are left with is a mess that could have been magnicifant.

Worried regarding bladerunner sequel. I love that world.
 
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In a Geordie Big Brother voice:

"Day 26 and Dr Shaw is finally allowed outside after 25 consecutive days of environmental tests, now she has to follow health and safety executive order 223 regarding entering a building of alien origin"

Pretty damn boring film.
 
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