The ongoing Elon Twitter saga: "insert demographic" melts down

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visibleman said:
If it honestly doesn't affect you nor do you truly care, why would you reply with something that is clearly a provocation? Why would you not just saying nothing, or at the very best give an "Ok", and move on with your life?
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It was a retort to someone else's off the cuff "provocation".

In the WIDER topic of this thread and why I kept trying to steer it that way despite constant baiting, as people questioned a widely* accepted truth of biological sex, I posed the the following challenge- why some information that is "open to interpretation" is accepted wholly or with nonchalance, but so vociferous in crying misinformation about other information that is also "open to interpretation"? Most of this stuff doesn't affect us directly, yet it's almost a sport for some to pick up on every questionable opinion or report in this thread based on who said it. What does affect all of us, is language and it's meaning, and that is why it is an "obsession" for some.

*I admit that manipulation of the makeup of humans in future could lead closer to transhumanism, but that's way beyond the current capabilities and is a science-fiction vision of future and doesn't change what is now.

That subject brought up (not by me I should add) is not for debate in GD, instead go to this thread in Speakers Corner.

Maccy said:
Yup keep it on topic guys
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Upon realising I had disturbed the echo chamber. I made efforts.

Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
BBC saying its the driver monitoring thats got flaws
IE the bit that checks your still basically paying attention and not leaving the car to "auto pilot"
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Which begs the question - if these have been assessed by independent testing* and met minimum safety levels to be allowed on roads, is it solely Tesla's fault? I know it's their fault for not getting it right, but that's why something shouldn't be allowed to be sold and used until going through layers and layers of safety testing by independent parties.

This is new and not going to be 100% perfect. That's the realistic aspect of all this.

*that happens, right?!
 
Fubsy said:
Which begs the question - if these have been assessed by independent testing* and met minimum safety levels to be allowed on roads, is it solely Tesla's fault? I know it's their fault for not getting it right, but that's why something shouldn't be allowed to be sold and used until going through layers and layers of safety testing by independent parties.

This is new and not going to be 100% perfect. That's the realistic aspect of all this.

*that happens, right?!
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I am not 100% sure, especially in regards the US
I am fairly sure for the UK (but by no means an expert) that these safety type systems are not tested unless they are mandated as required.

Eg testing for say airbags is there, but testing for lane guidance isn't.

Happy to be corrected but thats my understanding.

Certainly I know Tesla make changes to how these systems work that would make any "sign off" pretty much redundant.
I believe in that regards they are no different to the majority of car manufacturers.
 
Good points.

Software related systems would be pretty difficult to "sign-off" as you say. Although, if something can't be quantified in terms of it's effectiveness and safety (I'm think along the lines of crumple zones, seatbelts, airbags etc) then how can it be deemed OK for use on public roads?

In a way, it's still being 'beta' testing by the people driving these cars. In a quite regulated heavy world, that just seems wrong.
 
Sankari said:
Musk can't understand why advertisers are backing away from his social media platform. It's a mystery!

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As a follow up to this, after reporting this blatant hate speech twitter have finally responded 10 days later (how speedy of them) to basically say this post does not break any rules and will remain. Very interesting that this is how Twitter choses to run itself. I guess the recent Bloomsberg article of advertising revenue being so low is rather accurate then. I wonder why.
 
Fubsy said:
Good points.

Software related systems would be pretty difficult to "sign-off" as you say. Although, if something can't be quantified in terms of it's effectiveness and safety (I'm think along the lines of crumple zones, seatbelts, airbags etc) then how can it be deemed OK for use on public roads?

In a way, it's still being 'beta' testing by the people driving these cars. In a quite regulated heavy world, that just seems wrong.
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I think the physical crumple zones, seatbelts etc are all tested (NCAP in UK). (there could be an element of self certification here). Because they are mandated.
I think the thing being discussed here, the "alert driver" test, is to avoid having to certify these aids as fit for purpose. The get out right now is the driver should be still in control in effect so if it all goes wrong its not Teslas fault.
 
VincentHanna said:
Is it still considered a recall if they can push a software update to fix it?

That does tie in to what that German engineer said about autopilot not being fit for purpose

www.bbc.co.uk

Ex-Tesla employee casts doubt on car safety

A whistleblower believes the self-driving vehicle technology is not safe enough for public roads.
www.bbc.co.uk
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I think it is still labelled a recall because they haven't come up with a different term for fixing a dangerous fault over the air instead of at the dealership, Musk is desperate for them to pick a new term in the hope that it won't sound as bad for example 'all Tesla's require a software update to fix self driving problems' doesn't sound anything like as bad as 'all Teslas recalled to fix self driving problems' probably because people associate software updates with windows patches and iOS/Android upgrades not car faults that might kill you.

Reading round a little the issue isn't as bad as some outlets are making out but it is still pretty embarrassing!
 
a1ex2001 said:
I think it is still labelled a recall because they haven't come up with a different term for fixing a dangerous fault over the air instead of at the dealership, Musk is desperate for them to pick a new term in the hope that it won't sound as bad for example 'all Tesla's require a software update to fix self driving problems' doesn't sound anything like as bad as 'all Teslas recalled to fix self driving problems' probably because people associate software updates with windows patches and iOS/Android upgrades not car faults that might kill you.

Reading round a little the issue isn't as bad as some outlets are making out but it is still pretty embarrassing!
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Well if he's gonna call it auto pilot when it's not, then he can live with 'recall' vs 'update'.
 
Most cars should be recalled if we're classing the quality of the driver as an important part of their safety :p

I include myself in that.
 
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and just in time to lol at that Grok post.

"you're like a tesla on autopilot. You think you're going places, but you're just a danger to everyone around you" lol
 
"his goal is to make the world a better place"... For himself.

In the mean time, a few billion goes a long wya to solve the water issue he guaranteed he'd fix. And world hunger wasn't it? I don't think a penny materialised. At least he donates to charities rather than his secret own set up charity that gives him great tax relief...
 
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