Caporegime
Incredible to think how far self driving has come in the past 12 - 18 months.
Wonder where we'll be in another 12-18 months.
Wonder where we'll be in another 12-18 months.
The Tesla Thread
- Thread starter wildest_jjk
- Start date
Don
This is my perfect driving world to be honest. Sit back and relax when driving for business or on the commute / school run. Take control and drive when I'm driving for pleasure.
That first statement Glaucus is a very interesting point indeed.
One death from a computer controlled car is disastrous as you "expect" a computer to perform a task perfectly each and every time, so when it goes wrong it's like saying it wasnt fit for purpose in the first place, ban ban ban!
But... the same logic is not applied to humans, mistakes happen and lapses in concentration happen, why is there such a different distinction between human and computer when it comes to mistakes? Is it because we like looking after our own asses too much?
So , is that the way around it, to gather enough evidence to eventually give a different mindset to the whole computer vs human argument thing? If 10 humans crash and debilitate themselves but the tesla can prove that 9 out of 10 were preventable who or what makes that decision in the end to give control over to the car?
Exciting times non the less, mindset changes can take generations so it could be a slow transition till it becomes the normal way of thinking that a computer could have done a better job (at driving) , after all non of us wants to die to prevent the death of another if we think there is a tiniest possibility of preventing our own deaths no matter how small the chance or the benefit to the other person.
One death from a computer controlled car is disastrous as you "expect" a computer to perform a task perfectly each and every time, so when it goes wrong it's like saying it wasnt fit for purpose in the first place, ban ban ban!
But... the same logic is not applied to humans, mistakes happen and lapses in concentration happen, why is there such a different distinction between human and computer when it comes to mistakes? Is it because we like looking after our own asses too much?
So , is that the way around it, to gather enough evidence to eventually give a different mindset to the whole computer vs human argument thing? If 10 humans crash and debilitate themselves but the tesla can prove that 9 out of 10 were preventable who or what makes that decision in the end to give control over to the car?
Exciting times non the less, mindset changes can take generations so it could be a slow transition till it becomes the normal way of thinking that a computer could have done a better job (at driving) , after all non of us wants to die to prevent the death of another if we think there is a tiniest possibility of preventing our own deaths no matter how small the chance or the benefit to the other person.
Caporegime
Hopefully this one will be built properly and they will design a good looking dash. Very interesting car for 40k.
Man of Honour
It does look weird, but it is a good idea. I wouldn't be surprised if half a dozen generations from now a more refined version of it is normal and the idea of manually refueling a car sounds a little bit weird to people. Something like how we see using gas mantles for lighting or taking a battery to a shop to have it refilled with acid. Those things sound a bit weird today, but I know people for whom that was normal when they were children.
The pace of change in living memory has been fast. My mother remembers television being new and a bit weird. Moving pictures at home? What an odd thing. Her parents were the first people in the street to have a television (to see the Queen's coronation) and people came round to see it because it was such a novelty.
I'm currently reading a series of books set in London in 1882. In one of them, the main character visits a very wealthy gentleman's mansion and it's lit entirely with electric lights. She comes from a relatively wealthy family and has seen a couple of demonstrations of electric lighting before, but never on such a scale. An entire house lit with hundreds of Swan incandescent globes. What a remarkable thing! The owner makes an event of it, with his coachman turning on the lights from the gate, brilliantly illuminating the driveway and the exterior of the house. It's a weird and very impressive thing to guests.
That's hstorically authentic. Only 134 years ago and electric lighting was a weird new thing for very wealthy people to amaze their guests with. 137 years ago and it simply didn't exist.
That is really impressive (and scary for some reason, might be the music).
The main car manufacturers must be way behind right now. I thought Tesla's goals were 10-20 years away but it looks like its only a few years before it is proven in the real world and adopted.
Very impressive, the big boys really need to up their game.
Though I am surprised that their is not more talk about electric cars on this forums being a tech forum and all. There's a few really good cars on the market now like the S, X, i3 and Leaf. Them with cars like the new Zoe, Model 3 and Bolt just round the corner things are moving on really quickly.
Though I am surprised that their is not more talk about electric cars on this forums being a tech forum and all. There's a few really good cars on the market now like the S, X, i3 and Leaf. Them with cars like the new Zoe, Model 3 and Bolt just round the corner things are moving on really quickly.
Man of Honour
There aren't any really good electric cars on the market when all factors are considered. EVs are becoming fashionable, so they're widely given the benefit of very selective consideration. Despite the recent advances in EVs, ICEVs are still far ahead of EVs in cost and practicality even with the widespread use of state power to reduce and mask the difference by giving EVs a lot of preferential treatment.
EVs aren't fundamentally new tech. Cars? Not new. Electric motors? Not new. Batteries? Not new. There isn't much attraction of novelty in tech inherent in EVs. Self-driving cars are new tech, but that's not part of EVs. An ICEV could be made with an autopilot in exactly the same way as an EV - the autopilot is not dependent on the type of engine in the car.
So the only thing that can really appeal with EVs is environmental considerations and that's not something that is automatically interesting to people who are interested in new computer hardware in particular and new tech in general.
Quite a few people here are conservative and thus generally opposed to the use of state power to impose change by using taxation as a political tool.
There are fundamental problems with EVs that are widely ignored in promoting them. We need a lot more batteries. We need much lighter batteries. We need a lot more electricity generating capacity. We need better electricity distribution. We need far better electricity storage. We need a massive infrastructure of battery swapping stations because of the inherent limits of battery capacity and charging rate.
These don't seem to be insurmountable problems, but they are being ignored in the uncritical promotion of EVs.
Also, the EV evangelists are doing a good job of putting people off EVs.
The rate of improvement in EVs has been dramatic recently, mainly driven by Tesla. When the Model S was first talked about, many people (including me) thought it would be vapourware, but Tesla delivered pretty much what they said they would pretty much when they said they would. But it's still much worse than much cheaper ICEVs apart from the party piece of EVs - far better low-end acceleration than comparably powerful ICEVs.
Ig you order now they are saying mid 2018. But I would expect delays.
As for change by taxation, you have any idea what oil industry get in such things, far more than EV's, renewables etc. Its just not as visible.
We don't need more power generation (well we do but not in the way you are saying) national grid themself that a million EV's would actually help the grid, after that then you need to start changing stuff massively.
As for change by taxation, you have any idea what oil industry get in such things, far more than EV's, renewables etc. Its just not as visible.
We don't need more power generation (well we do but not in the way you are saying) national grid themself that a million EV's would actually help the grid, after that then you need to start changing stuff massively.
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EVs have progressed more in the last 5 years than they have in the last century, and manufacturing is only getting ore and more efficient. Give it another 20 years and the only place you'll find an ICE car for sale is second hand. EVs are here to stay and will only get cheaper / more accessible / more practical / less fiery / quicker charging / etc over time. What we're witnessing here isn't a fad or a gimmick which is going to fizz out, this is the future and if the current rate of advancement is anything to go by, I think it's a very exciting time to be alive.
As long as my car plays the Circus theme to alert pedestrians. Or a screaming chainsaw.
I've stuck a deposit on 2 earlier this year. Hoping to make a few quid lol.
extremely bad move imo, as they're hopping to fulfil the orders quickly. Even if that doesn't happen, cant see anyone pay above price list.
with tesla you never know when the car will be updated. its not a yearly release like most other companies, as soon as tesla see an improvement and they can produce it, they do and fit it.
although iirc the 1000 is fully refundable atm.
with tesla you never know when the car will be updated. its not a yearly release like most other companies, as soon as tesla see an improvement and they can produce it, they do and fit it.
although iirc the 1000 is fully refundable atm.
Man of Honour
Hoping your wrong tbh. If people are pre ordering into 2018 then one popping up on auto trader over list will surely attract a buyer. Happens with other cars all the time. There will be people who didn't preorder one at all and if the reviews are good will want one immediately who won't want o wait either. It's also the cheapest tesla too so will be more demand I reckon. If they go on sale at 35k territory I can see it selling for 40k.
If it does go pear shaped the wife can drive one of them lol.
I know someone has pre ordered six!
seeing as they aren't starting delivery till end of 2017, its not a long waiting list, this assumes they increase production to actually achieve it.
also over 400,000 have pre ordered, how many extra do you think are about wo want it and are desperate. its a refundable 1000 afterall.
also over 400,000 have pre ordered, how many extra do you think are about wo want it and are desperate. its a refundable 1000 afterall.
Soldato
Given that the majority of orders have been speculative (like yourself, and your acquaintance), can you not see a huge number hitting the market early doors?