Took a "Blobeye" Impreza STI PPP out today

EddScott · 18 Oct 2010 at 15:50

merlin said:
Dyno figures are often contested,

Theres a real doosy of an argument on Scoobynet right now over RR figures. A lad made 382BHP with a VF35 turbo - same one as Scoobydoo69 I believe. Usually about 330 - 350 at a push.

Huge argument - although a graph has been stuck in the thread.

Fett · 18 Oct 2010 at 15:57

MikeHiow said:
I noticed the Prodrive exhaust and asked if it had the full PPP power pack. They said yes, there is a certificate saying so in amongst the paperwork somewhere.

If you want a certified STi PPP to "probably" run 260bhp, swap the ecu, exhaust and fuel pump back to stock, then it's definite. With 95, I'd guess at a bit of timing pull with a bit of loss, to drop 40bhp seems pretty extreme. But, if it was indeed that bad, then you can safely say that that your Focus felt faster than a crippled STi.

ScoobyDoo69 said:
In my personal experience PPP cars are not as fast as they should be. Definitely not 300bhp quick.

For what it's worth, I've had my STi as a standard PPP, PPP with full exhaust, and now remapped. When the exhaust was changed the car was night and day different. All IMHO of course.

I went a slightly different route, but if your PPP car was less than 285bhp and jumped to 330bhp with just the exhaust swap, considering the Prodrive exhaust already breathes better than the stock, that seems a big jump. What exhaust have you got?

Dangerous Dave · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:05

merlin said:
Correct - assuming of course your Focus can beat these times: -

http://www.prodrive.com/up/03MY STi PPP.pdf

Drivers Republic timing of a remapped ST along with a standard ST and RS Focus timings. STI PPP is quicker to 100 aswell as over a second quicker over the 1/4 mile going by the Evo timings of a 14.5 1/4 mile but the ST is quite a bit quicker with the runs in each gear. Even the standard STs time are quicker in some cases.

http://themotor.myfastforum.org/sutra253613.php

335i is also included that is fast to 100 through the gears !

ScoobyDoo69 · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:13

Fett,

It's a ported manifold and Harvey Smith up pipe, custom 3" Hayward and scott decat system mated to a 3" Blitz Nur Spec R. At 330bhp it ran 12.9 at the Pod. Which makes sense if 300bhp runs 13.4.

The same exhaust on my WRX made it go 13.2 @ 102!

MikeHiow · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:21

Dangerous Dave said:
Drivers Republic timing of a remapped ST along with a standard ST and RS Focus timings. STI PPP is quicker to 100 aswell as over a second quicker over the 1/4 mile going by the Evo timings of a 14.5 1/4 mile but the ST is quite a bit quicker with the runs in each gear. Even the standard STs time are quicker in some cases.

http://themotor.myfastforum.org/sutra253613.php

335i is also included that is fast to 100 through the gears !

merlin · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:30

Dangerous Dave said:
Drivers Republic timing of a remapped ST along with a standard ST and RS Focus timings. STI PPP is quicker to 100 aswell as over a second quicker over the 1/4 mile going by the Evo timings of a 14.5 1/4 mile but the ST is quite a bit quicker with the runs in each gear. Even the standard STs time are quicker in some cases.

http://themotor.myfastforum.org/sutra253613.php

335i is also included that is fast to 100 through the gears !

Chosing the right gear for the job: -

30-50

Sti quicker 1.9s to 2.1s

50-70

ST quicker 2.3s to 2.6s

80-100

Sti quicker 4.0s to 4.6s

0-100

Sti quicker 12.22s to 14.1s

MikeHiow · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:34

0-* figures are irrelevant as this is down to the 4WD system.

Even when you put the results out like that, its not like these are massive differences, yet I'm told I'm being ridiculous for thinking the ST was faster

Dangerous Dave · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:40

merlin said:
Chosing the right gear for the job: -

30-50

Sti quicker 1.9s to 2.1s

50-70

ST quicker 2.3s to 2.6s

80-100

Sti quicker 4.0s to 4.6s

0-100

Sti quicker 12.22s to 14.1s

Not doubting the STI is quicker but it is close and impressive how flexable the ST is. A rolling start at around 40-50 and there isn't going to be agreat deal in it the ST will pull ahead and the STI then catch up.

Also suprised how quickly the 335i hits 100 never felt that fast when I drove one, remapped that must be close to doing 100 in 10-11 seconds.

Gibbo · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:41

merlin said:
Chosing the right gear for the job: -

Exactly what Merlin said.

I really don't care what my car can do 50-70mph in top gear all out.

I am far more interested in acceleration through the gears, so:-

0-60mph (X 360 - 4.1s) ) (Stang 4.3s if lucky)
30-70mph (X 360 - 3.9s) (Stang 2.75s)
0-100mph (X 360 - 11s) (Stang 9s)
60-100mph (X 360 - 5.8s) (Stang 3.9s)
30-130mph ?? (Stang 10.5s if I remember correctly)
60-130mph ?? (Stang Approx 9s)
1/4mile ?? (Stang 12.6s @ 118mph)

All cars should be measured on the above, its a far truer representation of performance, especially when you move to stuff like 30-130mph, at such a test your Focus ST will be considerably behind a Scoob STI. The Focus has such good in-gear times due to a decent 5 pot torquey engine and a low pressure turbo that spools quickly. But as an all out performance car through the gears its not the fastest as 0-100mph test shows and well I dunno about anyone else but when Im going for it, I am all out through the gears.

The times above in brackets are from my X 360 and Mustang, all measured with a Vbox, not a stopwatch!

Fett · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:43

ScoobyDoo69 said:
Fett,

It's a ported manifold and Harvey Smith up pipe, custom 3" Hayward and scott decat system mated to a 3" Blitz Nur Spec R. At 330bhp it ran 12.9 at the Pod. Which makes sense if 300bhp runs 13.4.

The same exhaust on my WRX made it go 13.2 @ 102!

Very nice. I still think that ~50bhp from that seems a lot. I don't doubt your 330bhp btw, but I'd guess your starting point was more than 280bhp.

I'm suprised you didn't remap after a decat, no issues with boost spike?

MikeHiow · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:44

When we're talking about small fractions of a second in gear between the ST and the PPP STi, then I don't really see it being 'considerably behind' - the only way that it is going to be considerably behind is if it was from a standing start.

Gibbo · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:47

MikeHiow said:
When we're talking about small fractions of a second in gear between the ST and the PPP STi, then I don't really see it being 'considerably behind' - the only way that it is going to be considerably behind is if it was from a standing start.

Yes and no. Standing start yep Scooby is gone.

On a roll it would be close, but someone on here once said that if a car is say 1s quicker to 100mph, thats about the same as two bus lengths. Now I'd say thats quite far behind. 2s and its quite a big gap.

merlin · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:48

Certainly a tuned ST is no slouch - but at least this settles the argument the Sti is the quicker car in a straight line. Also seems to show that for some weird reason the Sti has the lungs at higher speed than the ST - now that I find odd as the ST has the bigger lump and let's face it the Sti is about as aerodynamic as a block of flats, maybe there's something to be said for having a big fat turbo - yes there's the lag but there's payback eventually at the top end.

Gibbo · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:51

merlin said:
Certainly a tuned ST is no slouch - but at least this settles the argument the Sti is the quicker car in a straight line. Also seems to show that for some weird reason the Sti has the lungs at higher speed than the ST - now that I find odd as the ST has the bigger lump and let's face it the Sti is about as aerodynamic as a block of flats, maybe there's something to be said for having a big fat turbo - yes there's the lag but there's payback eventually at the top end.

Yeah when its top end there is normally no replacement for displacement. I found that quite shocking with the EVO, it will pull to 160 relatively easily, which for a 2.0l is damn impressive, so turbo clearly helps.

Still give me a V8 though.

merlin · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:51

Gibbo said:
Standing start yep Scooby is gone.

Tell him about what happens in the twisties - go on you know you want to.

ScoobyDoo69 · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:57

Fett said:
Very nice. I still think that ~50bhp from that seems a lot. I don't doubt your 330bhp btw, but I'd guess your starting point was more than 280bhp.

I'm suprised you didn't remap after a decat, no issues with boost spike?

I think it's just one of those good cars. Running 370+ from the VF35 at the moment.

It did boost spike, but no more than the standard Prodrive map. Only ever went as high as 1.3bar, and then dropped down and held to about 1 bar. Took me nearly two years to get it mapped and it was fine

ScoobyDoo69 · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:57

merlin said:
Tell him about what happens in the twisties - go on you know you want to.

mmmmm twisties

MikeHiow · 18 Oct 2010 at 16:57

Gibbo said:
Yeah when its top end there is normally no replacement for displacement. I found that quite shocking with the EVO, it will pull to 160 relatively easily, which for a 2.0l is damn impressive, so turbo clearly helps.

Still give me a V8 though.

This is contradictory, as the ST has a 2.5L engine.

The difference is almost certainly down to the Turbo - the ST when tuned does not hold that extra boost that well for lengths of time, so at higher speeds/longer gears boost tails off.

merlin · 18 Oct 2010 at 17:01

MikeHiow said:
This is contradictory, as the ST has a 2.5L engine.

The difference is almost certainly down to the Turbo - the ST when tuned does not hold that extra boost that well for lengths of time, so at higher speeds/longer gears boost tails off.

He said there's NORMALLY no replacement for displacement, there's no contradiction there. You would expect the ST to be quicker being 2.5 (the blob-eye is only 2.0) but the ST's turbo is a touch on the small side. Swings/roundabouts - the ST won't come with the Sti's lag but it'll suffer at higher speeds/rpm's not having that shove.

Gibbo · 18 Oct 2010 at 17:04

merlin said:
He said there's NORMALLY no replacement for displacement, there's no contradiction there. You would expect the ST to be quicker being 2.5 (the blob-eye is only 2.0) but the ST's turbo is a touch on the small side. Swings/roundabouts - the ST won't come with the Sti's lag but it'll suffer at higher speeds/rpm's not having that shove.

What he said!

Also the twisties.