Trading the stockmarket (NO Referrals)
- Thread starter mcast123
- Start date
I had some GWP shares way back in 2005, i knew they would come good when they finally got approval. However I got tired of waiting and eventually sold them for a minuscule profit.
Reckon GWP could be a takeover target from one of the big drug players, might take a punt on them.
Could use some advice... A month ago I spent around £1500 on some shares in Tesla motors (TSLA). Since then they've lost almost £180 in value (bought at 177$, currently around 160$). I was planning this to be a long term investment, but I'm seeing more and more reports saying to sell and that the value could reach a low of 120$ (I bought at 177$).
Get out of dodge and take my losses or stick around?
Get out of dodge and take my losses or stick around?
I almost got in a month ago but hesitated. Some reports said they'd be the next big car giants. Others said that by the time they actually get manufacturing big scale the other car giants would have their own offerings.
My personal feeling is the tesla boat has sailed share wise. i hope i'm proved wrong because while I wont invest I do like them as a company.
Soldato
The guy behind it setup Paypal as well apparently. He says himself of the value it is very complimentary and one day he hopes to make it totally justified, ie. he believes the company worth will reflect it in its earnings.
Apple did it of course, they were bid up ahead of actual earnings.
http://stocktwits.com/symbol/TWTR?q=twtr
Go there and theres a lot of comments, links from big down to small players on share value + Fundamentals for USA shares
Apple did it of course, they were bid up ahead of actual earnings.
http://stocktwits.com/symbol/TWTR?q=twtr
Go there and theres a lot of comments, links from big down to small players on share value + Fundamentals for USA shares
Actual accuracy of these is down to personal judgement but its a lot better then what we get on iii
They do already, Nissan leaf? Does Tesla do it better, are they ahead of the curve
Soldato
That's exactly why I'll spread bet it; Merlin's in the public high and there's momentum for it.
Yes you have, just not the group name
. Madame Tussaud's, Warwick Castle, Thorpe Park etc: www.merlinentertainments.bizTa. Do you know when it goes public as that's when it will be available to spread bet?
Never done spread betting. Dunno if I have the bottle for it.
At least with actual buys you can't loose more than you put in
Tbh I don't fully understand the whole thing.
From what I gather you don't make/loose anything until it goes beyond a range.
Is there some weighting? Ie RM was very likely to go up after float. So would it have to go up a lot to make anything and down a smaller amount?
It's a bit too gambly for me I feel. If something drops through the floor can't you be left in the do do if you haven't got the capital to back it up?
At least with actual buys you can't loose more than you put in
Tbh I don't fully understand the whole thing.
From what I gather you don't make/loose anything until it goes beyond a range.
Is there some weighting? Ie RM was very likely to go up after float. So would it have to go up a lot to make anything and down a smaller amount?
It's a bit too gambly for me I feel. If something drops through the floor can't you be left in the do do if you haven't got the capital to back it up?
You should have a stop loss order for that. If one doesn't put stop loss then there's a margin call, only for spread betting they won't call you to increase your deposits to satisfy margin requirement, they will simply close your position at a loss.
It is gambling or to be pedantic it's speculation. Big risks big rewards.
Soldato
The only reason it's 'riskier' than traditional share dealing is a) if you don't understand leverage and b) you don't understand how it works. So pretty much the same as share dealing!
Most people think incorrectly, like you have, that there are odds or weighting involved, which there aren't, which is why it's great. It's also great because you can also sell and profit on a stock going down, unlike share dealing.
Yes, you need enough money in your account to prevent the trade from automatically closing but you don't need a lot. For example I'm just staking £1 or £2 on Royal Mail. I only have £300 in my account atm and it would need to pretty much go into administration (-300 points) to wipe itself out.
RMG as an example:
Bid is the sell price (541.45), Ask is the buy price (543.55) and the spread is the difference. So if I stake £1 @ 543.55 I'll be instantly down -£2.10 (ie if I was to sell at the current price), so it would need to swing at least 2.10 points to level out and then the rest is profit @ £1 a point. You can close your position at any time so long as the market is open.
It's only really risky once you start doing large stakes and at the moment for me it's small gains. I've only made £50 off RMG so far by buying low, selling high, repeat, etc, but then that's 20% of my investment so far more than an ISA or savings account.
If you'd done a £1 stake when they IPO'd @ 330p then you'd be up £210, whilst risking a maximum of £330 (ie if the stock dropped to 0p). £2 stake = £420, £3 stake = £630... and you can start to see how the big whales rake it in with £1,000 stakes. If you'd done a £750 stake instead of buying £750 worth of shares then you'd be up £157,500. But you'd have been risking £247,500 (but then how likely was it drop any more than 100 points, or 75k?).
I find it far more interesting than share dealing!
Most people think incorrectly, like you have, that there are odds or weighting involved, which there aren't, which is why it's great. It's also great because you can also sell and profit on a stock going down, unlike share dealing.
Yes, you need enough money in your account to prevent the trade from automatically closing but you don't need a lot. For example I'm just staking £1 or £2 on Royal Mail. I only have £300 in my account atm and it would need to pretty much go into administration (-300 points) to wipe itself out.
RMG as an example:
Bid is the sell price (541.45), Ask is the buy price (543.55) and the spread is the difference. So if I stake £1 @ 543.55 I'll be instantly down -£2.10 (ie if I was to sell at the current price), so it would need to swing at least 2.10 points to level out and then the rest is profit @ £1 a point. You can close your position at any time so long as the market is open.
It's only really risky once you start doing large stakes and at the moment for me it's small gains. I've only made £50 off RMG so far by buying low, selling high, repeat, etc, but then that's 20% of my investment so far more than an ISA or savings account.
If you'd done a £1 stake when they IPO'd @ 330p then you'd be up £210, whilst risking a maximum of £330 (ie if the stock dropped to 0p). £2 stake = £420, £3 stake = £630... and you can start to see how the big whales rake it in with £1,000 stakes. If you'd done a £750 stake instead of buying £750 worth of shares then you'd be up £157,500. But you'd have been risking £247,500 (but then how likely was it drop any more than 100 points, or 75k?).
I find it far more interesting than share dealing!
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I'll have to have a proper look this weekend
I've chosen dealing atm with the following in mind
Cash isa, savings are not worth anything buy guaranteed pretty much
Dealing is half way, you risk what you have, but if sensible (buying into big companies in hard times) you rarely come off worse than savings in savings accounts
Spread betting is another step up, and yes the rewards look eyewatering.
It's the twitter flotation that has my eye, but for now I don't know if Idare rrisk a bet. Royal mail I would say was safer than twitter for a rise
Oh, and that is probably the best explanation I have seen
So assume merlin ipos at 330
If you were to buy at the buy price (somewhere over 330) every penny over the buy price you gain whatever unit you bid (bid 1£ then you gain 1£) and if company went bust you loose 330 ish pounds?
I've chosen dealing atm with the following in mind
Cash isa, savings are not worth anything buy guaranteed pretty much
Dealing is half way, you risk what you have, but if sensible (buying into big companies in hard times) you rarely come off worse than savings in savings accounts
Spread betting is another step up, and yes the rewards look eyewatering.
It's the twitter flotation that has my eye, but for now I don't know if Idare rrisk a bet. Royal mail I would say was safer than twitter for a rise
Oh, and that is probably the best explanation I have seen
So assume merlin ipos at 330
If you were to buy at the buy price (somewhere over 330) every penny over the buy price you gain whatever unit you bid (bid 1£ then you gain 1£) and if company went bust you loose 330 ish pounds?
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Soldato
Yes, correct re: Merlin.
If you're interested then buy this: www.amazon.co.uk/Naked-Traders-Guide-Spread-Betting/dp/1906659230. Only £6 on Kindle so about the same as a stock trade. Its the only book I've ever read on it (plus I've read his Share Dealing one).
The biggest bonus of spread betting is selling. For example a share may have gone from 100p to 200p in a year. Great, double your money in normal trading. But in that time it will have fluctuated every day to get there and you can profit from every dip and every rise with spread betting.
If you're interested then buy this: www.amazon.co.uk/Naked-Traders-Guide-Spread-Betting/dp/1906659230. Only £6 on Kindle so about the same as a stock trade. Its the only book I've ever read on it (plus I've read his Share Dealing one).
The biggest bonus of spread betting is selling. For example a share may have gone from 100p to 200p in a year. Great, double your money in normal trading. But in that time it will have fluctuated every day to get there and you can profit from every dip and every rise with spread betting.
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The vast majority of people will lose money attempting this sort of directional trading and to do so via spread betting is relatively (and often deceptively) expensive . That's not to say there aren't potential uses for spread betting (though the ability to short is hardly a unique aspect) - in a few circumstances it may make sense... Someone wanting to look into short term trading seriously ought to perhaps be prepared to do a lot more reading, look at non directional approaches, aim to minimise transaction costs and use a broker/clearer providing direct access to the main venue(s) (exchanges, ECNs) for whatever you want to trade.
Most people would likely be better off forgetting about it altogether and simply building up a portfolio of long term investments in decent stocks if they want to be actively involved in the markets.
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Do you guys all have funds and trusts in your S&S's ISA's as well then ? which ones do you have ? i am aiming to have £500 in 10 different ones to add diversification and then stocks outside that
ATM i have
Aberdeen Property Share Fund
Accumulation Shares
Artemis Strategic Assets
Retail Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Jupiter Strategic Bond
Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Marlborough Multi Cap Income
Retail GBP Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Edinburgh Investment Trust plc
Ordinary 25p Shares
ATM i have
Aberdeen Property Share Fund
Accumulation Shares
Artemis Strategic Assets
Retail Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Jupiter Strategic Bond
Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Marlborough Multi Cap Income
Retail GBP Accumulation Wealth 150 fund
Edinburgh Investment Trust plc
Ordinary 25p Shares
Soldato
I've got some Edinburgh IT shares in my S&S ISA. Some question about what happens with Neil Woodford managing it with him leaving Invesco (eg this)
Soldato
Best to ask a professional of some kind, phone up HL maybe. Personally I thought FB should be $11 but last July at $22 it was a buy apparently.
Now its thought to be worth more then Disney, dont they make a lot from owning marvel
So I dont expect Medusa to recover till after its new shares are all floated. Thats usually how it goes, the graph looks really poor so unless gold goes up a lot my guess is not much upside :/
250m market cap (today) 100m turnover and 50m profits or 7 PE apparently, sounds good in theory but not plain sailing
The PE is Shareholders funds (m) divided by profits I guess
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shareholdersequity.asp
Just so long as you realise £1 of Apple is about £50,000 and its in pounds not dollars if a bet (the shares obviously would be dollars and subject to exchange rates, bets are simpler)
RMG traded the grey market so I'd guess the same
http://www.stockchallenge.co.uk/ for November is coming. I might just enter all these new IPO shares to see how bad/good that turns out on paper
Not every IPO turns up. I did the SL ipo and it was a bit of a wash out, mostly a loss at first as market turned down but they did go up next year and after a lot of trouble in 08/09 they up about 50% this year.
Always they paid good dividends so always a good share imo, RMG appears similar not sure if the rest will do so well
Now its thought to be worth more then Disney, dont they make a lot from owning marvel
250m market cap (today) 100m turnover and 50m profits or 7 PE apparently, sounds good in theory but not plain sailing
The PE is Shareholders funds (m) divided by profits I guess
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shareholdersequity.asp
Every penny on the share is a pound because you bet £1. Or another way is to say £1 is 100 shares which makes its totally not any more risk then buying shares.
Just so long as you realise £1 of Apple is about £50,000 and its in pounds not dollars if a bet (the shares obviously would be dollars and subject to exchange rates, bets are simpler)
I dont know if any of those places are especially popular, profitable, innovative or likely to grow so not an IPO for me as I basically I have no idea if they are worth it.Yes you have, just not the group name
Ta. Do you know when it goes public as that's when it will be available to spread bet?
RMG traded the grey market so I'd guess the same
http://www.stockchallenge.co.uk/ for November is coming. I might just enter all these new IPO shares to see how bad/good that turns out on paper
Not every IPO turns up. I did the SL ipo and it was a bit of a wash out, mostly a loss at first as market turned down but they did go up next year and after a lot of trouble in 08/09 they up about 50% this year.
Always they paid good dividends so always a good share imo, RMG appears similar not sure if the rest will do so well
Soldato
I haven't looked at detailed figures yet either but I do need to. I know of all/most of their places though and from general knowledge they are very popular. Due to the nature of the business they're also intrinsicly linked to land value in a similar way to Tesco (but on a smaller scale) and I also think their business model is good for the type of business they are: relatively expensive days out but always 50% offers via cereals, newspapers etc. Advertising, faux-deals and impulse visiting all in one. I would imagine they've done pretty well over the last 2 or 3 years as well with people opting to holiday in the UK or day out generally as opposed to travelling abroad but again, need to actually look at any figures they have.