Ubisoft - How much longer can they get away with this 'downgrading'?

Safetytrousers said:
Maybe Rockstar are, but they didn't for at least the first trailer for the PC version of GTAV:


The experience of the game visuals is markedly different to that.
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Eh?

The graphics of the final game (in single player) are exactly the same as that trailer :confused:

It might be perceived as looking better due to all the fancy camera angles/work but the textures, shadows, weather effects etc. etc. are all exactly the same as the final game in single player mode.
 
Nemeses said:
correct if I'm wrong, but to play those games you would have to download and use their platform, so no, they have used every chance they had with me.


Er right :) So all the people who don't and won't play Ubisoft games have a problem, sad.
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What's the problem with that? Most online games use there own platform and the UBI platform is seamless and hidden in the background you barely even see it. Double click on the division game from steam and it loads up. No extra clicks, no big uplay loading up, I don't even see the UBI platform although it does make use of UBI servers as its an online co op game. You can install and uninstall as much as you like.
 
Nexus18 said:
"Every" game developer/publisher does not do this. As I pointed out earlier, ones, which do not show misleading trailers:

- rockstar
- rocksteady
- bethesada
- blizzard
- DICE/EA

.
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Except, four of your god-like status developers actually DO. Rocksteady,quite literally sold us a completely broken game. If thats not a downgrade then what is? Fallout 4 looked a lot better months before its release ,EA did that trick with Fifa a few years ago and Rockstar downgraded the graphics over a few patches on consoles to add more stuff.

Add those to the list with Forza,Halo,FF,Dark souls and MGS and most companies have done it. TBH I cant even see what the problem is? Watch a trailer, if you like it then judge if its worth buying by looking at it on release.
 
oldestgregg said:
Except, four of your god-like status developers actually DO. Rocksteady,quite literally sold us a completely broken game. If thats not a downgrade then what is? Fallout 4 looked a lot better months before its release ,EA did that trick with Fifa a few years ago and Rockstar downgraded the graphics over a few patches on consoles to add more stuff.

Add those to the list with Forza,Halo,FF,Dark souls and MGS and most companies have done it. TBH I cant even see what the problem is? Watch a trailer, if you like it then judge if its worth buying by looking at it on release.
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Rocksteady - I presume you are referring to batman arkham knight? Certain graphic features were missing for the PC on release day but that was quickly addressed, it was a bug/mistake, the graphic effects weren't "purposely" removed. The game looked as good as what they had shown in trailers once the ambient occlusion and rain drop effects were added back in.

Yes the game was extremely broken on release and it got destroyed by PC reviewers/gamers for good reason but there is a difference between broken releases and falsely advertising features/graphics in a trailer with no disclaimer notice, which said company know will change for the final release given their history of doing said act. Also, I believe all the trailers for batman arkham knight were shown on the PS 4, not the PC so technically they never give us any idea on what the PC version would be like... (not that it makes much difference as all platforms look more or less the same for that game)

EDIT:

Just to make it clear, I am not saying that releasing a broken game is better than releasing a downgraded game that works very well... Give me stability and great optimisation over a game with great graphics but a buggy POS any day of the week. This thread is about false advertising with features and graphics.


Fallout 4 - e3 gameplay videos look just as good as what we got in the final game. Happy to be proven otherwise with screenshots or/and video comparisons though?


Not followed fifa so no idea about it. Although is this not using the frostbite engine? Curious to see how much it was downgraded, got any links? Tried googling but I can't see anything???


Didn't follow GTA 5 for the consoles so again no idea if that is true or not. IIRC, a patch broke the anisotropic filtering setting for the PC (which afaik, still isn't fixed) so maybe this also happened to consoles as well? This is fixed by forcing the setting via nvidia/AMD control panel (I always force this anyway as generally a lot of the time, the in game anisotropic filtering setting doesn't work or it does a very poor job)


EDIT:


Just had a quick google for gta 5 "downgrade" and rockstar released a statement on it:

Question: After updating to Title Update 1.08 on PS4 and Xbox One, there appears to be a deterioration of graphical quality. Is Rockstar investigating this issue?

Answer: We are aware of some graphical issues on the Xbox One and PS4 versions of GTAV after the most recent Title Update, and we are investigating a fix now. If you would like to receive an automatic email notification as soon as there is more information, please log into the Support Site and click Subscribe at the top of this page.
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Yup it isn't a problem for us who wait for release day, reviews, feedback etc. but it is the principle of it and as the guy who works for ubisoft said:

I do share this in the hope’s that my colleagues and publishers and a lot of people who make false promises and do demonstrations which wrongfully create too much hype that they cannot deliver on ultimately stop doing such things. I want to see the industry actually move forward and not be so full of itself by promising too much and delivering too little.
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Pottsey said:
No idea but the steam forums and main Division forums are full of posts and I never managed to get it work myself but not tried it in the latest patch. Unless I missed a fix its still broken.
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Works for me. I've never heard about AO doing what you described. I remember the problems HBAO caused around patch 1.2 but that was graphical corruption everywhere, very different problem and was worked around by just using AO ultra instead (which most people preferred anyway)

iEBMw7g.gif


I dont know. mountain out of a mole hill anyway if all you had to do was drop a setting to fix it.
 
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Nexus18 said:
Eh?

The graphics of the final game (in single player) are exactly the same as that trailer :confused:

It might be perceived as looking better due to all the fancy camera angles/work but the textures, shadows, weather effects etc. etc. are all exactly the same as the final game in single player mode.
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The trailer makes the movement look smoother than it is. I have never noticed bullets falling to the ground in the same way as depicted in the trailer. The graphics in the trailer look smoother than I have seen them as in gameplay. Did you notice the expressions on Trevor's face during play when exiting the bank as shown in the trailer? (that doesn't actually exist in the game!) Perhaps I don't play on the right settings but the trailer has a sheen that the game doesn't. The trailer provides no real idea of gameplay.
I also remember a PC trailer where roads are crammed full of traffic in a way that does not happen in the game.
I played GTAV on PS3, and absorbed every bit of info about the PC version before it came out on PC and I don't feel Rockstar made it clear what the PC graphics would be like before it was released.
I'm not complaining about the game or the trailer, but the trailer tarts presentation up in a manner that does not reflect actual gameplay. This is what trailers do.

Now I know the Ghost Recon did have gameplay footage a long time ago, which the game does not now look like, but gameplay in such a situation I presume is tarted up like a trailer. Such a thing gets my hopes up, but from so far out I have no expectation that it will be carried through.
We've all probably seen the Death Stranding videos. Hope is high but I also have no expectation that the game is going to be marvelous and live up to those graphics.

Nobody has to pre-order a game. Video games are not going to run out of stock on Steam. You see exactly what a game is like on the day it is released, if not before.

Vienetta's still don't look they do on the box they're in.
 
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Nexus18 said:
Fallout 4 - e3 gameplay videos look just as good as what we got in the final game. Happy to be proven otherwise with screenshots or/and video comparisons though?
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I don't think there was any official release of general gameplay footage before F4 was released.
And I also don't think the trailer misleads about graphical quality.
 
Would you buy a car because someone told you before hand this is how it looks and this is how it will drive, so preorder now to 'get your place in line'.

Would you then be annoyed if the car you got wasn't the car they advertised?

Do you watch film trailers then go and see the film and realise that that wasn't an actual trailer, that was just a promotional trailer from 3 months before and the actual film doesn't look as good as the trailers?

Are you annoyed because you didn't get to see what was advertised?

Do you take your other half out for dinner and when you get served a meal that isn't as described you eat it anyway because between the time they told what it was and the time they cooked it, it changed?

Gaming is one of very few industries that this seems to be allowed in, its disgusting and not only has it managed to hook me on a couple of occasions but its continuous and rampant. Ubisoft themselves aren't the only culprits however they are repeat offenders.

Preorders 10-15 years ago made sense, there were physical limitations with quantities of disks but these days the instant I see pre order I also see 'This is ****, we need you to buy it before everyone finds out'.
 
Safetytrousers said:
The trailer makes the movement look smoother than it is. I have never noticed bullets falling to the ground in the same way as depicted in the trailer. The graphics in the trailer look smoother than I have seen them as in gameplay. Did you notice the expressions on Trevor's face during play when exiting the bank as shown in the trailer? Perhaps I don't play on the right settings but the trailer has a sheen that the game doesn't. The trailer provides no real idea of gameplay.
I also remember a PC trailer where roads are crammed full of traffic in a way that does not happen in the game.
I played GTAV on PS3, and absorbed every bit of info about the PC version before it came out on PC and I don't feel Rockstar made it clear what the PC graphics would be like before it was released.
I'm not complaining about the game or the trailer, but the trailer tarts presentation up in a manner that does not reflect actual gameplay. This is what trailers do.
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That is because they used the in game recorder which allows you to shoot scenes like that, the graphics don't change, you can add more blur and depth of field effects to make the video more dramatic but it doesn't improve textures etc.

There was no need to show pure gameplay footage as they had already done that to death for the last gen consoles, for the PC (and even the new gen consoles) trailers, it was all about showing of the improvements to the graphics, the gameplay didn't change so why show footage that everyone has already seen? PC and Xbox one/PS 4 gamers just wanted to see the improved graphics. Anyone can produce similar cinematic trailers like that with the final game and built in recording feature. Check YouTube for those cinematic videos from end users.

In single player, the roads are very packed to the point you crash a lot more often than what you would in multiplayer as the amount of traffic is significantly reduced for it and if you really wanted, you can up the traffic by changing a line or 2 in the config files.

What about the facial expressions? It is like that in the single player too. The main characters are actors in motion capture suits. EDIT: I have no idea if that particular facial animation was removed or not given that you don't ev

Rock star have not shown any trailers where the graphics are signficantly better than what the final game was, they have not shown any features which aren't present in the final game either.

I'm pretty sure that there was a comparison video or/and article showing the graphic improvements for the PC/next gen consoles.

Watch the videos I posted previously for ubi games and you will see a clear difference between the trailers and final version.

Give me rock stars cinematic/artistic trailers over ubi's fake gameplay footage any day of the week.

Safetytrousers said:
I don't think there was any official release of general gameplay footage before F4 was released.
And I also don't think the trailer misleads about graphical quality.
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Check YouTube, there are various gameplay trailers for FO 4 before release.
 
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james.miller said:
Works for me. I've never heard about AO doing what you described. I remember the problems HBAO caused around patch 1.2 but that was graphical corruption everywhere, very different problem and was worked around by just using AO ultra instead (which most people preferred anyway)


I dont know. mountain out of a mole hill anyway if all you had to do was drop a setting to fix it.
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Looks like I missed a fix. It didn’t work for me from release throughout patch 1.4. Like a lot of people I had 70% darkness everywhere with missing light sources and graphics effects. I guess it got fixed late 1.4 or patch 1.5. I am glad they fixed it but it was a pretty drastic change and downgrade in graphics which is what this whole thread is about.
 
Pottsey said:
Looks like I missed a fix. It didn’t work for me from release throughout patch 1.4. Like a lot of people I had 70% darkness everywhere with missing light sources and graphics effects. I guess it got fixed late 1.4 or patch 1.5. I am glad they fixed it but it was a pretty drastic change and downgrade in graphics which is what this whole thread is about.
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No, it isnt. This thread is about e3 trailers creating unrealistic expectations of the final game. You're talking about a feature being broken after the game was released (and not broken for most people i'd add - nobody else here seemed to know it was even a problem) causing display issues, one which had a simple work around (by using AO ultra which looks better anyway)

If it's a pretty drastic difference then i'm not seeing it. HBAO is pretty comparable to AO Ultra but most people prefer the later. Did you realise that gif i posted had 3 frames? AO off, AO Ultra and HBAO. The only drastic difference is when you switch AO off.

Either way, it's not what the OP is talking about.

Nexus18 said:
That is because they used the in game recorder which allows you to shoot scenes like that, the graphics don't change, you can add more blur and depth of field effects to make the video more dramatic but it doesn't improve textures etc.
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So it's ok to create cinematic trailers and add motion blur and effects because it's using the game engine, even though it never looks like that ingame, but it's not ok to show effects which ultimately for whatever the reason get left out of the final game?

Is there even a difference? Rather than trawling through old videos trying to find disclaimer text that you know wont be there, why cant you just treat these e3 vids as not being representative of the final product just like that gta5 trailer wasnt? It'd be much easier, you know...
 
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Ryan0r said:
Again, no-one is being lied to.

Choosing to believe what they're selling two years before release is your own fault, otherwise accept that what you get shown is almost certainly going to change. Many people know and accept this.
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Perhaps 'lie' in the traditional sense is a bit strong. 'Misinformative' is perhaps more appropriate. I totally see your point, games are IMMEASURABLY complex things to develop. It should be taken as red that very few games will look and feel as we perceived they might have done through gameplay trailers etc. But there ARE cases of devs flat out lying. Sim City being unable to run without DRM software, features in No Mans Sky (though again, could probably be filed under simply 'misleading'), the entirety of Colonial Marines. In fact, just take anything Randy Pitchford says with a pinch of salt.

Like I said, on reflection I'm more on your side. But there are definitely instances of developers lying, regardless of how few and far between they might actually be.
 
Pottsey said:
Do you realise some of those great games like The Division are not produced by UBI only sold by UBI. Why would you miss out on great fun games just because they are sold by UBI? That doesn't make any sense to me as that's like saying you wont buy or play a great game because its sold on Steam. UBI don't have anything to do with producing the game in question.
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The Division is developed by Ubisoft.
 
ubisoft are not getting away with anything, you have a choice, dont buy their games, also not every game can be ground breaking or push the visual envelope.
 
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