Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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StriderX said:
Whilst it undoubtedly makes him worse it at least makes him a known quantity versus Putin's constant lies about his and his country's behaviour.
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Prigozhin is, if anything, less known for honesty than Putin. But I don't see Prigozhin neatly capturing the Russian state even if he wins, he doesn't have the connections. Either he'll get rapidly deposed, or we'll see a spiralling series of infighting/rebellion events as he struggles to control a vast and varied country.

And while the utter collapse of Russia would be a fitting epitaph to Putin, it's going to lead to decades of bloodshed and strife if it happens.
 
Mr Jack said:
Prigozhin is, if anything, less known for honesty than Putin. But I don't see Prigozhin neatly capturing the Russian state even if he wins, he doesn't have the connections. Either he'll get rapidly deposed, or we'll see a spiralling series of infighting/rebellion events as he struggles to control a vast and varied country.

And while the utter collapse of Russia would be a fitting epitaph to Putin, it's going to lead to decades of bloodshed and strife if it happens.
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Well that's the cost of apathy, perhaps Russians should have a word with themselves about why this keeps happening to them.
 
ltron said:
You're right to be worried, I want Putin and his circle to fall as much as anyone, but Prigozhin is almost undoubtedly worse. He is a torturer and a war criminal.
Still, it's nice to see Putin get his comeuppance for inflicting all this death, destruction and misery on people.
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Putin has way more blood on his hands.
 
Hook said:
Putin has way more blood on his hands.
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Not directly, anyway give Prigozhin that power and I shudder to think what he'd do with it. These people are both very evil individuals.

I wish one of these places would turn into a beacon of freedom and democracy for once.
 
StriderX said:
Well that's the cost of apathy, perhaps Russians should have a word with themselves about why this keeps happening to them.
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It won't just be Russia, though, the USSR left the various 'Stans in a state of frozen conflict. Remove Russia and these countries are going to fall into bloody sectarian warfare. It'll be the Balkans all over again. Regional instability isn't good for anyone.
 
Mr Jack said:
It won't just be Russia, though, the USSR left the various 'Stans in a state of frozen conflict. Remove Russia and these countries are going to fall into bloody sectarian warfare. It'll be the Balkans all over again. Regional instability isn't good for anyone.
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I’m sure China will be ready to roll in and help bring about “stability”.
 
Mr Jack said:
It won't just be Russia, though, the USSR left the various 'Stans in a state of frozen conflict. Remove Russia and these countries are going to fall into bloody sectarian warfare. It'll be the Balkans all over again. Regional instability isn't good for anyone.
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Doesn't mean Russia deserves to exist, this is on them and frankly if the cost is a mess in Asia then that's how it is.

The West should be focused on securing those nuclear weapons at any cost.
 
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There is literally no good options for who should be the next leader of Russia. It's either just as bad, worse or much worse when compared to Putin and Putin is already somewhere between Brezhnev and Stalin in terms of levels of tyranny.

A technocrat like Elvira Nabiullina would probably be the best bet but she doesn't carry enough popular support from the elites, army or FSB.
 
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Participant said:
A very possible outcome of this is that Wagner is crushed and it's as you were by Monday.
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let's say that is true... that is still an experienced fighting force against Ukr off the table. don't forget these are not on the side of Ukraine. they are - or at least many of them are war criminals themselves.. even if Wagner lose its still a massive step for Ukraine.
 
bris said:
Putin cant launch nukes on his own, the Russian system has ten layers to go through, he wont get past the second layer.

Now though its not getting to even the first layer as he has already fled the kremlin, he wont be back their anytime soon if ever.
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I wouldn't bet on that - officially there is a complicated procedure but in reality Putin could bypass that depending on the loyalty of and/or how much those in the chain of command felt compelled.

If his back is to the wall Putin absolutely would attempt to use nuclear weapons in some capacity if he felt it necessary.
 
StriderX said:
Doesn't mean Russia deserves to exist, this is on them and frankly if the cost is a mess in Asia then that's how it is.
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True. But that doesn't there aren't good and bad ways for things to unravel. The ideal would be a reformed Russia joining the family of European nations; but there seems little chance of that.
 
Freddie1980 said:
There is literally no good options for who should be the next leader of Russia. It's either just as bad, worse or much worse when compared to Putin and Putin is already somewhere between Brezhnev and Stalin in terms of levels of tyranny.

A technocrat like Elvira Nabiullina would probably be the best bet but she doesn't carry enough popular support from the elites, army or FSB.
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There is Navalny, but I doubt he will be allowed to assume power unless Putin's whole support structure goes. Navalny is imperfect, but he's a lot better than Putin.
 
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Would he? Do you know him personally?
Rroff said:
I wouldn't bet on that - officially there is a complicated procedure but in reality Putin could bypass that depending on the loyalty of and/or how much those in the chain of command felt compelled.

If his back is to the wall Putin absolutely would attempt to use nuclear weapons in some capacity if he felt it necessary.
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