Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Well maybe but I’m really not sure the US are prepared for another Trump administration. Not to mention that Russia went after the Israel’s and for that Putin will have to pay.
I was listening to Nick Abbot on LBC and the caller from US mentioned that he could not see any adverts with Orange lad. He found it rather odd considering what it was last time.
 
If they are using large numbers of them then it can only be because enemy air defence is out of action atm, otherwise they'd be shot down

I don't think they ever had large numbers of them.
I would guess the reason they basically disappeared is because they were just too easy to target and with small numbers in effect a large loss.
Especially if they wanted to use them for example for breakout cover.
 
Remember when they kept on telling us about how effective the tanks would be on the battlefield? Or how ineffective the Russian defences would be once the counter offensive started? Or that Ukraine would be supported for 'as long as it takes'? Do you still believe NATO would defend every inch of NATO territory?

By the time the Russians get around to invading NATO they will have massively expanded their military industry, learned and honed all the new warfare tricks and probably emboldened Iran and China to help out this time, because the west are proving to be basically unreliable pushovers. When the action inevitably starts, will we have built up military resources just in case? I doubt it.
 
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The West could have done more early on after the collapse of the Soviet Union to try and integrate better with a post soviet Russia. However we continued to hold them at arms length. Quite rightfully so at the time. However with 30+ years of hindsight, we could have possibly had a much friendlier neighbor if we had done things differently.
Except we couldn't.

We did everything we could to try and mend the bridges, we (the west not me personally) sent them food supplies during the disarray of the Soviet collapse so that Russians didn't die due to famine. We bankrolled their space agency so they could finally launch their MiR-2 space station they'd been pottering on since the mid 80s (and we asked if we could bolt some modules on too to make it an "international" station). We joined forces with them militarily to bring about joint peacekeeping operations in former Yugoslavia. We let them open western franchises like McDonalds and Pizza Hut.

And then in 2000 some bloke convinced Yeltsin that if he named him as his successor then he would pardon him for his crimes in office, and everything went to ****.
 
Remember when they kept on telling us about how effective the tanks would be on the battlefield? Or how ineffective the Russian defences would be once the counter offensive started? Or that Ukraine would be supported for 'as long as it takes'? Do you still believe NATO would defend every inch of NATO territory?

By the time the Russians get around to invading NATO they will have massively expanded their military industry, learned and honed all the new warfare tricks and probably emboldened Iran and China to help out this time, because the west are proving to be basically unreliable pushovers. When the action inevitably starts, will we have built up military resources just in case? I doubt it.


That's what nukes are for. Tell Russia attacking nato territory is article 5 and therefore considered attacking America directly so nukes will fly
 
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Remember when they kept on telling us about how effective the tanks would be on the battlefield? Or how ineffective the Russian defences would be once the counter offensive started? Or that Ukraine would be supported for 'as long as it takes'? Do you still believe NATO would defend every inch of NATO territory?

By the time the Russians get around to invading NATO they will have massively expanded their military industry, learned and honed all the new warfare tricks and probably emboldened Iran and China to help out this time, because the west are proving to be basically unreliable pushovers. When the action inevitably starts, will we have built up military resources just in case? I doubt it.

True to a point but nato hasn’t been in open warfare. So please try it..

The concern I do have is nato countries are basically not battle drilled/hardened.

Russia. For all it’s size, is a single top down autocratic organisation. It was shown when Wagnar invaded russia, that the immediate reaction of running away caused the entire apparatus to be paralysed.
 
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This is true, and to make matters even worse they also surrendered their nuclear weapons to Russia (Ukraine being the worlds third, biggest nuclear power at the time), weapons which would have certainly prevented any invasion.

And if that wasn't bad enough it got worse, in the late 00s Joe Biden helped broker a deal with Ukraine intended to court favour with Putin that would see Ukraine destroy all of their Scuds and their ability to build them (pretty sure the possibility of hundreds of warheads raining down on Moscow would have stopped Putin invading too). This is one of the reasons Biden is so solid on helping Ukraine, because at some level he's probably aware it wouldn't be happening if not for his mistake.



This isn't entirely false information in the normal sense but it is intentionally misleading to the point of being misinformation. There was no French version of the memorandum, that's just a translation of the original text. In any case assurer, garantir & affirmer are all valid interpretation of assure (it's is not an exact science). If the Russian and Ukrainian translations of the original English text (the Original was in English as this was primarily an agreement between the USA, Britain and Russia) used words closer in their language to guarantee than assure then that's unfortunate.

As it stands the Memorandum gives signatories legal justification if they take action, but it does not legally force anyone to act.

It's worth noting that the much vaunted NATO Article 5 is similarly designed, it requires all members to provide assistance to an attacked member if they request it but no actual requirement of what that assistance should be (this was a requirement of US membership as they didn't want to be legally obliged to show up to another European war if it didn't involve them).
 
I think we’re close to that now. If the US can’t get Ukraine right their authority is shot. They have a shocking track record since the Iraq war. One **** up after another.

Throw in 4 years of Trump trying to undermine NATO, and potentially another 4 years of the same, I think much of the world are going to be questioning where they want to put their eggs.

Isn't Trump in bed with Russia? To some degree at least.
 
I doubt Biden was the sole reason that deal happened, I would figure some sort of advisory panel was involved and he merely carried it out on their recommendations.

The problem I have is that it may well have not been done in an (incompetent) act of good will to Russia but actually they knew precisely what would happen and needed it to happen to scare Europe back into Uncle Sam's fat embrace.
 
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Isn't Trump in bed with Russia? To some degree at least.
As president Trump had a rather... "strange" relationship with Putin.

It was like he idolised him but also wanted to be seen as dominant over him at the same time.

One minute he'd be changing laws to help Russia sell it's asbestos products in the USA and being so economically helpful you'd think he worked for the Kremlin, the next minute he'd be calling Putin to tell him he was launching a strike on a major Syrian base so he needed to get his people out but if he told Assad it was coming he wouldn't get another warning.

I think the main reason Putin waited until Trump was gone to make his move on Ukraine was that he knew better than to mess with crazy xD
 
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That is roughly how I've seen Trump - he finds the strong man image appealing so somewhat looks up to Putin, like some posters here I feel, but at the same time will always do what he thinks works towards the greater good of Donald Trump - so there is no guarantee he won't oppose Putin either.

I think the relationship is somewhat like those people who tastelessly slap on pretty pieces of jewellery and think that by association it makes them look prettier, and the more they slap on the better. Same with Lukashenko cosying up with Putin they think by extension it increases their strong man image.
 
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That is roughly how I've seen Trump - he finds the strong man image appealing so somewhat looks up to Putin, like some posters here I feel, but at the same time will always do what he thinks works towards the greater good of Donald Trump - so there is no guarantee he won't oppose Putin either.

I think the relationship is somewhat like those people who tastelessly slap on pretty pieces of jewellery and think that by association it makes them look prettier, and the more they slap on the better. Same with Lukashenko cosying up with Putin they think by extension it increases their strong man image.
That doesn't bode well for the future then. It's not just him either, the Trump family are intertwined also.
 
By the time the Russians get around to invading NATO they will have massively expanded their military industry, learned and honed all the new warfare tricks and probably emboldened Iran and China to help out this time, because the west are proving to be basically unreliable pushovers. When the action inevitably starts, will we have built up military resources just in case? I doubt it.

Russia would get completely and utterly pulverised in a conventional war if they tried to invade a NATO country.
 
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