VARcical Decision

Jimbeam3678 said:
At a basic level when the pressure is on people make stupid mistakes. Passengers on a plane panicking has shown they can struggle to open emergency doors. It’s simple but your mind can get overloaded.

In the offiside scenario if there was a process which meant they had to confirm back the original decision and what the final decision should be then this would not have happened. Humans make mistakes, so surely it makes sense to put in place processes to protect your employees from making them.

That’s why I like what Klopp said on match of the day.

As I said I don’t expect people to agree just putting an alternative opinion across.
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And i get that as well, it's easy from the comfort of our own homes to say we'd make the right decision/stop the game. Much harder when you're in the thick of it. But nobody seemed to be willing to put their head above the parapet from that audio, which is worrying
 
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Jimbeam3678 said:
Maybe they were paying attending but looking at previous incident? Who knows?

Sort of covered my thoughts in my reply to Trusty.
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I completely agree with your point about people making mistakes under pressure etc but there are varying degrees of mistake and in all walks of life, in every profession, if you make too many or serious enough mistakes you risk losing your job. If Spurs keeper keeps making mistakes you'll be calling for him to go, you wouldn't be saying he's just human and needs better training.

This mistake in isolation has got to be in the ball park of what's required for an official to lose their job. It might not be nice to hear but when you're working at this level and your decisions could cost clubs quite literally £150m+ then you've got to expect to be held to a high standard.

I'm a pragmatist and accept that sacking him won't help right now though as the alternatives are worse than him but in principle officials should lose or risk losing their spot as PL refs in these instances.
 
BaZ87 said:
The worst thing about that audio is the one guy at Stockley Park that knew what was going on was the tech geek whose only job is to run the system, not the two qualified officials. Nobody can ever argue with a member of this forum saying they could do a better job than VAR ever again - knowing about computers > laws of the game.
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Probably because tech people are logical.
 
PL statement re Saturday:

"It is clear that there were not only human errors but systemic weaknesses in the VAR process. We accept PGMOL’s immediate recommendations to ensure that such failures are not repeated in the future. However, a wider review to seek consistently higher standards of VAR performance will be conducted by the Premier League and PGMOL, supported by other stakeholders, and where necessary further recommended actions will be brought forward and implemented."
 
I’m not having this, can’t do anything nonsense. VARs actual raison d’etre is to inform the referee of clear and obvious errors. They have button which they press which when engaged allows them to speak directly into the refs ear.

so whilst the game is underway, they press the button, tell the ref and at the next break in play, the game is reset to place where the error occurred.

all Darren England had to do is press the button and tell the ref that he had made a clear and obvious error.
 
So one chap says, on field call was offside, are you happy with that and the other is just going yeah, yeah. Is it the on field ref and the ref doing var that are just sounding like they don't care? One chap sounds worried they've messed up, two couldn't care less
 
scarps said:
So one chap says, on field call was offside, are you happy with that and the other is just going yeah, yeah. Is it the on field ref and the ref doing var that are just sounding like they don't care? One chap sounds worried they've messed up, two couldn't care less
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the guy doing the talking about getting the decision wrong is the guy who puts the lines in, the 2 that don't give a **** are the var (england) and avar (cook). Also, wheres Michael Oliver through all this, he says one word 'yeah' and that's it.
 
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C Kent said:
the guy doing the talking about getting the decision wrong is the guy who puts the lines in, the 2 that don't give a **** are the var (england) and avar (cook). Also, wheres Michael Oliver through all this, he says one word 'yeah' and that's it.
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I thought so, only one of them sounded like they knew what they were doing and it wasn't going to be an official. It just a joke, they are just not fit for the job.
 
C Kent said:
the guy doing the talking about getting the decision wrong is the guy who puts the lines in, the 2 that don't give a **** are the var (england) and avar (cook). Also, wheres Michael Oliver through all this, he says one word 'yeah' and that's it.
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Michael Oliver's involvement was a moment of confusion. When the tech guy is saying Oli's saying to delay, England initially confuses him with Michael Oliver and speaks to him, who then replies. However 'Oli' wasn't Michael Oliver but the guy that's in charge of the entire VAR hub at Stockley Park. As I've mentioned a couple of times before, Dale Johnson already explained that they could allow the VAR to stop the game even after the restart, which it turns out they did but England and Cook panicked and then chose not to, despite having authority to do so.
 
BaZ87 said:
Michael Oliver's involvement was a moment of confusion. When the tech guy is saying Oli's saying to delay, England initially confuses him with Michael Oliver and speaks to him, who then replies.
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yes Michael Oliver was the 4th official on Saturday, he doesnt say a thing except 'yeah' when england says 'Oli' (meaning Oli Kohout the guy in the hub ops)
BaZ87 said:
However 'Oli' wasn't Michael Oliver but the guy that's in charge of the entire VAR hub at Stockley Park. As I've mentioned a couple of times before, Dale Johnson already explained that they could allow the VAR to stop the game even after the restart, which it turns out they did but England and Cook panicked and then chose not to, despite having authority to do so.
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Yeah we've been over the game being stopped by England/Cook, apparently neither couldn't do a thing though..
 
Vandle said:
Without VAR the goal wouldn't have been given anyway as the linesman flagged it. I think we are all forgetting that so we should just move on :)
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This is such a nonsense comment because we do have VAR and VAR has already overturned decisions in that very match.
 
Vandle said:
Without VAR the goal wouldn't have been given anyway as the linesman flagged it. I think we are all forgetting that so we should just move on :)
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No point having VAR then is there, its just a shambles. It was bought in so it could correct wrong on field calls and we could spend the weekend talking about the football and not a ref mess up. Well that worked well hasn't it, we just get to talk about the on field mess up and now the off field mess up too
 
C Kent said:
yes Michael Oliver was the 4th official on Saturday, he doesnt say a thing except 'yeah' when england says 'Oli' (meaning Oli Kohout the guy in the hub ops)

Yeah we've been over the game being stopped by England/Cook, apparently neither couldn't do a thing though..
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Could have done the simple, stop game, talk to managers, see what they say and maybe allow Liverpool to score. We've seen it before when someone scores by mistake
 
C Kent said:
yes Michael Oliver was the 4th official on Saturday, he doesnt say a thing except 'yeah' when england says 'Oli' (meaning Oli Kohout the guy in the hub ops)

Yeah we've been over the game being stopped by England/Cook, apparently neither couldn't do a thing though..
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Not quite. The on field officials don't hear everything that is being said by VAR, only when VAR opens the lines to them. When England says "Oli?" he's talking to Michael Oliver, believing that the tech guy meant Michael Oliver is telling them to delay, not Oli Konhout. Michael Oliver wouldn't have heard the rest of the comments and not England calling his name unless England directed the message to him.

And England/Cook could stop the game after the restart because Oli Kohout told them to, this is the point Dale Johnson made in his VAR review. Dale's since said on twitter that Kohout could/should have physically gone into the VAR room to tell them again after they didn't follow his instruction.
 
BaZ87 said:
Michael Oliver's involvement was a moment of confusion. When the tech guy is saying Oli's saying to delay, England initially confuses him with Michael Oliver and speaks to him, who then replies. However 'Oli' wasn't Michael Oliver but the guy that's in charge of the entire VAR hub at Stockley Park. As I've mentioned a couple of times before, Dale Johnson already explained that they could allow the VAR to stop the game even after the restart, which it turns out they did but England and Cook panicked and then chose not to, despite having authority to do so.
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Of course they have the authority to do so… it’s what they’re there for!!!
 
scarps said:
No point having VAR then is there, its just a shambles. It was bought in so it could correct wrong on field calls and we could spend the weekend talking about the football and not a ref mess up. Well that worked well hasn't it, we just get to talk about the on field mess up and now the off field mess up too
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Precisely my point.
 
inogen said:
Of course they have the authority to do so… it’s what they’re there for!!!
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This isn't entirely true though. Current protocol says they cannot go back after the game has been restarted. They could choose to ignore that but they'd be ultimately ignoring protocol. As I said though, the boss at Stockley Park told them to, which removes any excuse of them not doing so.
 
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