Volkswagen cheats emissions tests!

Hades said:
Wait. What? You sold a 6year old car because of a scandal on new cars? Why?
Click to expand...

VW have said that this has been taking place since before the current CEO took office.

THat was 8 years ago. It is very definitely not related to all new cars. Plus if you read jalopnik, the current 2015 VW model stock in the USA is apparently not affected, and its the 2014 model and older thats affected.
 
OracIe said:
As an owner of a 2014 VW Amarok, id be interested to see if I get contacted regarding any kind of recall
Click to expand...

I doubt there will be a recall. What can they actually do to 'fix' it? I assume the only action they could take would be to change the software mapping to reduce emissions by reducing power, or adding some physical device to reduce emissions (again reducing power). If there was actually a proper 'fix' without power reduction then they would have been using it already.

...so who here would allow them to recall your car to reduce the power on it? I wouldn't.
 
Orionaut said:
Now, heres the thing.

1) Is this likely to be an issue for UK owners?
2) If it is and a recall is ordererd, will owners have a LEGAL obligation to have their vehicles re-programmed?

I suspect that any reprogramming to meet running emissions standards will turn the relevent vehicles into absolute slugs!

So.

If you do NOT have a LEGAL obligation to hand the cars back for reprogramming I would advise not doing so! (Indeed, Pre outrage vehicles might actually end up being worth more rather than taking a hit on value)

Hmnn!;)
Click to expand...

I expect that due to VW admitting its on all cars globally, they may be forced to issue whatever modification to all worldwide owners. That would include the UK.

I've speculated what might happen if that modification affects the quoted figures. It may well be that VW can only get around that by saying its voluntarily only and by agreeing to the recall, you agree to the quoted figures being changed.

But will the regulators let them get off with a normal voluntary recall ?

Hades said:
I doubt there will be a recall. What can they actually do to 'fix' it? I assume the only action they could take would be to change the software mapping to reduce emissions by reducing power, or adding some physical device to reduce emissions (again reducing power). If there was actually a proper 'fix' without power reduction then they would have been using it already.

...so who here would allow them to recall your car to reduce the power on it? I wouldn't.
Click to expand...

2 things

1) they could force VW to issue an engine map update that makes the cars run in the "test" mode on the road, thus meaning they meet emissions standards, but at the loss of performance and god knows what else

2) they could force owners to have an adblue system fitted as most other diesels in the US do. But given these systems aren't common in the UK, will that modification be global ?

So many unknowns at the minute.
 
Last edited:
Fr0dders said:
2 things

1) they could force VW to issue an engine map update that makes the cars run in the "test" mode on the road, thus meaning they meet emissions standards, but at the loss of performance and god knows what else

2) they could force owners to have an adblue system fitted as most other diesels in the US do. But given these systems aren't common in the UK, will that modification be global ?

So many unknowns at the minute.
Click to expand...

How could they force owners to fit the system? I can't see any legally enforcable way to do it without amending the MOT test. A very large number of owners didn't even buy their cars from VW.

I don't have a diesel but if I did and a letter landed on my door then I'd just put it in the bin unless there was some legal obligation to do it. I guess VW could be forced to offer significant cash compensation to encourage people to 'upgrade' though. That might work.
 
Tesla said:
You sold it? Did it take a value hit?
Click to expand...

It went for about £500.00 less than I was expecting.

Clarkey said:
Genuinely interested to know why you had to get rid of it quickly after this. This being something which is only really relevant in the USA. If anything, the blanket media coverage must be driving their value down right now, best to wait until everyone has calmed down and forgotten about it I would have thought..
Click to expand...

Like I said, I was going to get rid of it anyway soonish. The values will be getting driven down and car valuations are in part based on desirability and perception. When you have a top London lawyer on Radio 2 basically saying that they would be surprised if anyone wanted a second hand VW Diesel at the moment, one must consider their own situation. Sit on it or get rid.

[TW]Fox;28609346 said:
Why, are you moving to California and importing your personal car?
Click to expand...

No, I expect we will see that this is more of a widespread problem. The car is a 'Bluemotion'. people want them because of fuel economy and emissions. If neither are to be trusted then the whole point of the badge is lost.

Hades said:
Wait. What? You sold a 6year old car because of a scandal on new cars? Why?
Click to expand...

Cars affected are 1.6 to 2.0 diesels cars from 2009 onwards. Mine is a 1.6 from 2009.
 
PapaLazaru said:
Not yet, but it is a risk I did not want to take. I was going to sell it anyway as it is a bag of crap as well. Economy on it is nowhere near their advertised figures.
Click to expand...

I don't think you actually took much of a hit. It depends on hiw good your rxpectations were.

The used car market for older cars will likely be immune.

After all, they are generally worse than cars released today in terms of emissions and economy. People don't care as long as it passes the MOT.
 
Hades said:
Yes. And? How do you think it will affect it?
Click to expand...

Basic economics really. Let's say they find out some UK or EU cars are affected. Regardless of whether mine was, the fact that it is a VW diesel will no doubt affect the resale price as they will have become less desirable. VW diesels are now tainted. If other people who own them also decide to sell them, the market could become flooded with them which will in turn lower the value. Supply and demand.

Like I said, I was going to sell it at some point soonish anyway so it makes sense to me to get rid of it now in case this all blows up. The software was added from 2009 onwards and my car was built during that year, so I do not think it was a silly decision to let it go now rather than in 6 months time when we will know more about what has happened.
 
What does the USA do with regards to testing emissions for diesels? Any owners confirm?

In the UK I gather the petrol gets the proper check on exhaust emissions however I believe after talking to an MOT tester other month a diesel is just a 'smoke test'. If it smokes visibly, blast it up road to clear fumes out of exhaust, retest and it passes....

I remember thinking at the time - that is a shocking way to 'test' a car for something so 'important' as emissions which contribute to 'global warming'. I've put words in ' ' to emphasise the importance supposedly but the complete absence of any intelligence....

I've never had a diesel other than an escort 10 years ago so don't know how things have changed since the tax thing. I'm assuming they go by the emissions when plugged in etc on test cars etc which is why this is an issue.
 
PapaLazaru said:
Basic economics really. Let's say they find out some UK or EU cars are affected. Regardless of whether mine was, the fact that it is a VW diesel will no doubt affect the resale price as they will have become less desirable. VW diesels are now tainted. If other people who own them also decide to sell them, the market could become flooded with them which will in turn lower the value. Supply and demand.

Like I said, I was going to sell it at some point soonish anyway so it makes sense to me to get rid of it now in case this all blows up. The software was added from 2009 onwards and my car was built during that year, so I do not think it was a silly decision to let it go now rather than in 6 months time when we will know more about what has happened.
Click to expand...

Have you gone for a petrol Civic?
 
Galaxy said:
That's not true. Nitrous oxides do cause global warming. But you're probably talking about NOx.. Dealing with NOx in modern diesels by treating with urea/ammonia (e.g. AdBlue) actually creates CO2 as the product, which we all know does contribute to global warming. Back to square one?

Any retrofit solution using urea could potentially increase the CO2 emissions.. and impact tax bands etc.
Click to expand...
Urea is still better than egr related to fuel economy penalties.

Yes was talking bout NOx
 
Antony101 said:
If the recall was mandatory and the car loses power due to it surely you have some legal right to a refund?
Click to expand...

This is the bit I've been thinking about most lately.


Will VW be told to fix this? I think it's likely they will. Recalling the cars in itself is not a killer, they will beat Toyota's record of around 9 million though. It rides on what they actually have to do to the cars. I don't think they can do anything with the urea tank, I think they can produce a map that cleans them up using only EGR at a sacrifice of economy/power. I think we will see some people looking for and probably getting partial compensation. This probably isn't going to sink VAG. I know they've got the AUDI oil consumption thing on the go too, but SONY have been leaping from lawsuit to lawsuit for ages now and they seem pretty ok.

I wonder if we will see cars with big adblue tanks soon? It's just a convinced thing now, right?
 
BigglesPiP said:
This is the bit I've been thinking about most lately.


Will VW be told to fix this? I think it's likely they will. Recalling the cars in itself is not a killer, they will beat Toyota's record of around 9 million though. It rides on what they actually have to do to the cars. I don't think they can do anything with the urea tank, I think they can produce a map that cleans them up using only EGR at a sacrifice of economy/power. I think we will see some people looking for and probably getting partial compensation. This probably isn't going to sink VAG. I know they've got the AUDI oil consumption thing on the go too, but SONY have been leaping from lawsuit to lawsuit for ages now and they seem pretty ok.

I wonder if we will see cars with big adblue tanks soon? It's just a convinced thing now, right?
Click to expand...

A more active EGR valve will reduce power at points, but at WOT the EGR valve is shut anyway, so I can't see it hurting peak power figures.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom