Warhammer 40k: Space Marine

nero120 · 8 Sep 2011 at 11:50

iv-tecman said:
Well, what makes you think I'm a big fan of gears of war? Or even own an Xbox360 to actually play it?

I played the demo as PSN had it on there, didn't think much to it and agreed with another poster, its just not a game for me and I did state warhammer fans should like it - just not a game i'd see myself playing..

What is wrong with that?

If your not a gears of war fan then why would lack of a cover system surprise you? It's not exactly widely implemented on other shooters is it?

The fact of the matter is that Relic made this game for fans of 40k. They didn't dumb it down or implement genre standard features to appeal to the masses. I have no issues with the graphics at all, what the hell do people want... this isn't a £1k pc we're talking about! The game (appears to) do exactly what is says on the tin, plus with free dlc coming I couldn't praise Relic more, especially considering the fact that they are an RTS house.

iv-tecman · 8 Sep 2011 at 11:56

nero120 said:
If your not a gears of war fan then why would lack of a cover system surprise you? It's not exactly widely implemented on other shooters is it?

The fact of the matter is that Relic made this game for fans of 40k. They didn't dumb it down or implement genre standard features to appeal to the masses. I have no issues with the graphics at all, what the hell do people want... this isn't a £1k pc we're talking about! The game (appears to) do exactly what is says on the tin, plus with free dlc coming I couldn't praise Relic more, especially considering the fact that they are an RTS house.

Killzone and uncharted use a cover system... And you've hit the nail on the head. It is for 40K fans, I've said this now twice in my replies to this thread. I'm not a huge 40K fan, I tried the demo and taking out the cover system, the graphics when compared to other shooters aren't that good IMO. On the same systems I might add. Killzone 2, Killzone 3 and uncharted look nice on a sub £250 PS3 games console, however yes agree - good graphics a decent game does not make.

Anyhow, enjoy the game.... Others will as well. Sorry if you've been offended by my thoughts on the demo...

pioneer2000 · 8 Sep 2011 at 13:22

Silly choice to not implement cover in a W40k game to be fair. Would have been far better suited to give it more of a gears / ghost recon feel.

Also, why do dev's always not take advantage of the w40k material... it's always just orks / chaos... could have easily incorporated the eldar, tyranids, imperial guard, tau etc etc and would only have served to improve the game.

nero120 · 8 Sep 2011 at 13:27

iv-tecman said:
Killzone and uncharted use a cover system... And you've hit the nail on the head. It is for 40K fans, I've said this now twice in my replies to this thread. I'm not a huge 40K fan, I tried the demo and taking out the cover system, the graphics when compared to other shooters aren't that good IMO. On the same systems I might add. Killzone 2, Killzone 3 and uncharted look nice on a sub £250 PS3 games console, however yes agree - good graphics a decent game does not make.

Anyhow, enjoy the game.... Others will as well. Sorry if you've been offended by my thoughts on the demo...

Would you say this doesn't have good graphics? I think you're mental if not personally, the graphics are great and the locations look incredible. Perhaps not as good as Uncharted but who cares?

Not offended at all, buy the game or not I couldn't care less, but at least have an open mind about it.

nero120 · 8 Sep 2011 at 13:29

pioneer2000 said:
Silly choice to not implement cover in a W40k game to be fair. Would have been far better suited to give it more of a gears / ghost recon feel.

Also, why do dev's always not take advantage of the w40k material... it's always just orks / chaos... could have easily incorporated the eldar, tyranids, imperial guard, tau etc etc and would only have served to improve the game.

Always? How many 40k games have there been and how many have just used orks and chaos? Plus this game does have imperial guard if you'd been bothered to check, plus DoW had Eldar and Tyranids. Come to think of it, you must be mental, I don't even know why I'm bothering to reply...

Crizzy · 8 Sep 2011 at 13:49

This guy seems to be enjoying it, hilarious

pioneer2000 · 8 Sep 2011 at 14:38

nero120 said:
Always? How many 40k games have there been and how many have just used orks and chaos? Plus this game does have imperial guard if you'd been bothered to check, plus DoW had Eldar and Tyranids. Come to think of it, you must be mental, I don't even know why I'm bothering to reply...

Are you one of the developers or something? You're defending it like it's your baby!

Recently, the only notable W40K games have been the dawn of war series... which did benefit from having multiple races involved once the money-grabbing expansions hit.

Space marine just stinks of lazyness - the imperial guard are barely present, and then we have a few types of orks / gretchin with voices pulled straight from DOW. Then re-skinned space marines for chaos. They could have easily made the game a world spanning epic with all the races fully featured (and perhaps playable) but instead they've scraped out the bare minimum. The AI is simply set to "stand still and shoot repeatedly from range" or "charge at the player until he spams attack enough to kill us".

Add in graphics that are barely at a GOW 2 level and it all starts to feel a bit shoddy.

To focus on DOW briefly... they took the lazy option of removing practically all story from the expansions (lazy!) and until the expansions hit (probably what they are planning with space marine...) only featured space marines, orks, chaos and eldar.

nero120 · 8 Sep 2011 at 14:59

pioneer2000 said:
Are you one of the developers or something? You're defending it like it's your baby!

Defending it? No. What is irritating is all the "Where's the cover system/photo realistic graphics/tau/tyranids/space wolves/power gloves/storm shields/tomb kings/every other obscure aspect of the games workshop universe" crap that people keep spouting. Those arguments are on par with "Game is crap because ultramarines are boring"... right.

The game is not rubbish just because it does not have these things. This is the first proper 40k first person action game in decades and to expect every aspect represented is simply foolish. If you're going to criticise the game, I have no problem with that, but try to make it a little more thoughtful than "wot no tau????"...

Zeroecho99 · 8 Sep 2011 at 15:33

I'd just like to add that my copy is sat waiting at home for me ready for tonight!

I was dubious after initially playing the demo but gave it some more time plus I'm a total 40k nut and it was too good to pass up.

I don't believe they need a cover system in this game as it's just not in the Space Marine ethos to take cover so in that respect THQ have stayed true to the 40k universe.

I would love to see all the various races implemented in the game but let's face it this is the initial release and if all goes well there's bound to be a sequel where they will introduce others like the Tau, Nids, etc.

For the Emperor!

Stewy · 8 Sep 2011 at 16:10

Bolters are not machine guns though!

/rage.

Richdog · 8 Sep 2011 at 16:24

Zeroecho99 said:
I don't believe they need a cover system in this game as it's just not in the Space Marine ethos to take cover so in that respect THQ have stayed true to the 40k universe.

Of course it is in the SM's ethos to take cover when necessary... they are battle-hardened veterans and master strategists who have survived hindreds of battles, not hare-brained idiots who run headfirst into the biggest gun pointed at them, most of which can turn them to a bloody pulp in an instant.

The lack of cover mechanic is a Relic/game decision only, not something set in fluff. And its a game mechanic made all the more ridiculous by having to park yourself behing boxes to regenerate health, which kills the pace of a battle, unlike taking cover ehich keeps you in the thick of it and is about 10x more realistic.

pioneer2000 · 8 Sep 2011 at 16:45

Exactly - it would work so much better if cover had been implemented. Poor show relic, poor show!

iv-tecman · 8 Sep 2011 at 16:54

Pleased some agree with the no cover ethos being a tad erm questionable. The graphics are, sadly sub par to what I’ve seen in past PS3 games, or even 360 titles. I’ve seen worse, ok I admit but they aren’t anything to really go to someone and say ‘hey look at this, awesome eye candy’ like I have with uncharted 2 or Killzone 3.

The lack of cover isn’t realistic. Call of Duty has a way to cover when under intense fire, nearly all games I’ve played has some type of cover system in place to help you. Heck, Mass Effect 2 had a rather effective cover system in place and that’s an RPG action game, any decent action or FPS would have some mechanism in place to ensure you can cover from enemy fire..

I’m not 100% into 40K stuff, but I remember older games like Space Hulk etc, and I got the demo to try it out. But really, this isn’t all that great a game IMO. Lacklustre graphics, seemingly boring gameplay and lack of decent cover meant I deleted it and left rather disappointed with it TBH.

Its just my opinion and I’m sure serious 40K fans will lap this right up. For true 40K fans hope the game does do well, if only to serve to provide fans even more games like this in the future..

Frapple · 8 Sep 2011 at 16:58

pioneer2000 said:
Exactly - it would work so much better if cover had been implemented. Poor show relic, poor show!

Not really.

Basically at the start they made the game like this but focus testing/common sense resulted it 'Space Marines don't need cover as they're 12ft tall killing machines'

So they removed it.

I'll try & find the interview, but 40k/space marine wise, cover system is daft.

pioneer2000 · 8 Sep 2011 at 17:10

Well clearly they aren't fans of the tabletop game or knowledgeable of the material they are trying to make a game for. Space marines do use cover in the tabletop game and in the varied literature surrounding it.

They're done it from a pure gameplay point of view - which has not worked.

Shamikebab · 8 Sep 2011 at 17:11

Frapple said:
but 40k/space marine wise, cover system is daft.

As has already been pointed out, not true at all.

nero120 · 8 Sep 2011 at 19:17

Oh dear god. Fine, if you little girls need a cover system then no amount of discussion will help you grow a pair. Yes, relic did it for gameplay purposes, and you know what? It WORKED. It drives you into battle and forces you to attack with 100% commitment or die, and that IS EXACTLY WHAT SPACE MARINES ARE SUPPOSED TO DO. They might use cover, but not to the extent you little females would do had Relic implemented it.

Honestly, I think you;ve all stupendously missed the point of what Relic tried to do through your good little robot behaviour, instead of giving it a proper chance and trying to embrace it you bitch and moan and criticise. It took me a good few attempts of the demo before I 'got' it, and I'm glad I gave it a chance, because once it clicked I was hooked.

So, I'll be enjoying this game whilst you lot hide behind your sofa. Roll on tomorrow!

atpbx · 8 Sep 2011 at 20:04

nero120 said:
Oh dear god. Fine, if you little girls need a cover system then no amount of discussion will help you grow a pair. Yes, relic did it for gameplay purposes, and you know what? It WORKED. It drives you into battle and forces you to attack with 100% commitment or die, and that IS EXACTLY WHAT SPACE MARINES ARE SUPPOSED TO DO. They might use cover, but not to the extent you little females would do had Relic implemented it.

Honestly, I think you;ve all stupendously missed the point of what Relic tried to do through your good little robot behaviour, instead of giving it a proper chance and trying to embrace it you bitch and moan and criticise. It took me a good few attempts of the demo before I 'got' it, and I'm glad I gave it a chance, because once it clicked I was hooked.

So, I'll be enjoying this game whilst you lot hide behind your sofa. Roll on tomorrow!

is that you Arnold?

pioneer2000 · 8 Sep 2011 at 20:05

No, it's just made for a game that plays like a dumbed down devil may cry / bayonetta when it should be far more strategic (as highly trained soldiers would be) like ghost recon / gears. Cover style play with less emphasis on blind button mashing makes for a better fit with the setting / material.

Shamikebab · 8 Sep 2011 at 20:11

It is basically just a poor mans DMC, if it wasn't 40k then I doubt anyone would be talking about it. I'll probably pick it up when it's cheap just because I love 40k though.