why all the hate for hs2?

[FoxEye]

why do people act like this is such a poor country, we can do HS2 and all the other projects ‘the money could be better spent on’ too.

We have a rubbish record at delivering major infrastructure projects within budget and spec. That won’t improve while we bicker over what should and shouldn’t a pitiful budget should be spent on.

The entire GDP of the UK is only £2,500 billion (in 2022).

So spending £100 billion on a line from London to Birmingham is no small amount.

By contrast the Dawlish Avoiding Line would have cost something like £800 million. HS2 is a *lot* of new or reopened local lines.

e: What cheeses a lot of people off is that the Dawlish Avoiding Line was considered too expensive. So whenever the sea is rough Cornwall has no rail link (at all).

Meanwhile, money is no object to move people into London.

Ditto for the North, who get nothing, because London sucks up all the funding. £12 billion for a new underground line... no problem. £100 billion for a new London overground route.. no problem.

£800 million so trains can run to Cornwall in all weathers? Nah, too expensive mate.

 

[explicit4u]

The entire GDP of the UK is only £2,500 billion (in 2022).

So spending £100 billion on a line from London to Birmingham is no small amount.

By contrast the Dawlish Avoiding Line would have cost something like £800 million. HS2 is a *lot* of new or reopened local lines.

Annually it’s small fry, say it’s £15bn a year, the cost of adding multiple £800mil lines is minuscule in the grand scheme of the ‘budget’.

The quicker it’s built the quicker it can start adding to the budget.

 

[FoxEye]

Annually it’s small fry, say it’s £15bn a year, the cost of adding multiple £800mil lines is minuscule in the grand scheme of the ‘budget’.

The quicker it’s built the quicker it can start adding to the budget.

You say that but the DAL has already been shelved due to being too expensive. It's not happening.

Similarly, Devon County Council are trying to reopen the line to Tavistock and Oakhampton, but the "Restoring Your Railway" fund keeps saying they can't have any money to do it (does anyone know of anyone who has successfully got money from that pot??!)

The government are really, really tight fisting when it comes to projects outside London.

 

[413x]

You say that but the DAL has already been shelved due to being too expensive. It's not happening.

It's not even just Cornwall. Devon County Council are trying to reopen the line to Tavistock and Oakhampton, but the "Restoring Your Railway" fund keeps saying they can't have any money to do it (does anyone know of anyone who has successfully got money from that pot??!)

The government are really, really tight fisting when it comes to projects outside London.

Same here. HS2 was considered an England and Wales project. Scotland got a load of cash.

How is Hs2 benefiting Wales? Same as south west?

100bln is 4k per household. That's a huge amount of money.

 

[explicit4u]

You say that but the DAL has already been shelved due to being too expensive. It's not happening.

Similarly, Devon County Council are trying to reopen the line to Tavistock and Oakhampton, but the "Restoring Your Railway" fund keeps saying they can't have any money to do it (does anyone know of anyone who has successfully got money from that pot??!)

The government are really, really tight fisting when it comes to projects outside London.

Same here. HS2 was considered an England and Wales project. Scotland got a load of cash.

How is Hs2 benefiting Wales? Same as south west?

100bln is 4k per household. That's a huge amount of money.

This is the exactly what I’m talking about, do you think if HS2 wasn’t happening that money would be going to SW England/Wales projects?

It’s political and you need a government that actually wants to invest for the good of the public. Not whatever shambles we have now.

It’s the same old story like when London gets a rail project and the northerners pipe up and say why can’t we have money like that. In reality they should all be funded and it’s not a lack of money holding it back.

The lack of electrification on major lines is a perfect example of how poorly we’re willing to give to projects that have real demand and return.

 

[Azza]

Sunak pushing to terminate HS2 at Old Oak Common.

Sunak ‘pushing for HS2 to stop six miles north of Euston’

PM said to want project to stop at Old Oak Common in bid to save billions

www.independent.co.uk

 

[FoxEye]

Sunak pushing to terminate HS2 at Old Oak Common.

Sunak ‘pushing for HS2 to stop six miles north of Euston’

PM said to want project to stop at Old Oak Common in bid to save billions

www.independent.co.uk

It keeps getting better and better. Might as well scrap the whole thing, now. The only way they could increase the comedy value from here, is if they decided they only had the money for a single rail, so the trains would have to balance on one leg.

 

[chrcoluk]

This therein lies the problem. I am not sure how other countries handle it. Japan for example seem to just get things done compared to ourselves. In the UK however the private contractors just seem to milk the tax payer for all they are worth. It is a massive gravy train for them. Especially a big contract like this.

The A1 repairs to the Wentbridge Viaduct is a prime example of this. The original dates were Spring 2023 to August 2023 but someone messed up, there is a hole in the bridge and now it is going to take them till Spring 2024. Anyone who gets caught in the traffic there will see as they go past that basically no one is working on it all.

The irony is that the original build of the Wentbridge Viaduct took two years to complete and this "repair" is going to take the same amount of time. I understand you can argue about H&S and this isn't the 60's anymore but it is all a big joke in the end.

This was far worse in Japan and fixed in a week.

Blink and you'll miss it: Japanese sinkhole repaired at speed – video

A 30-metre sinkhole on a busy street in the Japanese city of Fukuoka has been repaired astonishingly quickly

www.theguardian.com

It cost the council 10 million to install traffic lights on my street in replacement of a roundabout. They seem to spend it as if its candy.

 

[StriderX]

Gotta pay those dozens of oxbridge failure, losers at consultancies for all the meetings they have to decide how many brown envelopes to send out.

 

[200sols]

Who cares if it saves a few billion now, ending the line at OOC is pointless!

 

[glenimp617]

This was always going to happen. Large scale projects always go this way. Look at pretty much every IT project undertaken by the government. Billions and billions spent with nothing to show for it.
I wonder if anyone has a website which lists all the failed projects over the past few decades with a running total.

Last I checked HS2 had shrunk to 1/4 of its original size. What's it now? I daren't look to be honest.

In fact, did anyone think it was a good idea?

 

[Skully178]

yeah typical for UK projects

 

[Diddums]

I've said it countless times before, but until we gut our government completely and start fresh, nothing will ever happen. And I don't mean just the decision makers, I mean all of them. From the teaspoon polishers to the PM. Throw them all in the bin and start again.

 

[Werewolf]

I was seeing something earlier that put this into some context.

Apparently just getting planning permission for IIRC a tunnel to help alleviate the congestion at the Dartford crossing cost more than the Swedish paid to actually tunnel though a mountain.
That's the planning costs in the UK were enough to do the entire job in another country.

 

[413x]

I've said it countless times before, but until we gut our government completely and start fresh, nothing will ever happen. And I don't mean just the decision makers, I mean all of them. From the teaspoon polishers to the PM. Throw them all in the bin and start again.

Totally agree. The entire establishment seems to be either
-corrupt
-incompetent
-unaccountable

I doubt it'll ever change as its not in thier best interests.

Glad it's gone. Cataclysmic waste of money.

 

[jpaul]

Never mind Kier seems to be tacitly backing the build (who cares about the artificial gdp to borrowing ratio) ... plus the reforms on the EU trade agreement for alignment of food standards,
who knows we'll be able to take a high speed train from Manchester to Paris w/o needing a passport

 

[Murf]

I see it as a way to turn Birmingham into a commuter town for London.

☝

Well, quelle ******* surprise. **** this government.

 

[Chrisc]

Guessing not now.. I hope there is a full investigation, because there will be a number of people who have made megabucks for this and basically delivered nothing!

 

[doodah]

It's so obvious they want to cut the next Northern section, they're just trying to find the least damaging way to do so.

Guessing not now.. I hope there is a full investigation, because there will be a number of people who have made megabucks for this and basically delivered nothing!

Agreed but knowing this country, it will take 10 years and £200m (look at Grenfell).

 

[omnomnom]

It's so obvious they want to cut the next Northern section, they're just trying to find the least damaging way to do so.


Agreed but knowing this country, it will take 10 years and £200m (look at Grenfell).

Northern HS2 line set to be scrapped with costs 'out of control', Sky News understands

The planned railway - announced by the last Labour government but backed by successive Tory administrations - is intended to link London, the Midlands and the North of England but has been plagued by delays and rising costs.

news.sky.com

Only a matter of time.