Chances of UKIP winning General Election?

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Tunney said:
Interesting to see that UKIP are backtracking on their libertarian ideals. I wonder if they'll now distance themselves from their previous plans to privatise the NHS?
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Backtracking and u-turns are a feature of all the parties. Manifestos are written then discarded, policies come and go...

None of the parties have clearly established ideologies these days. You have to take anything they say prior to being elected with a truckload of salt.

I hardly think this is a UKIP-only problem.
 
MrMoonX said:
You mean the one where comparatively poor people pay more income tax than rich people, wow such great ideas the racists have :rolleyes:
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Care to explain that to me? Surely if there is a income tax free amount, and then a flat tax, the more money you earn, the high percentage of your income is taxed?
 
MrMoonX said:
Yes it's hypocrisy that farage whines about an EU gravy train whilst riding it all the way to the bank
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He would be earning more if he stayed in finance - he's taken significant cuts moving into politics and openly admits to using the money he gets to actively campaign against the EU. Not really sure what you expect him to do? Not take any money from the job and hence not be able to pay his bills or campaign?
 
robgmun said:
Not sure what you personally class as a libertarian government. Personally i would like UKIP to be a more right wing version of the Tory party. But why are you so scared of the NHS being part-privatised? I completely understand and agree that the at the basic front of staff (Doctors, Nurses and consultants) and main building should remain public forever more. But the management system needs a serious overall to curb waste.
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Let's clear up some myths first. The NHS has been compared with other health services around the industrialised world and came out top of efficiency (and second overall). There's lots of things that the NHS does poorly compared to other countries but waste isn't one of them.

As for the NHS being part-privatised, I just don't see it being either efficient or a way to deliver good care. Do we really want private companies diverting money from care into dividends for shareholders? They might be able to make efficiency savings but they would will no doubt come from providing poorer care. Health care is too important to be left to organisations whose core objective is to make money, in my opinion.
 
Evangelion said:
UKIP are a bunch of hypocrites. When the party was first founded, it refused to recognise the EU and swore it would never send a member to the European Parliament.

As soon as Farage got hold of the leadership he realised (a) politics is actually a lot harder than it looks, and (b) nobody in Britain wants UKIP running the nation.

Instead he decided life would be much simpler if he just parked his backside in a cushy European office doing sod all at the public's expense, occasionally rattling the media's cage with an inflammatory and ultimately irrelevant speeches.

Ever since then UKIP members have been fighting like rabid rats to get onto the very same taxpayer-funded Brussells-based gravy train they claim they're trying to abolish. The irony is that if they actually succeeded they'd all be out of a job, which is the last thing they want.

******s.
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They regularly use the phrase "UKIP is the turkey that votes for christmas" because losing their jobs is EXACTLY what they want. Most of them were on more money in their previous jobs. The best way to take something down is to take over it - with so many eurosceptic MEPs in the EU now they can really move things their way with votes etc.
 
Tunney said:
Let's clear up some myths first. The NHS has been compared with other health services around the industrialised world and came out top of efficiency (and second overall). There's lots of things that the NHS does poorly compared to other countries but waste isn't one of them.

As for the NHS being part-privatised, I just don't see it being either efficient or a way to deliver good care. Do we really want private companies diverting money from care into dividends for shareholders? They might be able to make efficiency savings but they would will no doubt come from providing poorer care. Health care is too important to be left to organisations whose core objective is to make money, in my opinion.
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Very efficient in staffing costs I would say.

For instance, on our Service Desk it works out that each staff member supports 1500 (probably 2000 now) people EACH. That is absurd. And we are talking some people who have barely touched a computer or laptop in their entire lives. They've just had them thrown at them.

The one thing which is wasteful and winds me up no end is the use of contractors. They get paid more than we do, for doing less work. It's pretty insulting and the NHS band system needs to be redone. You can negotiate salary on the band when starting a fixed term, but when you switch to permanent there is absolutely no room for re-negotiation. Experienced staff who know the job are penalised, which is why they often bugger off back to the private sector. ( Like I am currently plotting to do! ;) )

I have to be the lowest paid ITIL qualified Service Desk worker in the country.
 
Tunney said:
Let's clear up some myths first. The NHS has been compared with other health services around the industrialised world and came out top of efficiency (and second overall). There's lots of things that the NHS does poorly compared to other countries but waste isn't one of them.

As for the NHS being part-privatised, I just don't see it being either efficient or a way to deliver good care. Do we really want private companies diverting money from care into dividends for shareholders? They might be able to make efficiency savings but they would will no doubt come from providing poorer care. Health care is too important to be left to organisations whose core objective is to make money, in my opinion.
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I do find it hilarious how people complain about the NHS (when according to almost all studies it vastly outperforms any other medical organisation with the same associated cost).

We could improve a few things in the NHS yes - for instance we could increase the funding to get down the waiting times. But any discussion around the NHS should be based on the reality of the situation.
 
At this rate if he keeps kicking them out for saying stupid offensive **** I've got a feeling the party won't have anybody left in it by the end of the year.
 
Strife212 said:
While some of their remarks are awful if you actually read what he said there I don't think it's that bad?
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It shows a very fundamental misunderstanding of the journey people go through to find out they are gay. There are numerous issues in the "treatment" he suggests, but the biggest issue is that the people he is suggesting may want to be "cured" are just a symptom of the cultural issues in society if indeed these people exist at all.
 
Roger Helmet is a blathering old idiot. He is another shining example of the dinosaur breed close to extinction. His views should not even be permissable in his position of responsibility. He should be sacked and thus publicly shamed for his incompetence and narrow minded idiocy.
 
deuse said:
Well if you and Klo want my come back.

You'll have to scrape off your moms teeth :D


Oh and deuse throws the knock out blow. :D
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I imagine Jimmy Carr probably has a basic grasp of punctuation and grammar. It seems your views regarding your own wit are as misaligned with reality as your political views.
 
MrMoonX said:
They wanted to do away with a tax free allowance and have a flat rate
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Reading fail:

At the last general election, when Mr Farage was not leader, UKIP called for the threshold at which people start paying tax on their earnings to be raised to £11,500.

Above that amount, the party proposed that everyone would pay a single tax rate of 31%, irrespective of their income levels. The combined measures, it said at the time, would "make all taxpayers better off".
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So they wanted a tax free allowance greater than the current one, and then a simplification of our tax system.

I'd call that progress. What they are suggesting now is just rhetoric which effects next to no-one, but will allow them to appear less right wing, and therefore target labour voters harder.
 
UKIP certainly do seem to have a communications problem.

New UKIP MEP Louise Bours was on Question Time this week, and when Piers Morgan claimed they had policies to 'End gay marriage, cut all taxes, ignore climate change and bring back handguns' she said they were all lies and peddled by the media in order to put them down.

Now, she is right on some, for example Nigel Farage now says UKIP won't fight to repeal the gay marriage law but she got into a spat with Morgan over the handgun issue, insisting it was a lie and media spin. If only Dimbleby had the internet on hand...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/10595087/Hand-guns-should-be-legalised-and-licensed-Nigel-Farage-has-said.html

So it seems one hand doesn't know what the other is doing.
 
Captain Planet said:
Wait, let me get this straight. Many of the super anti-immigration clan in this thread have either.

A. Emigrated to other shores in the past to return to the UK recently

or

B. Threaten to emigrate to another far off country, should immigration continue in this country?


I. Don't. Get. What. The. Hell. Is. Happening. Here.
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1st of June, GD is set to maximum, for Summer.
 
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