'Suicide bomber' taxi explodes at Liverpool Women's Hospital

Soldato
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Then maybe living in a Western Democracy isn't the right place for you

Western Democracy sent hundreds of thousands of troops into other countries to live, eat, do troop stuff, for the last 20 years, generated hundreds of thousands of corpses, primarily killing the natives so that's an incredibly rich statement :p
 
Soldato
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Western Democracy sent hundreds of thousands of troops into other countries to live, eat, do troop stuff, for the last 20 years, generated hundreds of thousands of corpses, primarily killing the natives so that's an incredibly rich statement :p
Sounds like having people with ties to those places living among us would be quite a mistake.
 
Soldato
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That's quite loaded wording. It wouldn't have flown when I did my psych degree. Adding 'to fight injustice' gives rather a lot of room for mental manoeuvre. Is this hypothetical suicide bomber a desperate man who's lost his entire family against ISIS in some third world hellhole, striking back at his oppressors? Or is it someone in a democratised suburb wandering into the local children's hospital and blowing up a dozen innocent kids 'because infidels'? You can see the potential for varied answers based on that little snippet alone.



No it was a private hire.

Thanks, it held up pretty well then or supporting the notion of it not going off properly.
 
Soldato
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Western Democracy sent hundreds of thousands of troops into other countries to live, eat, do troop stuff, for the last 20 years, generated hundreds of thousands of corpses, primarily killing the natives so that's an incredibly rich statement :p

You realise the majority of civilian deaths caused in those wars were due to insurgents, i.e. men travelling from 3rd party countries to fight for ISIS and similar groups, not Western troops killing civilians. It isn't us killing natives for the most part. We have probably the strictest rules of engagement ever seen in a military, rightfully so. Iraq and Afghanistan have a lot of people who are pretty much savages, they don't care about civilians, they're happy to blow themselves up in a crowded environment even killing many Muslims, what are we supposed to do? I'm not sure if you remember 9/11 but Afghanistan was a fairly justified war, and removing Saddam was a very reasonable thing to do at the time even if the justification for going there was wrong.
 
Man of Honour
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As my wife just pointed out, you'd never want to be a taxi driver again after this. The poor bloke's mental health and trust issues will likely affect him for the rest of his life. I can't even imagine. Next up: a holiday.

I’ve no wish to detract from the more serious aspect of all this, but your post triggered a memory from the 80s/90s.
I picked up a young Irish guy at Euston, with a small carry-on type suitcase.
He asked for Harrods, so off we went.
As I was weaving through Mayfair toward Hyde Park Corner, he said to go to the Brompton Rd. entrance, as he actually wanted the bank at the corner of Hans Rd.
Just before we got there he said, “I only have to get a signature for something, want to wait and take me back to Euston?”
With £ signs in my eyes I agreed enthusiastically, and pulled on to the rear of the taxi rank at the beginning of Hans Rd. to wait for him.
He got out and said, “I’ve left my suitcase so you don’t have worry about me not coming back.”
After 4 or 5 minutes I began to think, “Irish guy, suitcase, IRA bomb, I’m right outside Harrods’ gulp.
I glanced at the meter, slowly ticking around and greed took over, I waited for him, then returned to Euston.
 
Soldato
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It was reported on BBC 5 Live this morning that the fare picked up was Muslim appearance and his destination was intended to be the hospital. Apparently the driver has now been discharged. Significant find also taken place at one of the addresses that have been searched. This seems to tie in with the incident being officially classified as a terrorist one earlier today.
 
Caporegime
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You realise the majority of civilian deaths caused in those wars were due to insurgents, i.e. men travelling from 3rd party countries to fight for ISIS and similar groups, not Western troops killing civilians. It isn't us killing natives for the most part. We have probably the strictest rules of engagement ever seen in a military, rightfully so. Iraq and Afghanistan have a lot of people who are pretty much savages, they don't care about civilians, they're happy to blow themselves up in a crowded environment even killing many Muslims, what are we supposed to do? I'm not sure if you remember 9/11 but Afghanistan was a fairly justified war, and removing Saddam was a very reasonable thing to do at the time even if the justification for going there was wrong.

Those insurgents wouldn't have been there had Saddam been left to his own devices. Similarly with Gaddafi/al-Assad wrt to Libya being a farce which played a part in the subsequent mass migration and Syria being a smouldering wreck which contributed further. Regardless of the brutal tyranny of these people, they did at least keep some semblance of order.

Afghanistan has the benefit of being a legitimate action even if we pointlessly remained after the fact.
 
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Caporegime
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It was reported on BBC 5 Live this morning that the fare picked up was Muslim appearance and his destination was intended to be the hospital. Apparently the driver has now been discharged. Significant find also taken place at one of the addresses that have been searched. This seems to tie in with the incident being officially classified as a terrorist one earlier today.

Muslim appearance?

Was he carrying a Koran?
 
Soldato
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I don't think it's that simple. What if you agree with suicide bombing against actual military targets (e.g kamikazi) but not against civilians (e.g. Islamists).

To address that, you'd probably want a follow up question, where people had answered "yes", "always", "sometimes" or whatever to the first question.

Ideally, you want short, simple questions with a few possible answer choices.
 
Soldato
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You realise the majority of civilian deaths caused in those wars were due to insurgents, i.e. men travelling from 3rd party countries to fight for ISIS and similar groups, not Western troops killing civilians. It isn't us killing natives for the most part. We have probably the strictest rules of engagement ever seen in a military, rightfully so. Iraq and Afghanistan have a lot of people who are pretty much savages, they don't care about civilians, they're happy to blow themselves up in a crowded environment even killing many Muslims, what are we supposed to do? I'm not sure if you remember 9/11 but Afghanistan was a fairly justified war, and removing Saddam was a very reasonable thing to do at the time even if the justification for going there was wrong.

There's no dodging the fact that hundreds of thousands of corpses are attributable to the fact we parked troops there for the last 20 years for our own motives. If you can honestly say that the majority of civilian deaths had nothing to do with our troops being there and the bad guys would have killed them anyway then give it a go but I have doubts.
 
Soldato
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Hospital seems such an odd destination, was he not carrying the primary device ? and another event was meant to bring casualties to the hospital.
(yes not the IRA, but similar tactics have been employed)
 
Soldato
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Hospital seems such an odd destination, was he not carrying the primary device ? and another event was meant to bring casualties to the hospital.
(yes not the IRA, but similar tactics have been employed)
Maybe he was a trans Muslim, and in an effort to fit in he/she/it took "time of the month" a little too far.
 
Caporegime
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It was reported on BBC 5 Live this morning that the fare picked up was Muslim appearance and his destination was intended to be the hospital. Apparently the driver has now been discharged. Significant find also taken place at one of the addresses that have been searched. This seems to tie in with the incident being officially classified as a terrorist one earlier today.

I heard a different report. Originally the fare wanted to the be taken to main remembrance area but traffic was really bad so when it became clear he wasn't going to get there in time he changed the destination to a church but on route saw the hospital and then asked the driver to go there instead.
 
Soldato
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The target makes sense considering the mess the NHS is in, more stress on an already stressed system would be logical.
That's such an odd way of looking at this. This is the kind of person who didn't have the foresight to hide the device in a bag without playing around with it. I'm not sure stressing a healthcare system was high on their agenda.
 
Soldato
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Perhaps. The fact is isn't 0 however should tell us something is very wrong.

You'll never get "zero". The "completely sympathise" response is 1%, which is margin of error stuff.

If you asked the general public if alleged paedophiles should be burned alive, you'd get a decent, "yes, and I'd provide the matches" response.
 
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