10GB vram enough for the 3080? Discuss..

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:20

opethdisciple said:
No. Read the Reddit thread.

lol.
Do me a solid, copy pasta the quote here.

opethdisciple · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:21

EastCoastHandle said:
lol.
Do me a solid, copy pasta the quote here.

I did.

chaparral · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:23

opethdisciple said:
No. Read the Reddit thread.

"
Why only 10 GB of memory for RTX 3080? How was that determined to be a sufficient number, when it is stagnant from the previous generation?

[Justin Walker] We’re constantly analyzing memory requirements of the latest games and regularly review with game developers to understand their memory needs for current and upcoming games. The goal of 3080 is to give you great performance at up to 4k resolution with all the settings maxed out at the best possible price. In order to do this, you need a very powerful GPU with high speed memory and enough memory to meet the needs of the games. A few examples - if you look at Shadow of the Tomb Raider, Assassin’s Creed Odyssey, Metro Exodus, Wolfenstein Youngblood, Gears of War 5, Borderlands 3 and Red Dead Redemption 2 running on a 3080 at 4k with Max settings (including any applicable high res texture packs) and RTX On, when the game supports it, you get in the range of 60-100fps and use anywhere from 4GB to 6GB of memory. Extra memory is always nice to have but it would increase the price of the graphics card, so we need to find the right balance."

But there old games

Need to look at what Vram will be needed going forwards not backwards

Joxeon · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:28

Maybe this was why the 3080 was so far ahead of the 2080 in the GF benchmarks at 4K as that card only has 8gb VRAM.

opethdisciple · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:28

chaparral said:
But there old games

alNeed to look at what Vram will be needed going forwards not backwards

I understand that. But the RTX IO thing might be the reason why the cards do not need more than 10GB of vram.

Remember these things have years of development and lots of thought put in to them.

As said as well the 16GB on the consoles is shared memory. So what ever is left after the consoles has loaded up and running all it's services will be available as vram. It's not got 16GB of frame buffer.

My PC with just this tab open in Firefox is sitting at 4GB of ram. It also says it's cached 6GB.

So lets be conservative and say an Xbox will use 4GB for it's OS. That leaves 12GB suddenly. So the 10GB on the new Nvidia cards isn't that far off the 12GB of the consoles.

So it's not a huge difference.

Also remember the memory speed and GPU power of the 3080 far exceeds the power of what is in the new consoles.

Alghazanth · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:30

chaparral said:
But there old games

Need to look at what Vram will be needed going forwards not backwards

Yeah, very telling how in that quote they practically brush the upcoming games part aside and just focus on the current crop of games that have more manageable vram usages. And of course they conveniently forget hungrier games like HZD, FFXV and MSFS20.

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:34

chaparral said:
But there old games

Need to look at what Vram will be needed going forwards not backwards

Alghazanth said:
Yeah, very telling how in that quote they practically brush the upcoming games part aside and just focus on the current crop of games that have more manageable vram usages. And of course they conveniently forget hungrier games like HZD, FFXV and MSFS20.

And here I had this soliloquy all typed up to replay to him. Even ask him if he understood what's being implied. As it doesn't need to be stated directly.
Thanks for saving me the trouble.

jjgreenwood · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:39

chaparral said:
But there old games

Need to look at what Vram will be needed going forwards not backwards

At a £649 price point there was probably a choice between memory speed and quantity and it seems they have chosen speed. This looks like a card specifically designed around the pricepoint and perhaps running today's games at 60-100fps in 4k for £649 is where we are. Presumably it should make the PC able to match if not better the next gen consoles and maintain a higher average FPS. No doubt in 18 months or 2 years when the next gen of the cards is ready there will be more memory for the same price point, and probably a release of higher Vram cards as this generation progresses.

Is 10GB enough, the answer seems to be yes for the vast majority of games that will be published between now and the end of 2021, after that there will probably be a new generation of cards to upgrade to anyway.

esoteric · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:42

Joxeon said:
Maybe this was why the 3080 was so far ahead of the 2080 in the GF benchmarks at 4K as that card only has 8gb VRAM.

Check the new DOOM: Eternal video of the 3080 smashing the 2080 Ti with 1Gb less VRAM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7nYy7ZucxM

chaparral · 3 Sep 2020 at 19:49

esoteric said:
Check the new DOOM: Eternal video of the 3080 smashing the 2080 Ti with 1Gb less VRAM.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7nYy7ZucxM

One the replies

My 2080 Ti: "Wanna grab a beer ?"
Me: "sure"

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 20:36

Some actually believe that Nvidia is releasing a 3080ti with more vram at the same price. So, they are waiting for that. But at least they aren't day 1 buyers. Taken off guard by that or if RDNA 2 is competitive at a possible lower price.

Who knows right now.

The Old School Gamer · 3 Sep 2020 at 20:57

EastCoastHandle said:
Some actually believe that Nvidia is releasing a 3080ti with more vram at the same price. So, they are waiting for that. But at least they aren't day 1 buyers. Taken off guard by that or if RDNA 2 is competitive at a possible lower price.

Who knows right now.

980

> 980ti

> 1080

> 1080ti

> 2080

> 2080ti

£££ > 3080 :rolleyes:

(hmmm yeah I see a pattern forming here) > ?

So it's pretty much a certainly, just a question of when.

The right balance is offering consumers all the options from the very start of the product cycle.

Chuk_Chuk · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:04

opethdisciple said:
No. Read the Reddit thread.

"
Why only 10 GB of memory for RTX 3080? How was that determined to be a sufficient number, when it is stagnant from the previous generation?

[Justin Walker] We’re constantly analyzing memory requirements of the latest games and regularly review with game developers to understand their memory needs for current and upcoming games. The goal of 3080 is to give you great performance at up to 4k resolution with all the settings maxed out at the best possible price. In order to do this, you need a very powerful GPU with high speed memory and enough memory to meet the needs of the games. A few examples - if you look at Shadow of the Tomb Raider, Assassin’s Creed Odyssey, Metro Exodus, Wolfenstein Youngblood, Gears of War 5, Borderlands 3 and Red Dead Redemption 2 running on a 3080 at 4k with Max settings (including any applicable high res texture packs) and RTX On, when the game supports it, you get in the range of 60-100fps and use anywhere from 4GB to 6GB of memory. Extra memory is always nice to have but it would increase the price of the graphics card, so we need to find the right balance."

Allow me to highlight the important bit that you seem to have missed. You need to look at what is not said as well as what is said.

He never actually said that 10GB is all we need. He didn't say that 10GB was good enough. Infact he didn't actually directly comment on the memory capacity of the 3080.
He never addressed future/next gen games only current titles (Just because they spoke to game developers about upcoming titles doesn't mean they took everything that was discussed into account when they designed the 3080. You could argue that these discussions would help them in planned obsolescence).

He said it's a balance and acknowledged that more memory would be a good thing.

The only thing that we can take away from this, is that the capacity they settled on was done for cost reasons. Not because it is good enough for next gen titles as some people seem to be insinuating from this quote.

Jimmy Weirdarms · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:09

EastCoastHandle said:
Some actually believe that Nvidia is releasing a 3080ti with more vram at the same price. So, they are waiting for that. But at least they aren't day 1 buyers. Taken off guard by that or if RDNA 2 is competitive at a possible lower price.

Who knows right now.

At the same price?

Doubtful. But there's a lot of space between the 3080 and 3090, in vram and price. Definitely room to slide in an intermediate model.

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:15

Chuk_Chuk said:
Allow me to highlight the important bit that you seem to have missed. You need to look at what is not said as well as what is said.

He never actually said that 10GB is all we need. He didn't say that 10GB was good enough. Infact he didn't actually directly comment on the memory capacity of the 3080.
He never addressed future/next gen games only current titles (Just because they spoke to game developers about upcoming titles doesn't mean they took everything that was discussed into account when they designed the 3080. You could argue that these discussions would help them in planned obsolescence).

He said it's a balance and acknowledged that more memory would be a good thing.

The only thing that we can take away from this, is that the capacity they settled on was done for cost reasons. Not because it is good enough for next gen titles as some people seem to be insinuating from this quote.

Thanks for fleshing that out, sentence by sentence nearly.
But I think he's gone from the thread at this point.
Or
He still believes that next gen console games requiring more then 10gb of vram is bad coding/memory leak. As it's only limited to just 10GB. Then he will link that post from reddit again.

james.miller · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:17

Stop comparing VRAM to console RAM guys, seriously. It's such a daft argument. Do you know how much memory these next generation game engines are going to need? no? well you have no idea how much of that system ram will be available to the gpu, then.

'yeah yeah but the ps5 has 16gb'...irrelevant.

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:24

james.miller said:
Stop comparing VRAM to console RAM guys, seriously. It's such a daft argument. Do you know how much memory these next generation game engines are going to need? no? well you have no idea how much of that system ram will be available to the gpu, then.

'yeah yeah but the ps5 has 16gb'...irrelevant.

That's right, shutup about it. Ignore the elephant in the room thrusting about with it's trunk. /s

james.miller · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:29

I'm not ignoring anything. The console gpus have to share their ram with the cpus. ergo not all of that ram will be available to store textures for the gpu to access. That ratio of available memory will change form title to title but i expect big AAA games to use more memory for the game engine. It's really quite simple.

EastCoastHandle · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:31

james.miller said:
I'm not ignoring anything. The console gpus have to share their ram with the cpus. ergo not all of that ram will be available to store textures for the gpu to access. That ratio of available memory will change form title to title but i expect big AAA games to use more memory for the game engine. It's really quite simple.

So it's more efficient based on developers coding for it's close to mental approach? As it doesn't have win10 bloat to account for? Really??? You don't say... Gotcha...gotta ignore the elephant...but it's touching meeeeee :eek:

james.miller · 3 Sep 2020 at 21:33

EastCoastHandle said:
So it's more efficient based on developers coding for it's close to mental approach? As it doesn't have win10 bloat to account for? Really??? You don't say... Gotcha...gotta ignore the elephant...but it's touching meeeeee

Do you have a point you are trying to make? Because if you are trying to counter my argument, it isn't obvious at all...