2008 Japanese GP - Race 16/18

JRS said:
I just want to quote that, as I think it shows perfectly just how far Massa has come since he joined Ferrari.

I know dannyjo22 still thinks he is the 'worst Ferrari driver evarrr!!!' (conveniently forgetting Ivan Capelli's '92 horror show ;)), but I honestly think Massa can take this title.
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Im a hamilton fan, as said previously.

I think Hamilton has more talent that Massa. However, the man that wins this will be the one who remains calmer under the pressures. Massa was well known for being hot headed when he was younger and if he uses his experience to avoid doing "a hamilton" during the next two races I think maybe Hamilton will hand it to him on a plate.

Im really dissapointed but today demonstrates that Hamilton has learned little since last year and this is a massive step backwards.

Only way he can pull it out of the fire is by showing some restraint in China and proving me wrong.
 
JRS said:
I just want to quote that, as I think it shows perfectly just how far Massa has come since he joined Ferrari.

I know dannyjo22 still thinks he is the 'worst Ferrari driver evarrr!!!' (conveniently forgetting Ivan Capelli's '92 horror show ;)), but I honestly think Massa can take this title.
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Personally I think Massa has developed a lot during the course of this season, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he wins the next 2 races.

FrankJH said:
with the FIA help at Spa and here being so obvious then Ferrari SHOULD win both titles
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Spa and this incident have only cost Hamilton ~7 points, Massa lost 20 points from Hungary and Singapore through no fault of his own.

All I'm saying is that over the course of the season Massa has done as much as Hamilton for me to justify winning the title.
 
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Scottland said:
Personally I think Massa has developed a lot during the course of this season, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he wins the next 2 races.
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Agreed, now its the man with the steadier hand wins. End of story.

As much as I hate to say it and would love to be proved wrong, I can only see it being Massa after today.

Listening to Lewis interview after, i think he has lost it.

Also, odds on Kubica? Only take a Massa v Hamilton clash in China and its door wide open.

Hamilton 1/4
Massa 11/4
Kubica 20/1
 
Scottland said:
Spa and this incident have only cost Hamilton ~7 points, Massa lost 20 points from Hungary and Singapore through no fault of his own.

All I'm saying is that over the course of the season Massa has done as much as Hamilton for me to justify winning the title.
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Its cost Hamilton a race win, and at LEAST 7 points, (at the very least minus two points today plus the difference of 6 at spa) thru unfair means

Massa had failures thats what motor racing is all about - Ferrari should get extra assistance because of failures now !!!
 
Id love to see Massa win a title, and id love to see Hamilton win a title.

But what id love to see more is a season that isnt filled with dodgy and stupid penalties handed out by the FIA that ruins the racing. This season is like last season, close, with 2 or 3 drivers in for a chance of the title, and will probubly go right down to the last race... but nobody cares about that, all they talk about is the scandal and random rulings and strange steward decisions.

The Kubica/Kimi battle was absolutely great watching, some of the best close racing all season... yet everybody seems to have forgotten because the FIA are shoving out obscure penalties for random things all over the shot. Races are being remembered for all the wrong reasons! And the FIA need to learn this. So Max Mosely going on about "high costs killing F1", its the politics that will drive the fans away way before the costs push the teams out.
 
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FrankJH said:
Massa had failures thats what motor racing is all about - Ferrari should get extra assistance because of failures now !!!
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That is not what I said.

JRS said:
Should I dig out the videos of Hamilton in Bahrain, and Canada, and France or can we take it as read that neither of the top two title challengers this year has been what you'd call faultless?
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This.
 
NightSt@lk3r said:
Depends, can i count all the Silverstone mistakes seperatly?
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Sure. He (Massa) had a horror show there, I'll freely admit that.

Of course, I'm not sure how you'd weight it against driving into the back of a stationary car in the pitlane with the red light at the end of the pits lit up and with the team telling you over the radio to slam on the anchors....your call ;)
 
I think Massa was the luckiest man alive at Silverstone

He spun 5 times and STILL managed not to hit ANYTHING! Especially when he spun at bridge and 15 cars drove within inches of him....
 
Massa has been amazing this year, Silverstone aside he really has been a bit let down by Ferrari with 20 points lost at Hungary and Singapore. And he lost himself 10 in Bahrain and plenty in Australia, or else he would be the champion already. Hamilton is pretty consistent but for me Massa would make a better champion this year.
 
JRS said:
Sure. He (Massa) had a horror show there, I'll freely admit that.

Of course, I'm not sure how you'd weight it against driving into the back of a stationary car in the pitlane with the red light at the end of the pits lit up and with the team telling you over the radio to slam on the anchors....your call ;)
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That was brilliant by Hamilton, any wrecked Ferrari is good in my books he gets a 10 out of 10 for that from me.
 
JRS said:
Sure. He (Massa) had a horror show there, I'll freely admit that.

Of course, I'm not sure how you'd weight it against driving into the back of a stationary car in the pitlane with the red light at the end of the pits lit up and with the team telling you over the radio to slam on the anchors....your call ;)
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Actually it doesn't weigh up at all well. Despite Hamilton's incident in Canada he was the quickest man on the day. Massa was not only spinning 5 times he was also slow.

You'd be surprised how easy it is not to notice those lights at the end of pitlanes when you are in a competitive race, which is backed up by the fact that Rosberg made exactly the same mistake.
 
Wicksta said:
Actually it doesn't weigh up at all well. Despite Hamilton's incident in Canada he was the quickest man on the day. Massa was not only spinning 5 times he was also slow.

You'd be surprised how easy it is not to notice those lights at the end of pitlanes when you are in a competitive race, which is backed up by the fact that Rosberg made exactly the same mistake.
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Kimi was all over Lewis at Silverstone until Ferrari made the wrong call on tyres, Lewis also needed Heikki to move over for him into Stowe. Maybe is hard to see the lights but with 2 cars stopped at the pitlane you would think that would be noticeable
 
TheStig1 said:
Kimi was all over Lewis at Silverstone until Ferrari made the wrong call on tyres, Lewis also needed Heikki to move over for him into Stowe. Maybe is hard to see the lights but with 2 cars stopped at the pitlane you would think that would be noticeable
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What has Lewis at Silverstone got to do with anything? :confused:

Maybe *you* 'would think' it is easy to notice two cars stop in front of you suddenly in a race when you are not expecting it, but what experience do you have to back up this opinion?
 
IMHO if Massa wins the drivers title, its all because the FIA helped him to it.

F1 is just a joke these days McLaren get drive though(s) and penalties just for turning up and the FIA & stewards etc do everything to make sure Ferrari win. I for one can't even be bother to watch it anymore.
 
Slam62 said:
HI can someone please have a careful look at this and tell me what the hamilton penalty was for.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/10/12/hamilton-and-raikkonens-fuji-clash-the-penalty-they-got-wron-video/
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I'm sure we will get another reclassification of the rules like we did after Spa just to prove the stewards right.

Something like "If a driver out brakes himself and leaves a skid mark of more than 5 metres while forcing another driver off the track he will be penalised"
 
El_Watcher said:
I'm sure we will get another reclassification of the rules like we did after Spa just to prove the stewards right.

Something like "If a driver out brakes himself and leaves a skid mark of more than 5 metres while forcing another driver off the track he will be penalised"
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*visions of marshals running around with tape measures measuring tyre marks...*
 
Wicksta said:
What has Lewis at Silverstone got to do with anything? :confused:

Maybe *you* 'would think' it is easy to notice two cars stop in front of you suddenly in a race when you are not expecting it, but what experience do you have to back up this opinion?
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Your talking about Massa at Silverstone saying Lewis was the quickest man? Cause in Canada Kimi was faster than Lewis and had took him in the pits (as did Kubica) till Lewis had his brain fade.

He was told on his radio the light was red was he not? How can he not be expecting it? He was not paying attention, he was looking down into his cockpit not looking at what was ahead of him. Kimi and Kubica seemed to spot the red light easy enough, how did they expect it but Lewis never?
 
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