AMD Navi 23 ‘NVIDIA Killer’ GPU Rumored to Support Hardware Ray Tracing, Coming Next Year

[MissChief]

Any more wild beliefs that Big Navi will provide twice the power of a 2080ti for 1/3 of the price or have people gotten a bit more realistic since I was last here?

 

[melmac]

Any more wild beliefs that Big Navi will provide twice the power of a 2080ti for 1/3 of the price or have people gotten a bit more realistic since I was last here?

The latest hype is that Console RT performance will put the RT performance of the 2080Ti to shame and that means good things for AMD's desktop parts. The much cheaper price is still a popular belief.

How realistic you think those claims are, well, that is up to you to decide.

 

[Martini1991]

So is it just F1 showing performance increases, in which case I don't understand the hype?

 

[gpuerrilla]

Let's be frank but honest @melmac , if AMD release a card that beats the 2080Ti lets say by 15% (keep the green fanboys from exploding) but then price it at the same price as the 2080Ti (£1200+) I wont be buying, and neither will many a person on here!

Same can be said for nvidia, the silly prices are not justifiable.

 

[Satchfanuk]

Let's be frank but honest @melmac , if AMD release a card that beats the 2080Ti lets say by 15% (keep the green fanboys from exploding) but then price it at the same price as the 2080Ti (£1200+) I wont be buying, and neither will many a person on here!

Same can be said for nvidia, the silly prices are not justifiable.

Unfortunately Jensen is already prepping the mindset by claiming there's a new mining boom starting, getting everyone in the right mentality to accept higher prices. Why else do you thing he would say that, especially considering there is literally no evidence of mining being on the rise.

 

[melmac]

So is it just F1 showing performance increases, in which case I don't understand the hype?

Yes, it's just F1 2020, the game that released a few days ago.

I don't understand the hype either.

 

[TNA]

Let's be frank but honest @melmac , if AMD release a card that beats the 2080Ti lets say by 15% (keep the green fanboys from exploding) but then price it at the same price as the 2080Ti (£1200+) I wont be buying, and neither will many a person on here!

Yea. That would suck balls! But I get if Ampere was severely delayed AMD would take the chance and price such a product like that. Their GPU division is not like their CPU division, they charge silly monies also like Nvidia these days imo.

I used to always buy AMD GPU's for a very long time due to them always being price for performance king, but then they went and lost the plot.

 

[gpuerrilla]

Yea. That would suck balls! But I get if Ampere was severely delayed AMD would take the chance and price such a product like that. Their GPU division is not like their CPU division, they charge silly monies also like Nvidia these days imo.

I used to always buy AMD GPU's for a very long time due to them always being price for performance king, but then they went and lost the plot.

I could live with the release price being high such as what they did with the 5600XT (it was almost same as a 5700) for the early adopters but when the novelty wears off the deals/offers etc need to start pulling the reality levels in. The options are then likely to be the cut down version of the flagship (i.e. non XT) being the best bet to get somewhere. Like I said though these £1000+ cards can do one, if 2 yr old tech can play 4k, the new releases should be able to offer it lower down the stack.

 

[melmac]

Let's be frank but honest @melmac , if AMD release a card that beats the 2080Ti lets say by 15% (keep the green fanboys from exploding) but then price it at the same price as the 2080Ti (£1200+) I wont be buying, and neither will many a person on here!

Same can be said for nvidia, the silly prices are not justifiable.

Well, just for a start, if AMD's Big Navi is only going to be 15% faster than the 2080Ti then that's another pretty average release for AMD. And it would be a complete disaster for AMD if they priced it at £1200+. 15% improvement, over 2 years later. Of course nobody would it.

But, if you change the sentence around and say Big Navi is 15% faster than the 3080Ti and the same price, then there would be lots of interest.

 

[EastCoastHandle]

Any more wild beliefs that Big Navi will provide twice the power of a 2080ti for 1/3 of the price or have people gotten a bit more realistic since I was last here?

I don't know really...But since this is all rumors it's no more then those who think they can get a 3080ti for 1/3 the price of 2080ti

 

[Calin Banc]

Mantle was a patch to a hardware problem AMD had, it wasn't just a driver and the performance gains, although nice here and there, were not across the board, but rather tied to very specific scenarios.
Most likely not. My only grudge with DLSS 2.0 would be if it doesn't work on any resolution you through at it, standard or non-standard.

Since when? I've never heard mantle referred to as a "patch" before.

For AMD to actually have all the shaders occupied even in some "CPU" heavy situations (draw calls and such), Mantle / low level API was the way for it. The way games were/are coded on PC favored nVIDIA's approach. Also, AMD had a hardware scheduler for its cards while nVIDIA did it in software and also allowed the green team to "catch" instructions on the fly from the game and thread better the commands to the GPU and back, meaning less bottlenecks in CPU heavy situations. Of course, the reverse was that nVIDIA's hw wasn't particularly shinning in DX12, but it did not had to be at the time.

So, yeah, I could call that a "patch" although they were talking about draw calls limitations for a while, "patch" which thankfully, in time, lead to DX12/Vulkan.

If it would have caught in the industry better, it would have been a win for their FX CPUs as well, as commands in Mantle/DX12/Vulkan can be sent to the GPU simultaneously by all cores and not just one at a time -> better performance as single threaded performance for graphics commands was less important.

Anyway, that was the talk at the time and it was kinda reflected in my experience with a R290.

 

[LoadsaMoney]

If Big Navi is faster than the 2080 Ti, its going to be a much higher price than it, as since they went premium in 2015, their cards have always been more expensive than Nvidias.

 

[EsaT]

The latest hype is that Console RT performance will put the RT performance of the 2080Ti to shame and that means good things for AMD's desktop parts. The much cheaper price is still a popular belief.

How realistic you think those claims are, well, that is up to you to decide.

Why such denial about performance?
It's not badly unrealistic.

For its rape&robbery ludicrous price 2080 Ti is only 35-40% faster than 5700 XT.
And GPU of next Xbox has 30% more processing units than 5700 XT.
Add architectural overhaul and Scarlett can well be fully in same ball park in general performance.
Also Turing's RT performance isn't really stellar with notable to huge performance penalty depending on amount of RT load of the game.
Hence higher fps 4K RT being pipe dream in heavy games...

Now why should RDNA2's RT performance be automatically worser?
And if Nvidia can improve it like rumoured, why AMD couldn't do that?
If anything Turing's RT penalty should tell it's time to consider different implementations!

 

[FoxEye]

But, if you change the sentence around and say Big Navi is 15% faster than the 3080Ti and the same price, then there would be lots of interest.

Not a bat's chance in hell.

AMD are still playing catch-up this gen.

 

[Gerard]

If Big Navi is faster than the 2080 Ti, its going to be a much higher price than it, as since they went premium in 2015, their cards have always been more expensive than Nvidias.

Not really, HBM was the factor in deciding price more so than anything as it was more costly than the gddr equivalent, that's no longer a factor for the time being so that's a chunk of savings right away.

 

[LePhuronn]

If Big Navi is faster than the 2080 Ti, its going to be a much higher price than it, as since they went premium in 2015, their cards have always been more expensive than Nvidias.

The entirely of Polaris, Navi and Radeon VII would disagree. Keep inhaling, bro

 

[LoadsaMoney]

Not really, HBM was the factor in deciding price more so than anything as it was more costly than the gddr equivalent, that's no longer a factor for the time being so that's a chunk of savings right away.

5700 XT didn't have HBM, yet it still cost more than the slightly faster 2070 Super, it didn't have extra HW for RT either, which that also has.

 

[Gerard]

5700 XT didn't have HBM, yet it still cost more than the slightly faster 2070 Super, it didn't have extra HW for RT either, which that also has.

You can get a 5700xt for around £360 if not lower, a 2070s is around £370. Yes the 2070 has rt support for the "vast range of games that support it" (have had it shoehorned in at the last minute at the behest of NVIDIA chucking some cash around). It's barely even a selling point right now, but will be in the future.

 

[EastCoastHandle]

So is it just F1 showing performance increases, in which case I don't understand the hype?

Ok, they just retested F1 2020 using Adrenaline 20.7.2 (from 20.7.1) and the results show a pretty drastic improvement at 1440p.


I wish I saved the old benchmark chart but for the 5700XT it was 111 or so if I recall correctly. Now it's a 121 FPS. That's 10 FPS bump with just the drivers!!!

And, a 5600Xt is on par with a 2060S/2070 . Outlier possibly but still wow none the less. Ok then, if RTG can dedicate bringing this kind of performance with RDNA 1. I now can see the possibility of double performance with RDNA 2!



Update notes (Death Stranding):

1. Updated the entire Series Radeon GPU results and examined it with the new Radeon 20.7.2 driver that AMD released. There are significant performance increases measured with this driver and the 5000 series of graphics cards, in particular, thus it is highly recommended to update to this new driver.

We have 2 games just released were the 5700xt either beats the 2070s (F1 2020) or ties it (Death Stranding). Normally, the 5700xt doesn't compete against a 2070s. Therefore, competing above it's weight class for such a mid'ish card (right now).

This shows how much RDNA can be leveraged given the amount of attention it's been given.

 

[Phixsator]

Look at that... Polaris as fast as a 980ti . So the hype finally came trough after a few years of waiting.

5700 XT didn't have HBM, yet it still cost more than the slightly faster 2070 Super, it didn't have extra HW for RT either, which that also has.

I guess that depends on the region you're in cause here in Denmark where I live the cheapest 2070 super with a poor cooler is about 120 pounds more one of the best 5700XTs.