AMD Navi 23 ‘NVIDIA Killer’ GPU Rumored to Support Hardware Ray Tracing, Coming Next Year

[ljt]

Unfornatley I think it will be. Judging by how they priced their 5000 series CPU's recently i.e. at INTEL prices or certainly not CHEAP as such... AMD as stated a few times not wanting to be classed as the budget solution anymore, they want the limelight... now, you can see this two ways... get in the limelight by being amazing to your customers and giving us a fair deal... however you can see that they also have to make money, the R&D money that's gone into 6000 series would be scary if we found out and they want the pickings of it... I just can't see my prices being too high, if anythign unfortunatley I think they could be too low... and I'm trying to be positive...

We shall see..

But if leaks of performance are anywhere near true. Then the 6800xt was slightly faster at raster performance than 3080, but a lot slower at ray tracing. Surely they can't price higher than £649 for reference as it's basically a tie with a 3080 overall.

 

[DDH]

Unfornatley I think it will be. Judging by how they priced their 5000 series CPU's recently i.e. at INTEL prices or certainly not CHEAP as such... AMD as stated a few times not wanting to be classed as the budget solution anymore, they want the limelight... now, you can see this two ways... get in the limelight by being amazing to your customers and giving us a fair deal... however you can see that they also have to make money, the R&D money that's gone into 6000 series would be scary if we found out and they want the pickings of it... I just can't see my prices being too high, if anythign unfortunatley I think they could be too low... and I'm trying to be positive...

We shall see..

I don't think the comparison to the 5000 series is correct. People are forgetting that before the launch of zen1 we were paying 400 dollars for a quad core. Now people are complaining about a 12 core for 549 which will probably outperform last gens 16core that launched for 799. And the 1800x launched for 499. 449 will get you a 5800x that will crush it.

I think the 6800xt will be less than 600

 

[Jonahun]

But if leaks of performance are anywhere near true. Then the 6800xt was slightly faster at raster performance than 3080, but a lot slower at ray tracing. Surely they can't price higher than £649 for reference as it's basically a tie with a 3080 overall.

They can price however they want, you have to make a decision, is that worth it for you or not.

I can't understand why people expect AMD will undercut Nvidia with 50-100-150$ if they have a competitive product?

 

[Raelgun]

They can price however they want, you have to make a decision, is that worth it for you or not.

I can't understand why people expect AMD will undercut Nvidia with 50-100-150$ if they have a competitive product?

Cos they want to buy the comparable Nvidia product at a cheaper price, thats why they want cheaper AMD.

 

[ljt]

They can price however they want, you have to make a decision, is that worth it for you or not.

I can't understand why people expect AMD will undercut Nvidia with 50-100-150$ if they have a competitive product?

Well by looks of it, it just edges ahead in raster, but loses in RT, so in my books that on par really. In which case, if there are 2 parts performing the same, I buy the cheapest.

Cos they want to buy the comparable Nvidia product at a cheaper price, thats why they want cheaper AMD.

I don't care who makes the GPU, I just look for the cheapest manufacturer. As above, if 2 products perform the same then I buy whoever is the cheapest

It's really simple.

I'll spell it out for you.

Scenario 1 - 3080 is £649 performs the same as a 6800XT priced at £699 - I buy the 3080

Scenario 2 - 3080 is £649 performs the same as a 6800XT priced at £599 - I buy the 6800XT

 

[KentMan]

Unfornatley I think it will be. Judging by how they priced their 5000 series CPU's recently i.e. at INTEL prices or certainly not CHEAP as such... AMD as stated a few times not wanting to be classed as the budget solution anymore, they want the limelight... now, you can see this two ways... get in the limelight by being amazing to your customers and giving us a fair deal... however you can see that they also have to make money, the R&D money that's gone into 6000 series would be scary if we found out and they want the pickings of it... I just can't see my prices being too high, if anythign unfortunatley I think they could be too low... and I'm trying to be positive...

We shall see..

See im kinda in the same mindset, however AMD must still realise they have an absolute mountain of Nvidias mindshare they need to climb before they can truly bathe in the Quan!! (Jerry Maguire)

I still firmly believe this could be there Zen moment, when they brought zen performance to market against Intel, while they didnt take the gaming crown, they made 8c 16t available to all really, so much so that the 6900 Intel chip was basically rendered obsolete over night at its price point.

AMD knew they had a killer multithread chip, and the start of their journey, its only now a few gens later are they able to charge market leadership prices, as they are now the market leaders.

Lisa Su is extremely shrewd, she knows they need to buy back the gpu faith, AMD knows they have basically let Nvidia own the gpu market for a good few years now, and im fairly certain she wont come in with a similar product at a similar price, as people will just stick with what they know.

It took AMD a good few years to turn CPU sales around, i think the GPU segment will be viewed in a similar light by them.

Im not expecting them to give cards away for free, but i am expecting them to really shake up the GPU market by offering similar performance at a really attractive price.

They still need to win over die hards, and you can only do that by covering all bases (Ray Tracing, Raster perf, DLSS etc) giving the die hards no option but to see that the products are now on par or superior.

You dont charge Nvidia money in an Nvidia Monopoly as AMD if your product does not beat Nvidia across the board, no one buys at that price, they just ride out the queue.

So while its currently hard times for Nvidia, its arguably worse for AMD, as they 10000% need to get their pricing right or it will just be more of the same from them, so near yet so far.

So as i pointed out at the start, this is probably their Zen1 moment in GPU segments, while they wont be the absolute best, they should charge a price that makes their product too attractive not to consider or choose.

My 2cps

 

[humbug]

They can price however they want, you have to make a decision, is that worth it for you or not.

I can't understand why people expect AMD will undercut Nvidia with 50-100-150$ if they have a competitive product?

Because Nvidia have the market share, and by some margin. The expectation is AMD will undercut Nvidia to make them more appealing which would help AMD claw back some of that share.
Its what they did to Intel and it worked.

 

[muon]

Cos they want to buy the comparable Nvidia product at a cheaper price, thats why they want cheaper AMD.

If anything, given the 5900X is more expensive than the 10900K, if Navi 21 XT is better than the 3080, it will be the same or higher.

Because Nvidia have the market share, and by some margin. The expectation is AMD will undercut Nvidia to make them more appealing which would help AMD claw back some of that share.
Its what they did to Intel and it worked.

I think that is debatable the 1700X and 1800X were quite expensive at $399 and $499. 7700K at the time was $305. 8700K came out at $359.

 

[KentMan]

If anything, given the 5900X is more expensive than the 10900K, if Navi 21 XT is better than the 3080, it will be the same or higher.

1800x was the 6900 competition, so no, in comparison it was cheap at half the price. Most people including myself bought the 1700 or 1600 options anyway


I think that is debatable the 1700X and 1800X were quite expensive at $399 and $499.

1800x competition was the 6900, and was. What half the price? Most people including myself bought the 1700 and 1600 anyhow

 

[Twinz]

Because Nvidia have the market share, and by some margin. The expectation is AMD will undercut Nvidia to make them more appealing which would help AMD claw back some of that share.
Its what they did to Intel and it worked.

I fear the lack of Nvidia stock changes the old equation.

 

[Raelgun]

Well by looks of it, it just edges ahead in raster, but loses in RT, so in my books that on par really. In which case, if there are 2 parts performing the same, I buy the cheapest.



I don't care who makes the GPU, I just look for the cheapest manufacturer. As above, if 2 products perform the same then I buy whoever is the cheapest

It's really simple.

I'll spell it out for you.

Scenario 1 - 3080 is £649 performs the same as a 6800XT priced at £699 - I buy the 3080

Scenario 2 - 3080 is £649 performs the same as a 6800XT priced at £599 - I buy the 6800XT

This is how people should be buying, but thats not reality these days sadly.

 

[Jonahun]

Cos they want to buy the comparable Nvidia product at a cheaper price, thats why they want cheaper AMD.

Sure, based on the stocks in the shops good luck for that. Even if they have stock, they won't drop prices, that's not Nvidia.

Intel is dropping prices on their 9th gen CPUs in webshops, 50$, who would have thought about something like that a couple of years ago?

@ljt buy whatever fits for you, and you can afford or like. I'm not price sensitive, so I'm waiting for the Biggest Big Navi, if that brings the performance I need... then I'll have it.

 

[Darujhistan]

All the NV boys thinking AMD are gonna make your NV cards cheaper - they ain't!

And why should they?

 

[pugheaven]

I don't think the comparison to the 5000 series is correct. People are forgetting that before the launch of zen1 we were paying 400 dollars for a quad core. Now people are complaining about a 12 core for 549 which will probably outperform last gens 16core that launched for 799. And the 1800x launched for 499. 449 will get you a 5800x that will crush it.

I think the 6800xt will be less than 600

The reason I mentioned CPU is, that I was using that compariosn based on it's nearest competitior which is INTEL... and they've not really undercut them, it's not like in the old days year ago when AMD and CYRIX were undercutting Intel... this time around, AMD thought hold on... we're not going to reduce prices, if anything we'll up them (as we're not the best out there) is what I meant.... I actually think the 5000 series is great, but once again expensive (not to other versions I just think CPU's are overpriced in general), but that's my thoughts, one mans expensive is another mans pocket money. I agree... I actually think the prices are good on 5000series when based in the current pricing structure, but that's not saying they're good value... they're good value because we're all instiutionalised into paying over the odds in the first place... (or I think we are), however, it's more about what the general public and people think because it's AMD we're all going to get a bargain... AMD will price accordingly to the market and the market is controlled recently by nVidia thus... the 6800XT imho will go right in at 3080 prices so £699 which was where I got that price from. And because 3080 isn't readily availabe and is commanding more, it could even come in higher but I hope it doesn;t.

But if leaks of performance are anywhere near true. Then the 6800xt was slightly faster at raster performance than 3080, but a lot slower at ray tracing. Surely they can't price higher than £649 for reference as it's basically a tie with a 3080 overall.

But because nto many people give two hoots about RT (I certainly couldnt' care less), I don't think that will actually change the prices at all... they'll price whatever is close to the 3080 and possibly undercut by 10%... whether it's good at RT or not... because 95% of AMD owners (and this is conjecture on my part) just want raw performance and don't care about RT, if that 6800XT is availabe for same or less money than 3080, then people will buy it... UNLESS you have to have RT... in whcih case you won't.

 

[humbug]

If anything, given the 5900X is more expensive than the 10900K, if Navi 21 XT is better than the 3080, it will be the same or higher.



I think that is debatable the 1700X and 1800X were quite expensive at $399 and $499. 7700K at the time was $305.

Its really not, the 1800X was comparable to the 6900K which was £800, the 1600 was £200 and a good all-rounder.

 

[muon]

People so quickly forget that AMD were caught red handed before.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3406763/amd-cuts-radeon-rx-5700-xt-prices-july-7.html

Its really not, the 1800X was comparable to the 6900K which was £800, the 1600 was £200 and good all-rounder.

Comparing it to a HEDT processor is pointless. The decision people were making was between the 7700K ($305) against the 1700 ($329) and upwards. Most of the people that bought Ryzen (including 1700X/1800X) wouldn't have bought a HEDT platform.

AMD brought additional performance to the mainstream table and priced it accordingly.

 

[KentMan]

Nvidia cards arent getting cheaper if AMD launched cheaper cards, mainly because retailers will keep the card prices high as they bought the stock at that price even if they have not received it yet.

Infact even if they do drop prices, the fact the cards are so rare means they will still sell at their current inflated prices.

AMD making Nvidia cards cheaper this time round wont happen, especially not before stock is plentiful and especially not while they lead with Ray Tracing and DLSS

 

[humbug]

People so quickly forget that AMD were caught red handed before.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3406763/amd-cuts-radeon-rx-5700-xt-prices-july-7.html



Comparing it to a HEDT processor is pointless. The decision people were making was between the 7700K ($305) against the 1700 ($329) and upwards. Most of the people that bought Ryzen (including 1700X/1800X)wouldn't have bought a HEDT platform.

AMD brought additional performance to the mainstream table and priced it accordingly.

THAT is the point, HEDT levels of performance for mainstream money, even the 1600 was trading blows with the 6800K for less than half the money.

 

[ljt]

This is how people should be buying, but thats not reality these days sadly.

It's how I buy things anyway. I'm brand agnostic.

@ljt buy whatever fits for you, and you can afford or like. I'm not price sensitive, so I'm waiting for the Biggest Big Navi, if that brings the performance I need... then I'll have it.

It's not so much about affordability. I could "afford" a 3090, but the performance it offers to me isn't worth what they are asking (to me anyway), Gaming isn't worth spending £1000's or more on a GPU, I wouldn't feel like I was getting my moneys worth. Equally when 2 products perform the same, but one charges more, why pay more?

All the NV boys thinking AMD are gonna make your NV cards cheaper - they ain't!

And why should they?

I hope that wasn't aimed at me. I'm not a fan of any company

 

[KentMan]

People so quickly forget that AMD were caught red handed before.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/3406763/amd-cuts-radeon-rx-5700-xt-prices-july-7.html



Comparing it to a HEDT processor is pointless. The decision people were making was between the 7700K ($305) against the 1700 ($329) and upwards. Most of the people that bought Ryzen (including 1700X/1800X) wouldn't have bought a HEDT platform.

AMD brought additional performance to the mainstream table and priced it accordingly.

Its really not pointless if i need HEDT chip for a specific workload and my only option is 6900, along comes the 1800x doing it better for cheaper, id be stupid not to buy in, in this scenario AMD wins, and there was a fair few people who bought them for. HEDT tasks even with the limits the platform gave.

So no, stop spouting your nonsense