AMD on the road to recovery.

[humbug]

Besides that, lots of positive. Platform support, pricing remain constant (instead of the HUGE inflations amd shoved down our throats) even when it had absolute and complete domination of the cpu market space.

Platform support: what do you mean by that, Intel make you change the motherboard after every generational refresh.

pricing remain constant: Historically the CPU remained the same also, small price increments for small performance increments.

instead of the HUGE inflations amd shoved down our throats: that needs explaining, AMD have done nothing but push the cost to performance ratio down, significantly. Its one reason Intel are not as profitable these days.

ASUS does cashbacks should that be illegal too? what about just out right under pricing a competitor? how is it really any different.

No more discounts for bulk buying because some court might not like it? ooh look AMD have a monopoly on consoles maybe someone should let the courts know.

the whole thing is ridiculous

Cashback's are not illegal, never have been.

 

[humbug]

The thing that investors are seriously worried about at present is the sort of example i'll give you here.

In the last quarter Intel earned $4.7 Billion in revenue from data centre.
AMD only earned about $1.85 Billion in revenue from data centre.

However revenue is not profit, it does not include the cost of turning in that revenue, you would deduct that cost from the revenue and with that you're left with profit.

So, from $4.7 Billion revenue Intel earned $200 Million profit, about 4%
From $1.85 Billion AMD earned $490 Million profit, about 32%.

Intel are practically giving away their data centre products for cost to NOT stop AMD from growing their market share with 32% profit margins.
If it gets just one step worse than that AMD will have continued to gain market share from Intel, at 32% profit, while Intel will be losing money on what was previously their most profitable business.

In 2016 Intel earned $19 Billion revenue in data centre, with $8.5 Billion profit. 50% margin.

On top of that AMD employ about 14,000 people, Intel employ about 120,000 people.

And AMD are about to swing a 12lb sledge hammer at the market, this to Intel's butt end of a plastic handled screw driver.

Oof....

 

[humbug]

Who cares what dell fessed up, the courts determined that Intel was innocent. I mean come on, if it was AMD instead of Intel and the courts determined they were innocent you wouldnt be bringing up any anticompetitive practices.

AMD copied Intel's early designs, i quoted it and conceded it as true in my original post.

 

[humbug]

It means that Intel makes it known what CPUs will support what motherboards, and they support it day one. Unlike some competitors with whom you have no idea what CPU will support what motherboard - requries you to spam all threads in various forums to make them keep their promise and have to wait 2 years four your now 5 year old motherboard to support a 2 year old outdated cpu.

Thats not true, we've been throught his 50 times and you keep repeating something that's factually wrong. 2600k to 6700k had a 45% performance increase in MT workloads. 1700 to 5600x has a 35% performance incraese. Why do you feel the need to keep repeating stuff thats actually not true? I really don't get it, I mean sure, you like AMD, but is that a reason to actually lie? Wtf

AMD promised up to 4 years of support for AM4 motherboards, the Ryzen 5800X3D makes that 5 years of support.

Why would you compare an older AMD Ryzen 7 to a current AMD Ryzen 5? Generation to generation would be Ryzen 1600X to Ryzen 5600X, that's Ryzen 5 to Ryzen 5.

Really? Can you explain to me where are teh performance to price ratio increases between zen 2 and zen3? Afaik the 5600x is slower than the 3700x in MT performance for almost the same price. Also the 5800x is WAY slower than the 3900x in MT for what, a 10% discount? Latest gen of amd cpus have lower performance to price ratio than older ones

Again you're comparing the Ryzen 7, this time a later Ryzen 7, to a Ryzen 5, you're straw-manning.

 

[humbug]

It took them 2 years to provide zen 3 support to x370. You call that good support?? 2 freaking years? LOL

Im not the one comparing them, amd is comaparing them by pricing them similarly. I dont care about what names amd or intel decide to put on their CPUs, I care about the price. You said AMD increased the performance per cost ration, and I just gave you clear examples when that's absolutely false, amd gave us slower CPUs per euro than their previous gen. What name they decided to give on these cpus is irrelevant. If the new 6core zen 4 is called R9 7950x and costs 400 euros would you claim thats a huge pricecut cause the previous R9 wsa 700? Of course not, names are irrelevant

2 Years? i know there was a time when AMD said they couldn't support Zen 3 on first gen AM4 motherboards due to most of them only having 16MB BIOS roms, Zen 3 needed 32MB roms, they did say those with 32MB roms could support Zen 3 if they wanted to, MSI had 32MB roms and they did support Zen 3.
After an outcry AMD went back to look at it and figured out that if they removed all support for all other generations of Zen from their firmware they could support Zen 3, it just meant that once you updated the BIOS you were stuck on Zen 3, that was it, no other support.
I don't remember exactly how long it took them to do that, but it was nothing like 2 years, that is a massive exaggeration.
------------

In 2017 i replaced my Core i5 4690K @ 4.6Ghz with a Ryzen 1600.
This first image here is why, the second image is the result.
The 4690K was £240, the 1600 £200.

 

[humbug]

one cpu is 3-4years older than the other and only 4 cores vs 6 shocker

Even you have to admit, that is quite shocking.

Imagine my surprise when i installed the thing...

 

[humbug]

AMD revenue warning signals deep chip slump; shares dive 4% | CNN Business

Chipmaker Advanced Micro Devices Inc on Thursday provided third-quarter revenue estimates that were about a billion dollars less than previously forecast, signaling the chip slump could be much worse than expected.

edition.cnn.com

Make Zen 4 a bit cheaper.

 

[humbug]

Advanced Micro Devices Non-GAAP EPS of $0.67 misses by $0.03, revenue of $5.57B misses by $80M

• Advanced Micro Devices press release (NASDAQ:AMD): Q3 Non-GAAP EPS of $0.67 misses by $0.03.
• Revenue of $5.57B (+29.2% Y/Y) misses by $80M.
• Shares +2.3%.
• For the fourth quarter of 2022, AMD expects revenue to be approximately $5.5 billion, plus or minus $300 million vs. $5.94B consensus, an increase of approximately 14% year-over-year and flat sequentially. Year-over-year and sequentially, the Embedded and Data Center segments are expected to grow. AMD expects non-GAAP gross margin to be approximately 51% in the fourth quarter of 2022.
  
  For the full year 2022, AMD expects revenue to be approximately $23.5 billion, plus or minus $300 million from prior outlook of $26.3B vs. $23.81B consensus, an increase of approximately 43% over 2021 led by growth in the Embedded and Data Center segments. AMD expects non-GAAP gross margin to be approximately 52% for 2022.

So not all good news but there are some interesting takeaways from it.

First the bad news, Client revenue is down 40% YoY, that is where the lower than expected revenue comes from, they just aren't selling as many Laptop's and OEM Desktops with AMD stuff in them as they did last year.
That's important but not really surprising in the current climate.

$1 Billion for that

Ok....

Datacentre up 45% YoY, $1.6 Billion for that, nice...
Gaming revenue up 14% YoY. $1.3 Billion.

Embedded up 1549%, $1.3 Billion, this is off the back of Xilinx, as well as Samsung Mobile Phones, and Tesla / Mercedes Benz.
This is a new sector for AMD and already its paying off with well over a Billion in revenue right from the get go.

Free Cash-flow, that's unallocated money in the coffers, $842 Million.

Expected revenue for 2022: $23.5 Billion

To put that in to context Nvidia earned $26.91 Billion in 2021, that's an all time record for them and up from $16.68 Billion in 2020, they will not be earning that this year.

In 2021 AMD earned $16.43 Billion
In 2020 $6.43 Billion
In 2019 $6.73 Billion
In 2018 $6.47 Billion
In 2017 $5.25 Billion
In 2016 $4.31 Billion
In 2015 $3.99 Billion

So in 2022 alone AMD have earned almost as much as they did in 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019 put together.


I think anyone who says this has been a bad year for AMD must be joking

 

[humbug]

@SS-89 Humbugs maths again....

Oh #### off!

 

[humbug]

Disaster Q4 results for Intel. Will AMD be better? Will DC revenue pull them through?

Intel 'stumbled,' CEO says; shares drop 9.5% as loss forecast

Intel Corp said on Thursday it expects to lose money in the current quarter, surprising investors with a bleaker-than-expected outlook for both the PC market and slowing growth in its key data center division.

www.reuters.com

They are blaming it on falling PC sales, is it though?

Its still higher than pre-pandemic.

 

[humbug]

The proof is in the margins, Intel are having to sell ever lower to compete with AMD, they have already said this themselves, the margins on 13'th gen are virtually nothing, Intel's data-centre turnover is 4X as high as AMD's but they are only making a third as much profit from that as AMD, Intel make $200 Million from $4.5 Billion turn over in a quarter while AMD make $500 million profit from $1.6 Billion turnover.

Intel are no longer pulling all the leavers to stop AMD, they are just trying to stay relevant, that slide where Intel compared their cash stack to AMD's, remember that? Its all gone, guess what happened to it...

 

[humbug]

Intel margins 39%, AMD 52%

In the Bulldozer days AMD margins were 35%, with that AMD was going bust.

 

[humbug]

Maybe AMD can lower their AM5 pricing to make them more desirable then lol

Instead AMD are taking us to the cleaners with their products

They have, the problem is DDR5 motherboard prices.

Retailers are pushing AMD CPU's because they make $20 to $40 on those while they only make $5 on Intel's.

 

[humbug]

Something that Intel would never do - lol. I very much doubt that given the economic headwinds etc. that AMD is trying to take their customers to the cleaners.

The 7900XT is over priced, though still better value than the 4080, Ryzen 7000 series was expensive compared with the better 13'th gen, they weren't over priced but 13'th gen at a similar price were better, AMD fixed that now.

By the same token an RTX 3080 is £800, a 6800XT is £600, an RTX 3060 is £350, an RX 6650XT is £300 and the RX 6650XT is quite a bit better.

AMD are not doing bad, certainly a lot better than Nvidia, Intel are competitive but they are doing that selling near cost and forcing retailers to sell near cost.

 

[humbug]

Intel - rock and hard place. can't increase prices, can't decrease prices.

Yeah...

Look at the Q4 2021 Operating margins ($3.8 Billion, 37%) to Q4 2022 ($0.7 Billion 11%)

That's serious. that's a very real problem, they can't keep going like this for long, the cash stash they would lean on to prop themselves up against this is already gone. If you can't generate any money after costs you can't R&D your next product. There's no money...

 

[humbug]

Good, that's why I buy Intel, pay less - get more. I hope they keep on undercharging

Intel need to push margins up, preferably by improving their technology to be more cost efficient.

If they don't i don't know what will happen, worst case for them is becoming a fab only business making X86 products for AMD, i can't invision a world where AMD are the only X86 provider, but its possible.

Be careful what you wish for...

 

[humbug]

Read above @Bencher

 

[humbug]

Let me put it as simple as humanly possible. The only reason amd exists in the consumer space, is thanks to TSMC. With nm parity, they absolutely stand no chance, and it's clear to see for everyone that's not absolutely blinded with bias. Even the 3d cache was a TSM eureka moment. AMD wouldn't have a single competitive product in the desktop market without TSMC's fab superiority.

Now whether the desktop / DIY market is that small that's irrelevant, I don't know

It never just one thing. The truth is somewhere in between, yes TSMC have better fabs, but AMD MCM and 3D stacking technology is just as important.

 

[humbug]

But 3d stacking had nothing to do with AMD, it was all TSMC.

TSMC manufacture AMD CPU's, they don't design them.

 

[humbug]

The 3d stacking and packaging is all TSMC. It's not AMD's invention. I don't know how else to explain it, it's like saying 3nm CPU's is apple's innovation. It isn't.

If that were true TSMC would not need AMD, we would have TSMC branded Ryzen 7950X3D's....

Come on, you're not thinking this through properly.