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Poll: AMD Screws Gamers: Sponsorships Likely Block DLSS

Are AMD out of order if they are found to be blocking DLSS on Starfield

  • Yes

  • No

Results are only viewable after voting.
RavenXXX2 said:
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Nvidia sponsored games with FSR in at launch.
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That chart already has tons of information, but I think the most relevant part has been left out:
Did game so-and-so have FSR on the consoles at launch?

Since Nvidia aren't in consoles*, what would raise major suspicious with me would be a game which launches on console with FSR, has Nvidia sponsorship and where the PC version only has DLSS and not FSR.

I have no idea if such a game exists (and this whole controversy has mostly bored me at this stage, so I doubt I want to google that!), but if any did I cannot think of any innocent explanation.

*Yes, they are in the Switch since they don't support DLSS on Tegra any Switch games which need upscalers... tend to use FSR!
 
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At best this is currently nothing more than a wild conspiracy theory. With no evidence, no leaked emails, no leaked contracts, no disgruntled ex staff coming out saying "X", no claims from Nvidia stating "we approached dev X to add DLSS and they replied - AMD says no, sorry". Nothing at all.

The only thing they are going on is that Amd wouldn't comment to them providing the exact wording they were rudely demanding. If someone asks you a stupid question, you likely ignore it. IE don't feed the troll. However their aggressive accusational approach is likely why they may not have got the response they wanted, it's gutter reporting akin to some tabloid like the Star. Hwu may be trying to make a stance, to make them some kind of trusted authority on tech, this has badly damaged their rep and back fired to those who expect impartial honest reporting.

Anyone can start a rumour or make something up, then claim the accused didn't comment or directly deny it, thus they are therefore guilty. I bet if you start a rumour stating company X employ's children or worse then ask them to publicly respond, they likely wont respond with a well thought out PR response to appease you. They will likely ignore it, or state that they comply with laws etc, and may not address directly the fantasy question posed. Some companies do take the higher ground by not directly entertaining nonsense. - That may or may not be the case here.

It is ofc possible hwu are entirely correct, it's possible they are partially correct. It maybe somewhere in the middle. It's however likely nonsense.

For example the current games in the complaint listed by hwu are all made primarily for consoles that use AMD hardware, AMD come in and assist with development with some 'sponsorship' deal or equivalent, and also help provide FSR implementation. The dev's want to port it to PC, the dev's and AMD all agree that a 'good enough' upscaling system is in place supporting ALL hardware for the PC. - Jobs done everyone is happy, how can they not be ?. Adding DLSS at this stage just costs the dev's more time and money for supporting platform that will likely have less sales than the consoles, does it add a huge benefit over fsr ? No. Will some PC end users appreciate it ? Yes. Does it make AMD bad ? No. What if AMD told the Dev's "no dlss" ? - It maybe the case - however 33% of the games mentioned have dlss as well - so It's likely not the case. The amount of titles is so small it's hardly an issue anyway.

Going quickly through the modern list that Hwu provide taking issue that no dlss
Star wars jedi Survivor - developed primarily for consoles - Has Fsr
Resident Evil 4 - developed primarily for consoles - Has Fsr
The Callisto Protocal - developed primarily for consoles - Has Fsr
Saints Row (2022) - developed primarily for consoles - Has Fsr
Sniper elite 5 - unknown primary platform - Has Fsr

The Last of us Part 1 - developed primarily for consoles Has Fsr & dlss
Uncharted - Has dlss - developed primarily for consoles Has Fsr & dlss
Forespoken - Has dlss - developed primarily for consoles Has Fsr & dlss

So what I take from what's going on is we can rejoice as the PCMR and stop bickering between ourselves and go back to the good old - consoles are bad and ports suck.

None of the games are designed primarily for PC (I couldn't find exact dev's statements about Sniper elite so maybe wrong). Whilst technically consoles are now almost specialist PC's so cross platform isn't a huge a task as it used to be, it's not just as simple as recompiling an exe. What we should be complaining about is where are the PC exclusive titles that can actually make use of the awesome expensive hardware we have and push the boundaries.

Going through the hwu list of current Nvidia sponsored DLLS games that had fsr at launch - 8 out of 17 didn't. - That's basically half.. Dev's/Nvidia this time are actually harming pc gamers by only including dlss as that wont work on anyone's but nv's newest hardware. It's clear where the actual issue is. Although I expect they just came to the same conclusion - a "good enough' upscaling system is in place", it wont work for everyone, but it will cost more time and money to add fsr. Jobs done.


Maybe they can add it here :)
 
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Vexr said:
HUB makes a video claiming that AMD is blocking DLSS in their sponsored titles, deducing this from AMD's (infamously amateurish) GPU PR department, who responded with a suboptimal / vague / non-committal response when directly queried about this. HUB then thought they had the basis of a video to whip up the peasants into (more) of a frenzy against anti-consumerist practices in the GPU market, this time by AMD.

Got blowback.

Puts out another video about how they're laughing at those in their comment section, about how wrong headed their detractors are who can only be die hard AMD fan boys, and explicitly invites dislikes and un-subscribing from their channel.

It's weird seeing HUB take this tone. Perhaps it's an attempt to be edgy in an era of poor hardware that inspires no excitement to objectively review, and all the plaudits are going to partisan drama queens, and they're attempting to get in on that. Or maybe they're just really salty for once. The thing is, if you want that kind of content, you can go to streamers like Frame Chasers for this new style of douchey hardware commentary (he's a not exactly a big fan HUB either, but his take is at least entertaining :cry:)

Seeing HUB abandon their usual milquetoast role and attempt to stir it up with their viewers simply doesn't play to their strengths IMO. I respected their milquetoast-style neutrality as one of the things that made them fairly unique.

I need to check it myself, but a commenter cited MLID as having a source stating that AMD aren't enforcing a block of DLSS in their sponsored titles. Boy would that be something if that turns out to be true. Which brings me right back to the first vid. If it was ironclad confirmed that AMD are enforcing a blocking of DLSS, HUB might be justified sticking their oar in, but they simply didn't have the evidence of to back it up, especially not enough to evoke the emotive response to AMD they were pushing for in their first vid.
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Very well put. If the MLID thing turns out to be true, it's would be more the fact that AMD doesn't want the company they are sponsoring actively talking about their direct competition, which you know... is how sponsorships tend to work.

If that does turn out to be true the HUB back tracking videos are going to be a treat.
 
Raelgun said:
So you know exact investment put in?

This is corporate business you realize?

Do you realise the amount of money that's involved.

Do you even know the average pay of Californian engineers?
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All questions, but some actual counter-arguments? I see none, so far.
 
We're at almost 30 pages of people erasing from their mind that an upscaler that works for every card is a better use of time to implement

I still recall a number of tweets which appeared to be from an amd rep laughing at comments that AMD could tell the devs what to do.

Given the budget of these games and what AMD offers (what exactly does AMD offer) I would love to hear exactly what influence AMD has over things the developers care about.

Then to follow up, if AMD can influence the upscaler options, do the developers actually care about upscalers at all. Are they so easily swayed into ignoring the work to implement higher quality DLSS for some cards and merely spending time to install FSR for all cards.

Been waiting since the first page for a developer to snitch but I'm betting they really don't care less and if they install FSR first there's much less reason to go back and do DLSS. Do it the other way round and you fail to cover most cards so you'd have to go back and install another upscaler if it matters that much.
 
Hotwired said:
We're at almost 30 pages of people erasing from their mind that an upscaler that works for every card is a better use of time to implement

I still recall a number of tweets which appeared to be from an amd rep laughing at comments that AMD could tell the devs what to do.

Given the budget of these games and what AMD offers (what exactly does AMD offer) I would love to hear exactly what influence AMD has over things the developers care about.

Then to follow up, if AMD can influence the upscaler options, do the developers actually care about upscalers at all. Are they so easily swayed into ignoring the work to implement higher quality DLSS for some cards and merely spending time to install FSR for all cards.

Been waiting since the first page for a developer to snitch but I'm betting they really don't care less and if they install FSR first there's much less reason to go back and do DLSS. Do it the other way round and you fail to cover most cards so you'd have to go back and install another upscaler if it matters that much.
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Here's an IF example to go:

AMD offers whatever the hell it is they offer when "sponsoring" a game. In return they want FSR installed.

Dev says whatever and installs it. Everyone gets an upscaler. Even if it's not the one they prefer. Maybe DLSS gets added but the basic issue of needing an upscaler is already resolved so there's no game breaking urgency.

Nvidia offers whatever the hell it is they offer when "sponsoring" a game. In return they want DLSS installed.

Dev says whatever and installs it. But if this is a graphically intensive game that needs an upscaler to save weak hardware then FSR will have to be installed to cover the other cards. If the devs think it doesn't matter then you get a game that only has DLSS and will never get another upscaler because the first one wasn't important.


There is no way the developers are being bullied into accepting weird terms they aren't happy with from a card maker. Not when a game costs as much as a high budget film.
 
I'm curious. Would it be possible to have DLSS work from that really good, modern looking nvidia control panel? If so what is stopping nvidia from working on this stuff themselves? Nvidia would tell you it isn't but maybe a programmer or something could give us the real answer?
 
D1craig said:
I'm curious. Would it be possible to have DLSS work from that really good, modern looking nvidia control panel? If so what is stopping nvidia from working on this stuff themselves? Nvidia would tell you it isn't but maybe a programmer or something could give us the real answer?
Click to expand...


Dlss requires the game engine's motion vectors to work, therefore they need the developer to embed the dlss api into the game engine. Doing it outside of the game engine as you are suggesting is a hack and 1) developers will not like graphics drivers hacking their game and 2) these dlss hacks may get gamers banned in online games for injecting cheats and 3) this would never be simple to implement, Nvidia would have to do custom programming for every single game
 
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Vexr said:
HUB makes a video claiming that AMD is blocking DLSS in their sponsored titles, deducing this from AMD's (infamously amateurish) GPU PR department, who responded with a suboptimal / vague / non-committal response when directly queried about this. HUB then thought they had the basis of a video to whip up the peasants into (more) of a frenzy against anti-consumerist practices in the GPU market, this time by AMD.

Got blowback.

Puts out another video about how they're laughing at those in their comment section, about how wrong headed their detractors are who can only be die hard AMD fan boys, and explicitly invites dislikes and un-subscribing from their channel.

It's weird seeing HUB take this tone. Perhaps it's an attempt to be edgy in an era of poor hardware that inspires no excitement to objectively review, and all the plaudits are going to partisan drama queens, and they're attempting to get in on that. Or maybe they're just really salty for once. The thing is, if you want that kind of content, you can go to streamers like Frame Chasers for this new style of douchey hardware commentary (he's a not exactly a big fan HUB either, but his take is at least entertaining :cry:)

Seeing HUB abandon their usual milquetoast role and attempt to stir it up with their viewers simply doesn't play to their strengths IMO. I respected their milquetoast-style neutrality as one of the things that made them fairly unique.

I need to check it myself, but a commenter cited MLID as having a source stating that AMD aren't enforcing a block of DLSS in their sponsored titles. Boy would that be something if that turns out to be true. Which brings me right back to the first vid. If it was ironclad confirmed that AMD are enforcing a blocking of DLSS, HUB might be justified sticking their oar in, but they simply didn't have the evidence of to back it up, especially not enough to evoke the emotive response to AMD they were pushing for in their first vid.
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They’re not wrong though. As upsetting as it is, every single comment they’ve adressed is nothing but fanboy trash.

Funny thing is, most of this thread contains the same arguments. Putting two and two together gives you… ohhhhh

Oh and mentioning MLID as anything other than a joke? Yeah.. can’t get more obvious than that.
 
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Vexr said:
HUB makes a video claiming that AMD is blocking DLSS in their sponsored titles, deducing this from AMD's (infamously amateurish) GPU PR department, who responded with a suboptimal / vague / non-committal response when directly queried about this. HUB then thought they had the basis of a video to whip up the peasants into (more) of a frenzy against anti-consumerist practices in the GPU market, this time by AMD.

Got blowback.

Puts out another video about how they're laughing at those in their comment section, about how wrong headed their detractors are who can only be die hard AMD fan boys, and explicitly invites dislikes and un-subscribing from their channel.

It's weird seeing HUB take this tone. Perhaps it's an attempt to be edgy in an era of poor hardware that inspires no excitement to objectively review, and all the plaudits are going to partisan drama queens, and they're attempting to get in on that. Or maybe they're just really salty for once. The thing is, if you want that kind of content, you can go to streamers like Frame Chasers for this new style of douchey hardware commentary (he's a not exactly a big fan HUB either, but his take is at least entertaining :cry:)

Seeing HUB abandon their usual milquetoast role and attempt to stir it up with their viewers simply doesn't play to their strengths IMO. I respected their milquetoast-style neutrality as one of the things that made them fairly unique.

I need to check it myself, but a commenter cited MLID as having a source stating that AMD aren't enforcing a block of DLSS in their sponsored titles. Boy would that be something if that turns out to be true. Which brings me right back to the first vid. If it was ironclad confirmed that AMD are enforcing a blocking of DLSS, HUB might be justified sticking their oar in, but they simply didn't have the evidence of to back it up, especially not enough to evoke the emotive response to AMD they were pushing for in their first vid.
Click to expand...

I need to check it myself, but a commenter cited MLID as having a source stating that AMD aren't enforcing a block of DLSS in their sponsored titles
Click to expand...

He does, 'its in his latest video, 2 hours long and can't be bothered to dig out a single sentence in all that.

DLSS is not blocked but if AMD say that they throw Bethesda under the bus. Many made this point to HUB who ignored it, like they did with many making good points.
 
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