*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

[nashathedog]

Bit simplistic. Wouldn't work for milk.

Probably wouldn't work for AMD either. What if those sums come out with a higher price than Intel? What if they had to charge more for a lower performing CPU?

Businesses don't sell in a vacuum. There are, usually, competitors.

Personally, I think they will absolutely use Intel's prices as a starting point. From there, they will add or subtract based on a number of factors, but they will certainly consider the opposition's pricing.

They've got too if they want to claw back consumers, That said I'm hoping the 6 core will only cost a little more than Intel's mainstream i7. I may be tempted to wait for Intels 6 core coffeelake release if Ryzen isn't as good as we all hope it is or if it's overpriced. I'm on a 2 year old 4790k so there's no point in me going with a 4 core.

That puts it at least 70% higher IPC than Piledriver.

Sounds good

 

[Colzy]

Do you even know where you are?
It's all enthusiasts with nothing else to spend their money on and somehow think having a 5% increase with no real world application will validate their existence. Or something.

I spend my money on Whisky at the moment. I've probably spent only a few hundred on this PC since I bought it (gfx card, SSD), and a larger screen.

Anyway, it's less the CPU itself I suspect and more the motherboard to be frank. And if I'm effectively building a new PC, I'd like to get a new PC.

Its a few things. By default (on Auto), the mobo varies voltage to the CPU - no problem technically - but it ends up overvolting it considerably and makes the CPU way hotter than it ever should be (yes, I have an aftermarket cooler). I also can't get a stable overclock out of the CPU - 4.2Ghz is *almost* stable but just not quite. So I'm back at stock anyway. Lately the PC has just been locking up for no good reason at all on occasion. I'm wondering if the default mobo settings did some damage to the CPU before I realised the issue some time ago (and before I bought a better cooler)

Anyway throughout there have just been various hassles with it. Next time, i'll make sure to get a better quality board.

 

[~>Dg<~]

you know what i just thought about and its quite funny.

many on four cores wanting six cores or more yet in many gaming debates ohh four cores is better. .

 

[StarShock]

you know what i just thought about and its quite funny.

many on four cores wanting six cores or more yet in many gaming debates ohh four cores is better. .

yep, this is definitely true. Though it does show how much us 4c8t people are begging for a place to upgrade to.

I think the hope is that games start making use of more cores, which I'm pretty sure I've been hoping since I got my athlon x2 in '06

 

[nashathedog]

I imagine console games are having to take advantage of multiple cores due to the rubbish single core performance that their Jaguar cpu's offer, Hopefully that means PC ports will start doing the same thing more and more.

 

[DragonQ]

you know what i just thought about and its quite funny.

many on four cores wanting six cores or more yet in many gaming debates ohh four cores is better. .

Only because:

1) Quad core chips tend to overclock better
2) Current hex core chips either have crap IPC (AMD) or are part of a more expensive platform that isn't necessarily worth the extra cost for gaming (Intel) compared to the available quad core chips.

Summit Ridge shouldn't suffer from the second issue, but we'll see regarding clock speeds. If the hex core clocks to say 200 MHz lower than the quad core on average, I'd say that makes it a much better all round chip and a better choice for gaming going forward too.

 

[StarShock]

I imagine console games are having to take advantage of multiple cores due to the rubbish single core performance that their Jaguar cpu's offer, Hopefully that means PC ports will start doing the same thing more and more.

I hope so, though I fear most console games get hamstrung by the GPU performance, and most development time will be spent working around that.

We are starting to see games getting better at multi-core. BF1, GTA5, as examples, though even then with each extra core you see diminishing returns. And in the majority of cases you'll get GPU bottlenecks before CPU.

And while I'm looking at getting the hex core for myself, assuming correct price to performance. I think a quad ryzen with smt at a low enough price point might be the best option of the lot for most people

 

[flopper]

people actually use the pc for more than gaming.
4 core recommendation is a bad idea.

 

[Wah007]

people actually use the pc for more than gaming.
4 core recommendation is a bad idea.

Not unless it's a 4 core and 8 thread cpu. I think that will handle things just fine like the 6700k.

 

[FoxEye]

people actually use the pc for more than gaming.
4 core recommendation is a bad idea.

If we exclude gaming, then I'd confidently say the vast majority of people won't even stress a dual core CPU. Indeed most laptops are dual core at this point (HT, yes).

People who do video transcoding, compiling, etc, are not the norm, by far.

 

[Boomstick777]

If we exclude gaming, then I'd confidently say the vast majority of people won't even stress a dual core CPU. Indeed most laptops are dual core at this point (HT, yes).

People who do video transcoding, compiling, etc, are not the norm, by far.

Agreed.

 

[nashathedog]

I hope so, though I fear most console games get hamstrung by the GPU performance, and most development time will be spent working around that.

We are starting to see games getting better at multi-core. BF1, GTA5, as examples, though even then with each extra core you see diminishing returns. And in the majority of cases you'll get GPU bottlenecks before CPU.

And while I'm looking at getting the hex core for myself, assuming correct price to performance. I think a quad ryzen with smt at a low enough price point might be the best option of the lot for most people

If it's priced right it'll be a good competitor for the mainstream i5's and i7's. The platform appears to be decently spec'd and with AMD saying it'll be the main platform up until 2020 it'll offer an upgrade path for those that want one. I may grab a 6 core on release and when the final 2020 cpu models for the platform release grab the best 8 core they have.
I dislike the fact that with Intel the Z97 board I bought on release with my 4790k has never offered me an upgrade option.
Starting from scratch with each upgrade can be costly. So it'll save me a few hundred quid which can go towards a better cpu.

 

[Jono8]

If it's priced right it'll be a good competitor for the mainstream i5's and i7's. The platform appears to be decently spec'd and with AMD saying it'll be the main platform up until 2020 it'll offer an upgrade path for those that want one. I may grab a 6 core on release and when the final 2020 cpu models for the platform release grab the best 8 core they have.
I dislike the fact that with Intel the Z97 board I bought on release with my 4790k has never offered me an upgrade option.
Starting from scratch with each upgrade can be costly. So it'll save me a few hundred quid which can go towards a better cpu.

I'm on X99 with a 5820k and was hoping to go 8 core in the future with Broadwell-E but the 8 core cpu's are £1k!!!

As I don't really want to shell out for a new motherboard so soon I am just hoping the 8 core zen forces Intel to adjust their pricing to more sensible levels!

 

[jigger]

I'm on X99 with a 5820k and was hoping to go 8 core in the future with Broadwell-E but the 8 core cpu's are £1k!!!

As I don't really want to shell out for a new motherboard so soon I am just hoping the 8 core zen forces Intel to adjust their pricing to more sensible levels!

Zen would have to amazing for Intel to drop prices. I'd probably keep saving if I was you.

 

[Harlequin]

intel wont drop prices - they didn't when AMD were last on top with the jim keller designed S939 X2

 

[~>Dg<~]

i personally dont think intel will be slower. just that amd will have decent newer cpus.prices wont change.intel still be quicker.

cant see how intel who basically if they want could crush amd at any point jsut are too strong.they wouldnt let amd take over and i cant see after nearly 15 years before amd was competitive how you come back from that.

so close now cant wait to see some actual benchmarks . this place is going to explode !!!!

 

[Yaayuh!]

i personally dont think intel will be slower. just that amd will have decent newer cpus.prices wont change.intel still be quicker.

cant see how intel who basically if they want could crush amd at any point jsut are too strong.they wouldnt let amd take over and i cant see after nearly 15 years before amd was competitive how you come back from that.

so close now cant wait to see some actual benchmarks . this place is going to explode !!!!

The hype is real

Also, for goodness sake DG it's been years now, sort your typing skills out!

 

[mattyc1977]

I think this is the most frequent forum post I have ever continued to check. I NEED a upgrade from my 3770k. Hurry up AMD, I am ready.....

 

[Perfect_Chaos]

Has anyone else done the straight lazy measurement of the Zen to Zen+ performance chart? Zen+ appears to be 20% better in IPC.

So i doubt I'll be moving from x99 until 2+ years then, not switching for a fairly measly <%10 improvement. Coffee lake may not tempt me either or even be worth it for that matter, probably Ice lake or Zen+ then since they seem to be out around the same time.

 

[meldarthx]

i personally dont think intel will be slower. just that amd will have decent newer cpus.prices wont change.intel still be quicker.

cant see how intel who basically if they want could crush amd at any point jsut are too strong.they wouldnt let amd take over and i cant see after nearly 15 years before amd was competitive how you come back from that.

so close now cant wait to see some actual benchmarks . this place is going to explode !!!!

AHAHAHA not going to happen; Intel still sits in the eyes of the law as monopoly in CPUs specially x86/x87 cpus. They would get hammered - not just in the US but also in the EU - specially in the EU as they are hurting for money and would go after Intel with zeal.