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*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

Awesome! ASROCK to update the 939Dual-SATA2 to AM4 and DDR4 via a new FutureCPU riser board. Ryzen with both PCI-E and AGP 8x!

 
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eddiew said:
Mildly disappointed in the clocks for the 4-6c units... Had hoped they go higher due to less power draw, but this feels like they're failed 8 cores with bits disabled and reduced frequencies :/

Still, maybe they'll turn out to be the mutts nuts for overclocking, or be unlockable like those old 3-cores back in the day :D
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People really need to understand, the 2011 platform is expensive and largely for enthusiasts. The less cores more clocks things is mostly based around the 140W limits, Intel didn't want to go higher, if they had no problem doing it the 6950k would have same/higher clocks as the 6800k, but be like 170W tdp.

Now ignore that platform and look at mainstream, i7 is faster than i5 and i3? I3 has close base clock speeds but no turbo, but it's also a native dual core die. Meaning a sale of a dual core die doesn't lose money by otherwise being a chip that can be sold with 4 cores at a higher price.

A salvaged dual core has a lower margin and less profit than a native dual core part, you can also produce a lot more on a wafer so you're not reducing overall production by selling lots of dual core salvaged parts.

The current chips from AMD are all 8 core parts, any 6 and 4 core are salvaged, most people believe most of the 4/6 cores are parts that won't work as 8 cores, they are incorrect. Some are but in reality you have higher demand for $200 parts than $300 than $400/500 parts. So there will be more demand for the 4 core parts than 6 core than 8 core. A large portion, likely the majority, of the 4/6 core chips have 8 fully working cores but are turned off to fill demand. This is why so many(honestly nearly all) 2-3 core Phenoms would run as 4 cores easily.


So in reality, if you have really great clock speeds on the 4 and 6 core, you will increase demand. People will go hey a $200 quad core with 4Ghz base clocks or should I pay $300 for the 6 core with 3.8Ghz base clocks, or $500 for a 3.6Ghz base clock 8 core.
If you make it $200 for a 3.2Ghz base 4 core, $300 for a 3.5Ghz base clock 6 core, or $500 for a 3.6Ghz base clock 8 core.... then you encourage users to make the step up to the next core.

For AMD with a single 8 core native die then the goal is to make the 8 core much more attractive than the 6 core which is more attractive than the quad core.

If they had a native quad core design then it would have hugely increased margins vs a 4 core salvaged and the ability to double production output vs quad core salvaged.


Basically there is absolutely no reason for AMD to sell 4-6 cores with higher clock speeds, it reduces profit, reduces sales of more expensive chips and reduces margins significantly. I would guess that the majority of 4-6 core chips hit very similar overall overclocks to the 8 core chips, just not at stock.
 
Those Gigabyte boards look pap compared to the Asus ones, even the MSI ones look better, and Asrock.

Not giving Gigabyte my money this time round, either the Asus Crosshair or the Asrock Taichi for me! Unless the MSI one rocks them both which i doubt.
 
Odd Job said:
Just seen these prices on a retail site. For comparison they have the i7-7700k for a similar price to OCUK

R7 1800x - £474.37
R7 1700x - £368.71
R7 1700 - £305.32
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Yeah i had a gander there too, their prices are roughly around the same as OCUK and a few other competitors, interesting they are listing them so early, i checked a few other sites and did not see them listed though.
 
I'm probably not buying Ryzen any time soon.

Could get very tempting if the 4 or 6 core variants turn out to be unlockable though. I remember my first core-unlocked AMD CPU - took a fair bit of voltage to run stably at quad - and the resultant heat meant overkill on the CPU cooler. My current one seems perfect.
 
DrBombcrater said:
Nothing wrong with liking old mechanical keyboards. If you type a lot a mechanical kbd can be of huge benefit and the modern USB mechanical models use switch-type keys, which don't have the same feel as the buckling-spring mechanism used on the old IBM Model M and similar.
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It's the modern switch type he was referring too, the 80's bit was just being facetious.

SiDeards73 said:
Those Gigabyte boards look pap compared to the Asus ones, even the MSI ones look better, and Asrock.
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The VRM heatsinks don't look very solid, more aesthetic looking than functional.
 
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Odd Job said:
Just seen these prices on a retail site. For comparison they have the i7-7700k for a similar price to OCUK

R7 1800x - £474.37
R7 1700x - £368.71
R7 1700 - £305.32
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if these are about right the 1600x should be about 250ish so I may be able to get a 6 core mobo and ram all in for about 500ish
 
TonyTurbo78 said:
Alreeeet guys, how's it goin'

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@AdoredTV

+3% if Turbo off, my conclusion too.

humbug said:
Thats pretty good.

It puts the IPC 3% ahead of KabyLake and 54% ahead of Piledriver given the FX-8370 boosts to 4.3Ghz.
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humbug said:
Just run another math.... at 4.5Ghz, the same boost clock as that 7700K Zen would score 2721, which is just over 3% faster.... it all matches up.

I'm getting a bit giddy now....
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ubersonic said:
The VRM heatsinks don't look very solid, more aesthetic looking than functional.
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That's true for almost all VRM heatsinks, the good high phase count VRMs need less cooling because each MOSFET is dealing with less current. A giant block of aluminium doesn't cool much better than a much smaller finned one but customers are reassured by the big beefy looking coolers and think they must be better as a result. The MOSETs are normally rated for 125C or so anyway so they don't need an awful lot of cooling.
 
Motherboards are just getting ridiculous having lights all over the place, I noticed it with recent X99 boards you can't seem to buy one that isn't decorated like a Christmas tree.
 
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