Bahrain GP 2009 - Race 4/17
- Thread starter stockhausen
- Start date
are mclaren (or should i say hamilton) the only ones who use it properly and effectively? everyone else seems to have problems with it.
do renault use it?
Yup, Alonso wasnt overly impressed with it in Melbourne and Pratquet seriously annoyed Barichello with it last race out. Rubens was all over him untill they hit a straight when Piquet hit the button and would zip away.
I vaguely remember that happening, but was Barrichello competing for position or was he lapping Piquet?
Racing for position, Rubens was much quicker than Piquet but couldnt get close enough to make a move at the end of the straights due to the lead Piquet kept making with his kers. Nothing a banzai overtaking manouver didnt fix though.
Soldato
That'll probably end up a contender for overtake of the year. He really did launch it in there. And to think Rubens used to have a reputation for being too timid to overtake....
So, the overtake was for position and Piquet wasnt being lapped...in which case, Piquet and his KERS were doing a fine job keeping what was probably the fastest car on the track, behind him. This is exactly the reason why I stated in January, that I would much rather have KERS than not have it.
If I were Piquet I would definitely have brake tested him coming out of a corner or 2. And the more frustrated Barrichello would've become, the more likely Barrichello would've nudged into the back of Piquet's car destroying Barrichello's nose-cone in the process.
If only Senna were still around, the newer breed of drivers would learn how brake testing was done on-track. Its a skill that seems to have been lost.
If I were Piquet I would definitely have brake tested him coming out of a corner or 2. And the more frustrated Barrichello would've become, the more likely Barrichello would've nudged into the back of Piquet's car destroying Barrichello's nose-cone in the process.
If only Senna were still around, the newer breed of drivers would learn how brake testing was done on-track. Its a skill that seems to have been lost.
Brake testing is not a skill that F1 needs. What possible gain would there be for Piquet to have a car run up his backside.
If you are judged to have brake tested a car and caused an accident you will recieve a ban or fine.
If you are judged to have brake tested a car and caused an accident you will recieve a ban or fine.
Associate
It's a good job your not Piquet then. Brake testing is dangerous in a saloon car with brake lights, in a Formula 1 car, it's stupidity.
Although with Piquet we might have actually believed "my foot slipped"
Man of Honour
There is nothing wrong with KERS in principal or in practice. It's just that nobody except McLaren seems to have got it right. Hard luck for everyone else!
Soldato
TBH I think after seeing how much punishment Ruben's nose cone took in Melbourne I think Piquet would have come off worse
But introducing KERS with one breath, and then going in about cost cutting with the other... The FIA have not timed these things well...
Brake testing goes against the rules of sportsmanship. However, this didnt stop Senna from doing it to Mansell, repeatedly when he was trying to keep Mansell behind him at Monaco 1992.
It is a skill. The British may not like it, but when you reach the upper echelons of driving skill, I feel it is something that all drivers should master. If you get it right, you put it into the head of the driver behind you, not to follow so closely. And if the driver behind does follow closely, then he runs the risk of having his own nose cone damaged.
I certainly would class it as an art and would use it (if I knew how to do it properly), against other top line drivers.
The problem is that in the current climate of the FIA giving heavy sanctions to any drivers deemed to have been driving dangerously, means that the driver doing it needs to have confidence that the driver behind isnt going to have a serious accident.
In Britain I totally understand that people want to win honestly, but the likes of Prost, Senna and MS (who won titles on more than one occassion using dirty tactics) have all been guilty of taking the rules of sportsmanship to their limits. I also class Hamilton as someone his definitely capable of using underhanded tactics to win.
It is a skill. The British may not like it, but when you reach the upper echelons of driving skill, I feel it is something that all drivers should master. If you get it right, you put it into the head of the driver behind you, not to follow so closely. And if the driver behind does follow closely, then he runs the risk of having his own nose cone damaged.
I certainly would class it as an art and would use it (if I knew how to do it properly), against other top line drivers.
The problem is that in the current climate of the FIA giving heavy sanctions to any drivers deemed to have been driving dangerously, means that the driver doing it needs to have confidence that the driver behind isnt going to have a serious accident.
In Britain I totally understand that people want to win honestly, but the likes of Prost, Senna and MS (who won titles on more than one occassion using dirty tactics) have all been guilty of taking the rules of sportsmanship to their limits. I also class Hamilton as someone his definitely capable of using underhanded tactics to win.
TBH I think after seeing how much punishment Ruben's nose cone took in Melbourne I think Piquet would have come off worse
LOL
LOL. Piquet isn't "that" bad.
Soldato
He's worse than "that"?
Associate
So Sunama... would you trust Piquet to have the skill to brake test you enough to slow you down without causing an accident?
I'm actually of the opinion that the McLaren KERS isnt better than the other leading teams'. The reason why McLaren appear to make it work better is Hamilton. He is a driver who absolutely loves pressing buttons. When I first saw the amount of buttons on the steering wheels of the 2009 cars, I felt that Hamilton would be the one who can make the most of the settings.
If you look at Heikki, who also drives a McLaren, he seems to be much more in-line with other drivers on the grid, in terms of how much he can use KERS to his advantage.
We also know that Massa has expressed his love for KERS.
It will be interesting to see what happens to the Brawn cars when they are equipped with KERS.
Soldato
Haven't they already said they definitely won't be using it this year as the car isn't even slightly made for it?
Granted they'll be using it next year, but it's going to be very different next year. The Brawn car won't necessarily stand out at all.
If I was following Piquet, closely, in a BrawnGP car which is much faster than his Renault, I would try and drive as closely as possible. However, the moment he brake tests me the 2nd time (I would assume that the first brake-test was just a mistake or his foot slipped, while the 2nd time would have been intentional), I will definitely back off and wait for the particular corner that I am certain I can overtake him. At some point I'd have to take the risk.
On the other hand, if he didnt brake test me, I would ride as close to car as possible and wait for an opportunity to present itself.
The difference between the 2 scenarios above is that, with the brake testing scenario, Piquet is much more likely to keep me behind him than if he wasnt brake-testing.
Had Piquet brake-tested Barrichello a few times, I'm sure Barrichello wouldnt have been able to overtake Piquet in the way he did, as he would've been a little scared. After the race Barrichello would complain, but by then, the race is over.
I just find it strange that when Senna brake-tests, its all swept under the carpet, but when another driver proposes its use, everyone is calling for bans for dangerous driving. Sorry gents, but brake-testing is a fantastic skill to have if you are an F1 driver fighting for points/race wins/drivers' titles.
I guess its similar to "diving" in football. It is very much a skill that top players have - diving in order to be awarded penalties/free kicks, from which goals can be scored and games won. You may not like it, but it is definitely a skill.