Declining attitude to law and order

[Chris Wilson]

A rather lacklustre performance by the inmates, but at least they tried I suppose. Better luck next time guys, post a video, then carve the ******* up.

"A MAN who charged with raping a two-week-old baby has been attacked by inmates in a high-security prison in Northern Ireland. The 25-year-old was surrounded before being repeatedly punched and kicked at HMP Maghaberry.

The man was arrested in the seaside village of Annalong area of Co Down on September 29 after the 12-day-old infant was sexually assaulted so badly it is in intensive care.

The attack, last weekend at the Bann house area of the Northern Irish prison, is only thought to have lasted “a few seconds” but was enough to cause serious injuries to the individual.

A source said: “It was a few digs, just for a few seconds. Then there was some panic and staff moved in to sort it out.”

He has been moved to a secure unit at the prison hospital for fear he could be attacked again.



The alleged paedophile, who cannot be named for legal reasons, will be kept there until further notice as officials have serious concerns over his welfare.

The man was already being treated as a 'Special Person At Risk' meaning the most dangerous inmates including murderers and terrorists were kept away from him.

One of the inmates accused of being involved in the attack has been punished by the prison and stripped of privileges.

The 25-year-old was charged with rape and with causing grievous bodily harm with intent on September 29.

The child remains in intensive care at the Royal Belfast Hospital for Sick Children.

On Wednesday a bail application for the man was withdrawn at Newry Magistrates Court.

District Judge Eamonn King adjourned the case to November 7."

 

[Tefal]

Be a bit awkward if he s found innocent at trial now won't it

 

[chrcoluk]

It's as though we live in a world where "getting tough" is seen as a bad, or over the top thing to do, whether it's parents correctly disciplining children in the household, or the Police dealing with a nasty situation - there seems to be this reluctance to use force to deal with it. An aggravating factor is that people know this - and push the boundaries further and further, to the point where you have teenagers daring to square up to police officers and threaten them..

It would be interesting to see how society would react if we went back to older, harsher - perhaps more effective ways of dealing with unruly kids;

cop would be fired for that now, but the cops need that kind of power back, especially with youths.

I expect the power was lost tho because it was abused.

 

[Orionaut]

Be a bit awkward if he s found innocent at trial now won't it

Yes, which is why people who are on remand (And particularly "First Offenders") should not be detained within the general prison population.

Having said that. If he IS shown to have done this utterly incomprehensible thing

I would be quite happy for him to be given a Viking punishment.

Poke his eyes out, make him eat them
Cut out his tongue, Make him eat it.
Cut off his tackle and make him eat that too!

And then turn him inside out, very, very, sloooowly indeed!

 

[Terminal_Boy]

Yes, which is why people who are on remand (And particularly "First Offenders") should not be detained within the general prison population.

Having said that. If he IS shown to have done this utterly incomprehensible thing

I would be quite happy for him to be given a Viking punishment.

Poke his eyes out, make him eat them
Cut out his tongue, Make him eat it.
Cut off his tackle and make him eat that too!

And then turn him inside out, very, very, sloooowly indeed!

When I become Emperor, you will be my Minister of Justice.

 

[GGizmo]

If convicted then this case is one that deserves the rope.

I would lower him down on a hot poker.

 

[chrcoluk]

that new york mayor sorted crime out by targeting what we currently see as acceptable crime.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

 

[chrcoluk]

The problem is when the UK gives foreign aid, they lend the money with interest. That's all the UK gov cares about "how much money can we make from X country, so we can fill our back pockets with bonuses"

If they give the money to the UK police force instead there will be no financial gain for UK the gov.

Foreign aid is one of the strangest government policies.
Both tories and labour support it.Yet both tory and labour voters oppose it.
It even got protected in the austerity of cameron and osborne.
It survives with massive NHS and policing funding problems.

I can only conclude there is some corruption with that budget.

 

[Orionaut]

I can only conclude there is some corruption with that budget.

Especially considering the amount of money that is sent to countries that clearly do not need it.

Now, I am not opposed to "Foreign Aid" as such. But I would do it in a very different way to how it currently seems to be being provided.

(Why not use the aid budget to subsidise UK companies to provide infrastructure in developing countries? Everybody wins really!)

 

[B@Th*nG]

Do people still think this Tory v Labour voting nonsense has any effect on the eventual outcome of anything? I thought most people had realised that it's just a divide and rule mechanism.

It's only an externalisation mechanism for the steady collapse of society and enslavement. Some puppets are red and some puppets are blue. They let the citizens vote so voters of the opposite colour can always be blamed for anything bad which happens during that term. It's the same reason why the referendum happened, because there is no right decision, there is no improvement, the mandate for the entire EU is downhill and something needs to be blamed. And what better pawns to be used than a nation of easily propagandised Daily Mail readers?

It's such a basic psychosocial concept.




Police cuts are not the cause of scum like this reproducing and raising more generations of scum.

Can you even quantify this? How many extra police cars do you think you'd need? Even if there were 5 extra cars in that borough that night, they still wouldn't be able to catch this guy would they because the actual problem in this situation is that the bike thief ends up going down an alleyway or endangering pedestrians and the police have to give up chase.

We need to start looking at the actual causes of things here.

other than policy chiefs telling us exactly what i've just said, i'm afraid i don't have figures

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uk...uted-to-rise-in-crime-police-chief-warns.html

Article from 2012 but the same, if not worse, applies.

B@

 

[chrcoluk]

Just look how he takes sides without any reasoning. Thats because they are programmed. The idea that there is a citizen who is not at liberty to buy 50 litres of drinking water was never questioned once. That is painful. Surely the first thing which needs to be established is that how can one citizen actually lose their freedom to buy 50 litres of drinking water. Yet the enforcer comes along and starts relinquishing even more liberties.

Look how autonomous it is, and if you think thats sad wait till we have cyborg/police drones.

To be fair its a private store and tesco can if they want for "any" reason refuse to even sell a bag of sweets to someone.

Now whether the police handled the situation well I dont know as we dont have a full video clip. But the copper can hardly order tesco to sell the water to those two people, thats within tesco's right to refuse the sale as well as ask them to leave the property and ask them to stop recording.

EVERY other Tesco up and down the country?

That's some thirst you got there bud.

Yep, and notice how he pauses, "these are for <pause> home".

 

[TheVoice]

The reality is now that police are primarily a anti driving offence entity

What's this based on? On average there are fewer roads policing resources now than there's ever been (a similar story across most specialist operational support roles), in what way is all the focus now on driving offences when there are so few police officers actually focusing on said offences?

H&S with police not liking the risk of street patrols, challenging people etc.

Yet the police are told they're stopping and searching too many people. Street patrols aren't an efficient use of resources when your response teams are being run ragged answering call after call.

Shifts of priority e.g. from dealing with anti social behaviour to speeding offences.

Speeding offences are not what officers are tied up with for most of their shifts. You have absolutely no idea what's day-to-day policing in this country looks like.

 

[Orionaut]

Speeding offenses are not what officers are tied up with for most of their shifts. You have absolutely no idea what's day-to-day policing in this country looks like.

Can somebody provide a list of the top ten most common prosecution offences?

I dont think it would be too unreasonable to assume that the top ten of prosecution rates would reflect the top ten of Policing priorities!

 

[chrcoluk]

I second the request.

Lets see if convicted burglers tops driving offences.

TheVoice what I do know is this.

People who work for the police or have worked for the police before, have stated on the beat presence is becoming lower priority, including one member in this thread who works for the police stating his own team doesnt have the resource to have a on the beat presence.
At least one regional police force has told the press they were planning to screen crimes, and more than half of reported crimes would be auto closed, and not investigated, they didnt state which crimes tho.
I see regularly police cars driving around, but pretty much never police walking around.
I see high police presence at high profile events.
The police are using resources on social media quarrels.

I feel the priority should be petty crime, low level crime anti social behaviour, theft, vandalism etc. It sends a message to communities.
The law needs changing so sting operations become legal (as I understand it these can come off as entrapment and is a reason UK police dont carry these out often).
The army should be used for high profile events, houses of parliament etc. Freeing up resources.
Ideology needs to be curbed, we still have e.g. the missing child case ongoing, and I think missing person cases maybe should be lower priority, based on what soviet told us as well. At least after a certain amount of time has passed.

Its tough because unless you create new officers out of thin air if you prioritise one thing, then another thing suffers. But I think crime prevention is the way to go instead of reacting to crime thats already happened.

I would even consider taking all police of speeding offences and the like. Use cameras to catch people. Traffic wardens could potentially be trained up.

Also what happened with CSO's? the fake police officers. I dont even see them on the streets now either.

 

[TheVoice]

I dont think it would be too unreasonable to assume that the top ten of prosecution rates would reflect the top ten of Policing priorities!

Your local force will publish their priorities and outline how they were set and how they'll be delivered, it's worth reading before expecting that prosecutions will somehow neatly fall in line with that list.

For example, a fairly rural area of Scotland where my parents live has terrorism/national security as one of the highest priorities (largely due to the public perception of the threat of terrorism), should there therefore be more terrorism-related prosecutions in that area than for acquisitive crime?

 

[TheVoice]

I second the request.

Lets see if convicted burglers tops driving offences.

Cool, feel free to Google it. Given the fact a NIP for a speeding offence can be issued without any input from a police officer I'm sure you'll know what to expect.

 

[chrcoluk]

Terrorism probably should be handled by the army, we get an event once every 5 years or so, it would be very interesting to see how much resources do get tied up by it, following false leads etc.

 

[TheVoice]

Terrorism probably should be handled by the army, we get an event once every 5 years or so

Kind of suggests the current system is working then, doesn't it?

Not that that's true anyway, given there were 4 completed attacks last year alone, plus various others that failed or were prevented ahead of time.

 

[GGizmo]

I agree with what some have said that lower crime should be prioritised to at least give the feeling of a police presense. Of course the practical reality of that is if Judges do the right thing and end up sending them to prison then we'll end up with overcrowded prisons.

I think community service needs to be taken a lot more seriously by the criminal justice system and stop sending people for non-victim crimes to prison.

Years ago an acquaintance ended up getting sent to prison because of some electoral fraud (a crime I don't believe should have a prison sentence). But he used the time to talk to people in there and realised most people were in his prison for breaking conditions of release, not the actual crime they originally were sentenced for. This was about 15 years ago so I'm not sure if its the same situation now or how wide of an issue it is.

I've been on a couple of demonstrations in my younger days and its surprising how many police turn up. The number of police probably end up being in the hundreds. One demonstration there must have been 200 police turned up (others driving around in camera cars) for a protest that had 150 to 200 people on. I can understand the reason why the police do that. But imho at least 100 of those police could have been working on real crimes instead of being pulled off from their normal work to stop 'potential' crimes. We know from all the reports that there as never been mass arrests at protests, unless its some country-wide event.

Also what happened with CSO's? the fake police officers. I dont even see them on the streets now either.

I don't see the one around here these days. The last time we had a quad bike pinched the PCSO happened to be nearby (this happened about 5 years ago), but the actual polices response was hardly anything. I think they issued a crime number and that was it. It wouldnt surprise me if the number of PCSO's have dropped, because what is the point of reporting on crimes if when you radio back to the police they won't do anything!?

It feels to me like there is something bigger going on here. It feels like every public service is being drained financially. There is nobody seriously addressing it, or at least coming up with creative solutions of how to fix it.

 

[Orionaut]

Cool, feel free to Google it. Given the fact a NIP for a speeding offense can be issued without any input from a police officer I'm sure you'll know what to expect.

The Police are only a part of the "Justice system"

It is the "Justice Systems" priority's that are the question.

Oh, And PS

My question still stands!