Declining attitude to law and order

[Chris Wilson]

When the Freedom of Information Act reveals these farcical wastes of money and manpower by the police it does not bode well for how their claimed lack of funding and resources are allocated:

A dog fouling outside of a house was one of 2,500 alleged hate crimes logged by the Metropolitan Police.

The dubious allegations was investigated by the police in 2015 and 2016, including an envelope that had been opened and resealed, a disputed line call in a tennis match and a dead rat found in a garden.

Police also logged a man telling library staff he was campaigning for Brexit and an accident involving a car that bore a Remembrance poppy.

The 2,507 alleged hate incidents were revealed after a Freedom of Information request by the The Mail on Sunday.

In the dog fouling incident, the log read: "An unknown dog has fouled outside of victim address and victim perceived this to be a racial incident."

In another case, it was suggested a barking dog was a hate crime. Police wrote: "Suspect's dog barking at victim."


One man who felt he had been a victim of racial abuse reported that he "believes a letter addressed to him was opened and then resealed before he had collected it from the Post Office."

Other complaints include a person who felt a bus driver had given them a "racist look" and a woman who was thrown out of a pub for being "drunk, aggressive and erratic" but told police she had been targeted "because she is Polish".

An angry father called police after his daughter lost a tennis match to complain about a racist umpire. The incident log read: "Informant feels his daughter was subjected to racial discrimination at a tennis match where line calls went against her."

And a pupil struggling in a swimming lesson reported his teacher for "faith-based abuse" after he spoke to him in an "abrupt manner".

Disputes between neighbours were a common trend. One entry said a witness "has had parking issues with her next-door neighbour, their children apparently throw stones and balls over the garden fence. Witness has recently found a dead rat in garden and perceives this to be racist."

One man claimed his neighbours were parking only outside his house and were "targeting him due to being black". On another occasion, a resident in a block of flats reported a neighbour was racially abusing them by "smoking heavily".

One entry says: "Victim on hearing her neighbours in their house has put her ear up to their door to hear what they are talking about. In a conversation they have referred to her as [redacted] and made remarks of trying to get her moved out."

Another incident log said: "Unknown suspect has reversed into victim's car causing extensive damage. Victim perceives to be a hate crime as she had a poppy in front of her car."

Current rules mean police have to record any allegation described as motivated by prejudice as a hate incident, even if it is not serious enough to be regarded as a crime.

Earlier this month Anthony Stansfield, the police commissioner for Thames Valley, revealed that an elderly woman had to be questioned as a hate criminal after beeping her car horn at a black driver who she felt was "taking ages" at a petrol station.

Official figures published in October revealed hate crimes had soared over the past year, but it only takes into account those reported to police.

Nearly 2,000 incidents are reported every week, a rise of 17 per cent compared to last year.

According to the Home Office, there were 94,098 hate crimes recorded in 2017-18.

 

[MookJong]

God is dead in the minds of most people, we lost trust in authority figures and police, the ideals of a normal family life are hardly promoted. Fast money lifestyles and gang culture have been accepted by the mainstream. Our tax payer funded broadcaster has radio and TV shows dedicated to re-enforcing this "culture" which is anything but cultured.

More and more we have rules and regulations drawn up by academics and civil servants about how we should use language and conduct ourselves while less and less we see any moral conduct in these communities. We've never talked more about "respect" while down on the street civil society is under full on assault.

 

[TheVoice]

That's a lot of words to say "I can't correct you because you're right".

That's an odd way of interpreting what I said.

 

[TheVoice]

When the Freedom of Information Act reveals these farcical wastes of money and manpower by the police it does not bode well for how their claimed lack of funding and resources are allocated:

It's not a claim, it's a fact. Budgets are lower than they used to be, staff and officer numbers are lower than they used to be. The public expect more and more from the police as do other partner agencies who find themselves similarly understaffed and underfunded.

The article you've cited is a perfect example of the burden that has been placed on the police to do more with less, and with no clear aim or purpose either.

Current rules mean police have to record any allegation described as motivated by prejudice as a hate incident, even if it is not serious enough to be regarded as a crime.

 

[mmj_uk]

Most of those incidents Chris Wilson listed should have been dismissed as a waste of police time if there was any common sense left in the police force. Even if you gave the police twice as much funding they'd just waste it on that type of nonsense.

They're pumping resources into things that are not even crimes.

 

[asim18]

Most of those incidents Chris Wilson listed should have been dismissed as a waste of police time if there was any common sense left in the police force. Even if you gave the police twice as much funding they'd just waste it on that type of nonsense.

They're pumping resources into things that are not even crimes.

Yep they want people to report everything to the police.

Haven't you seen the recent propaganda campaigns designed to increase societal division and to call the police for everything?

Someone cleaning neighbour's windows? Report.
Someone throwing out neighbour's rubbish? Report.
Neighbour leased a new car? Report.
Neighbour rented a nice car? Report.
Someone yoy don't like at kid's school wearing clean shoes? Report.

 

[GGizmo]

It isn't just that the police are getting paid less, its that they are having to spend time on stupid 'incidents'.

I was reading today that not even the police will bother arresting some violent criminals because they are in and out of court very fast that its a waste of police time.

Many years ago I read about Common Purpose, and its original purpose before it came in to the spotlight. It's mission statement was to create leaders if society collapses. Then boasted of how they have people at all levels of government and industry. Then things went quiet and I dismissed it as some conspiracy theory. But these days reading the headlines every day, the victim mentality both the media and government pushes (which is fueling these stupid reported incidents), I can see we're heading for a collapsed society, or at least government services are being slowly withdrawn.

It's time to start a neighbourhood army boys!

 

[StriderX]

wrong

Hot damn, three daily mirror and a daily fail link, BINGO BOYS.

 

[chrcoluk]

I can forsee the consequences.

Our police will turn into american police.

All armed.

Shoot first ask later.

That will be the result if this culture continues. Then everyone will be crying for the old police to come back.

Also I do agree I dont understand why racial crime is deemed higher priority. Clearly a political reason for that policy.

 

[Lord-Jaffa]

I can forsee the consequences.

Our police will turn into american police.

All armed.

Shoot first ask later.

That will be the result if this culture continues. Then everyone will be crying for the old police to come back.

Also I do agree I dont understand why racial crime is deemed higher priority. Clearly a political reason for that policy.

Of course it's turning that way, there are a huge number of incidents of people assaulting police (especially the 5ft female officers who get thrown around like a doll). You can see similaritys in gang culture already by minority groups, it's almost a direct comparison of the rise of American gangs. Look at the violence they have to deal with everyday and ask yourself what would you do when put in the same situations as a police officer, these people don't care if you live or die.

 

[h4rm0ny]

It isn't just that the police are getting paid less, its that they are having to spend time on stupid 'incidents'.

I was reading today that not even the police will bother arresting some violent criminals because they are in and out of court very fast that its a waste of police time.

Many years ago I read about Common Purpose, and its original purpose before it came in to the spotlight. It's mission statement was to create leaders if society collapses. Then boasted of how they have people at all levels of government and industry. Then things went quiet and I dismissed it as some conspiracy theory. But these days reading the headlines every day, the victim mentality both the media and government pushes (which is fueling these stupid reported incidents), I can see we're heading for a collapsed society, or at least government services are being slowly withdrawn.

It's time to start a neighbourhood army boys!

I looked up Common Purpose and found this:
https://www.cpexposed.com/about-common-purpose

 

[Avenged7Fold]

That's a bit sensationalist. Common purpose is basically a mix between a leadership education scheme and young peoples business networking. It's there to create links between future industry and political leaders to introduce streamlined alliances and set up connections. Sounds like big business and industry want to fast track new talents into the upper end of the business world and set them up with a good power network for personal gain, nothing new really.

 

[Freakbro]

I looked up Common Purpose and found this:
https://www.cpexposed.com/about-common-purpose

Looks legit

Edit :

haha, looking into the guy behind that site Brian Gerrish

Brian Gerrish is a prominent figure in the British Constitution Group and the Lawful Rebellion movement. Gerrish is active on the seminar circuit and routinely gives talks at BCG meetings. Gerrish is mainly known for his paranoia regarding the organisation Common Purpose with his website Common Purpose exposed and for his newspaper the UK Column. Gerrish particularly dislikes communists, Marxists, the Fabian society and Neurolinguistic programming

Look up the BCG group and you get......drumroll......Freeman of the Land crap

The British Constitution Group or BCG is a British tax protester group that advocates so-called Lawful Rebellion under section 61 of Magna Carta, and other freeman on the land-associated pseudolegal woo. They also believe that statute law is contractual and that it can be declined, as well as the pseudolegal strawman theory. The group occasionally arranges conferences with speakers espousing their form of woo. They are also one of the main peddlers of conspiracy theories surrounding the organisation Common Purpose UK.

He even outshines Asim on his NLP views..

Neurolinguistic programming

Gerrish has unusual views on NLP in that to him it isn't a pseudoscientific personal development methodology; instead, he completely misunderstands it as some kind of sinister brainwashing technology that's being used to influence us in society.[1] Gerrish asserts that NLP is a kind of hypnosis. In the examples he gives, he seems to confuse any kind of persuasive marketing technique as NLP. Any attempt to convey a message whether implicit or even completely explicit can be cited as an example of NLP at work. Any kind of metaphor, simile, pause or even gesture is NLP at work

 

[h4rm0ny]

That's a bit sensationalist. Common purpose is basically a mix between a leadership education scheme and young peoples business networking. It's there to create links between future industry and political leaders to introduce streamlined alliances and set up connections. Sounds like big business and industry want to fast track new talents into the upper end of the business world and set them up with a good power network for personal gain, nothing new really.

Any personal network becomes a conspiracy, ime!

Looks legit

Edit :

haha, looking into the guy behind that site Brian Gerrish



Look up the BCG group and you get......drumroll......Freeman of the Land crap



He even outshines Asim on his NLP views..

I've never heard of "Freeman of the Land" movement. What's that about?

Having studied hypnosis, NLP does overlap with it a lot. Saying so doesn't make someone a loon.

 

[Freakbro]

For someone obviously fairly intelligent, you do seem very gullible for CT nonsense.

 

[explicit4u]

Being poor is not a reason. Think of how any people live in or below the breadline yet manage to not commit crime.
These guys aren't in that situation. They're not stealing to survive.

Hence why I said it’s part of the root cause, poverty is absolutely a contributer to crime. That doesn’t mean that being poor means you’re going to commit crime, but add inequality, lack of support systems, lack of funds for social services, and it’s not hard to see why people are driven to crime.

You said yourself that you grew up relatively poor but you had support systems in the community around you. If the community around is mostly associated with gangs then it’s a recipe for disaster, especially in London where you’re surrounded by wealth.

 

[Orionaut]

I can forsee the consequences.

Our police will turn into american police.

All armed.

Shoot first ask later.

That will be the result if this culture continues. Then everyone will be crying for the old police to come back.

Also I do agree I dont understand why racial crime is deemed higher priority. Clearly a political reason for that policy.

I want my old police back now!

 

[chrcoluk]

Of course it's turning that way, there are a huge number of incidents of people assaulting police (especially the 5ft female officers who get thrown around like a doll). You can see similaritys in gang culture already by minority groups, it's almost a direct comparison of the rise of American gangs. Look at the violence they have to deal with everyday and ask yourself what would you do when put in the same situations as a police officer, these people don't care if you live or die.

It comes down to what I said in the other thread.

People currently dont respect the law, minor crime is currently treated like no crime by the police, this in turn makes people not respect the law. To most people, you dont see a cop more than once every few months not in a police car.

A problem is also people can only consider extremes, e.g. right now I think the police are clearly too soft, they not allowed to use much force in case they cause harm, when this gets recognised by government we will probably do an instant mode switch to american style policing instead of just going back to how it was a few decades ago.

It feels like the crimes that are not categorised by political reasons are categorised by level of financial value, like its a police force for capitalism, to me if e.g. someone robs a mansion, vs someone robbing a council house, both warrant the same police response. I would consider making it a crime to mock police when they trying to detain people, some may call that a police state, I call it respecting the law. Also children need to learn from a young age, the cane needs bringing back for sure. Also places like borstal youth detention centres.

Also if e.g. 90% of criminals are black, and as a result cops stop and search black people more often, that is not racism.

We also should never have female cops paired up.

I was only talking the other day about what punishments are worthwhile for things like tax and benefit fraud, as well as shoplifting, specifically we were talking about prisons. Obviously you want the punishment short enough so the person can have a go at a proper life afterwards (unless its for something like murder), but at the same time it needs to make them scared to do it again. So for me, prisoners should be working in places like coal mines, proper prison labour, proper deterrent. Short sentences but make the sentences brutal. I think a short brutal sentence is a bigger deterrent than say a couple of years with a tv and games console in your prison cell.

 

[Dis86]

Hence why I said it’s part of the root cause, poverty is absolutely a contributer to crime. That doesn’t mean that being poor means you’re going to commit crime, but add inequality, lack of support systems, lack of funds for social services, and it’s not hard to see why people are driven to crime.

You said yourself that you grew up relatively poor but you had support systems in the community around you. If the community around is mostly associated with gangs then it’s a recipe for disaster, especially in London where you’re surrounded by wealth.

Exactly. It's a contributor but not the cause and certainly not an excuse however that's what we keep seeing. Oh x was poor, no wonder he did that. Well y and z were also poor but never did that. It's what especially irks me when a kid commits a crime, the parents so rarely take responsibility and aren't legally responsible yet theyre the ones who should be instilling the sense of right and wrong in this kid.
You beat your kid and BAM, child abuse. Your kid beats someone else - nothing. Everyone goes home as if nothing happened.

 

[krooton]

Also children need to learn from a young age, the cane needs bringing back for sure.

You do know that respect != fear, right?