Energy Suppliers

dLockers said:
And the £400 would be divided over half the amount of time, meaning the bills are very high.

Your approach makes sense if you have sufficient buffer in your current account. The poorest do not*.
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Unless I am mistaken only paying for what you use and even better after you use it instead of before, is better for the poor instead of paying too much.

I didnt say it would be over half the time either.

I expect by this time next year many of the poor wont even be on credit meters, probably forced onto prepay meters due to unaffordable defaulted bills.
 
chrcoluk said:
Unless I am mistaken only paying for what you use and even better after you use it instead of before, is better for the poor instead of paying too much.

I didnt say it would be over half the time either.

I expect by this time next year many of the poor wont even be on credit meters, probably forced onto prepay meters due to unaffordable defaulted bills.
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I get what you are saying. But nobody wants 'lumpy' OPEX. The system works right now as the burden of financing is borne by absolutely everyone. All what would happen is what we see in the car insurance industry. The poorest people can't afford to pay it outright, so they spread it monthly at 20% APR. Only the poor get this tax, as everyone rich enough can afford to pay it outright.
 
dLockers said:
I get what you are saying. But nobody wants 'lumpy' OPEX. The system works right now as the burden of financing is borne by absolutely everyone. All what would happen is what we see in the car insurance industry. The poorest people can't afford to pay it outright, so they spread it monthly at 20% APR. Only the poor get this tax, as everyone rich enough can afford to pay it outright.
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Well I dont want that for sure. That would be a horrible system.

In effect now everyone is been taxed to cover the cost of the lost credit balances, and this tax via the increase to SC is disproportionally affecting the poor more as its a bigger % of their income.

I do accept what you said though, and 100% I wouldnt support a debit repayment scheme that had interest attached.

Would you support a system the same as what we have now except credit balances are held by a independent entity (kind of like rental deposit schemes)? The energy companies only take from that credit when the bill is issued, so pretty much the way it is now except the credit balance isnt held by the companies. (this would also not be the only way to pay by direct debit, those of us who dont like been used as ATM's should have an option of a variable direct debit.)
 
chrcoluk said:
Would you support a system the same as what we have now except credit balances are held by a independent entity (kind of like rental deposit schemes)? The energy companies only take from that credit when the bill is issued, so pretty much the way it is now except the credit balance isnt held by the companies. (this would also not be the only way to pay by direct debit, those of us who dont like been used as ATM's should have an option of a variable direct debit.)
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100% but someone's still gotta pay for it.
 
chrcoluk said:
Bear in mind for me, I have seen how broken it is, my account has been in credit all year round for several years, it peaked at around £900 last month in the middle of winter. Many other reports as well across the internet from other people of the same issue. companies treating customers as ATM's.
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Thats not because the system is broken, thats because either you havent provided an accurate estimate of your usage (or it has reduced significantly), or your supplier has failed at basic maths (annual usage/12). My account has been in gradually reducing credit over winter, and is going to tick over into negative in the next month or 2, just in time for my usage to drop over the summer and build up that credit again (well, if my unit rates werent about to more than double), because my monthly bill is within a few £ of my annual usage/12 - which is exactly as it should be.

It's funny you mention interest - Ovo actually used to pay 3.5% interest on any credit balance, which was far higher than any savings account at the time!

You cant really treat it like a phone bill, because most people dont really have a choice in how much they use it, and unlike cutting off someone's phone if they dont pay - which is ultimately just an inconvenient - cutting off their gas/electric means they cant wash/cook/keep themselves warm, and will potentially freeze/starve (obviously thats in extreme cases)
 
Haggisman said:
Thats not because the system is broken, thats because either you havent provided an accurate estimate of your usage (or it has reduced significantly), or your supplier has failed at basic maths (annual usage/12). My account has been in gradually reducing credit over winter, and is going to tick over into negative in the next month or 2, just in time for my usage to drop over the summer and build up that credit again (well, if my unit rates werent about to more than double), because my monthly bill is within a few £ of my annual usage/12 - which is exactly as it should be.

It's funny you mention interest - Ovo actually used to pay 3.5% interest on any credit balance, which was far higher than any savings account at the time!

You cant really treat it like a phone bill, because most people dont really have a choice in how much they use it, and unlike cutting off someone's phone if they dont pay - which is ultimately just an inconvenient - cutting off their gas/electric means they cant wash/cook/keep themselves warm, and will potentially freeze/starve (obviously thats in extreme cases)
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Even if its estimated readings, I want my DD to match the bill. What you say cant be done is exactly how credit accounts used to work before static DD was introduced, you was given a bill for the quarter and expected to pay it.

I think someone mentioned earlier (and they are right in my opinion) that the static DD payment system gives these companies working capital as we are effectively lending them money.

Now if Octopus want to give me shares in the company, I wont mind giving them working capital. :)

If the system wasnt broken there wouldnt be stories of people been quoted too low DD to get them on board and later having to increase to same as old supplier, and stories like mine also wouldnt exist, never mind the ofgem tax to recover lost credit balances.

Out of interest what other industry has a variable rate usage but charges fixed amount every month with credit balance?

Now if Octopus was paying me interest at that rate I would turn a blind eye to it.

The only valid argument for it I accept is that many? people cant handle variable bills, they really want consistent every month, and the solution for that I think is an intermediate holder of credit balances which means if the supplier goes bust the credit balance isnt lost.
 
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Haggisman said:
Thats not because the system is broken, thats because either you havent provided an accurate estimate of your usage (or it has reduced significantly), or your supplier has failed at basic maths (annual usage/12). My account has been in gradually reducing credit over winter, and is going to tick over into negative in the next month or 2, just in time for my usage to drop over the summer and build up that credit again (well, if my unit rates werent about to more than double), because my monthly bill is within a few £ of my annual usage/12 - which is exactly as it should be.

It's funny you mention interest - Ovo actually used to pay 3.5% interest on any credit balance, which was far higher than any savings account at the time!

You cant really treat it like a phone bill, because most people dont really have a choice in how much they use it, and unlike cutting off someone's phone if they dont pay - which is ultimately just an inconvenient - cutting off their gas/electric means they cant wash/cook/keep themselves warm, and will potentially freeze/starve (obviously thats in extreme cases)
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Good points.
 
Moved in a flat recently. Got a letter from Octopus to activate the move in account. It's a rented flat with 2 storage heaters.

Daily standing charge 23.38p per day
Unit rate Day 37.20p KWH
Unit rate Night 21.99p KWH.

Is that reasonable price?

Thanks
 
Water is heated in tank by electric too.

No gas.

As far I can see on the storage heater programmer, they don't charge at the night...no sure how or why . never understand how to use they properly.

I never use heat in the morning..I get up, shower and leave for work quickly.

Will storage heater store heat from night till the next evening like 6pm?
 
Yes, they should be wired in to charge/store up at the cheap rate, you set the input side to limit how much heat/leccy they use/heat up, at the cheap rate.
The boost dial needs to be set to minimum if you're out all day then turn the boost up to let the heat out when you come home.
Electric hot water the same, set the timer to heat it up at night, on the cheap rate. (hour or two will give you a full tank of hot water)

Look around for the best economy7 deal leccy wise , I'd chose one with low overnight electric cost.
 
Thanks guys. I think the storage heaters have been reset by the landlord before I moved in

How long should I set the 'charge' for? there is option 1hr 2hr....7hr.

Also, there is 2 options for boost, fan only, fan and element. At the moment, fan and element is on by default

I guess I use the fan in the evening if I set the heater on charge at night.

Thanks
 
Does anyone know what Octopus April price cap is ? I cant find any information.

The Loyal Octopus 12M Fixed is showing almost double of the standard from last year.
 
Pretty much the same as everyone else’s, it varies by region but just look back in this thread and you’ll see rough prices.

Roughly
28p per kWh and 48p per day for electric and 7p per kWh and 28p per day for gas.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
Pretty much the same as everyone else’s, it varies by region but just look back in this thread and you’ll see rough prices.

Roughly
28p per kWh and 48p per day for electric and 7p per kWh and 28p per day for gas.
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Thanks,

This is the fixed rate I can see online offered to me should i get it or stick with flex ?

⚡ Electricity
Daily standing charge 26.82p /day
Unit rate 35.14p /kWh
Early exit fee £0
Gas
Daily standing charge 26.10p /day
Unit rate 9.65p /kWh
Early exit fee £0
 
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