EV general discussion

[Richie]

Change the scheme and mark specific spaces - problem solved for many streets.

The issue I see with this is making a 2 tier society of those that can afford BEV cars being authorised to park on their street and those that cannot afford a BEV having to park on other streets which then causes problems for people that live on those other streets being unable to park.

Sure, there are allocated BEV spaces in proper car parks but that's different than banning ICE cars from parking on a street they have a permit for simply because there are no non-BEV spaces left but plenty of BEV ones.

 

[ICDP]

I think people are over complicating what 2035 will look like under current proposals. They are using absolute fringe case charging issues. Or they think it will be “big bang”. It will still take 20 plus years (from now) before EVs and a Hybrid are a majority of registered cars. Used ICE and hybrids will still be an available for a long time after the ban.

As EVs become more common the infrastructure and legislation will be changed to keep up. It already happened in Norway over the past decade or so. Yet people did not suddenly wake up one morning in Norway and found BEVs were the slight majority. It took a long time and will still take years for that majority to be significant.

Moving towards an ICE sales reduction and a BEV centric infrastructure will happen gradually and indeed has been happening for years. If you are arguing over the last few percent of car owners who might have charging issues, then it’s quite frankly small enough not to be a major impact overall.

Quite literally the number of people who can’t get access to some form of cheap charger once or twice a week is going to be tiny.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

Just take the Goldilocks. Why people are obsessed in convincing others is beyond me.

Has a leprechaun ever found gold at end of rainbow and told everyone else.

There’s two view. Get everyone to do it then accept the benefits erode fast. Or keep it quiet and milk it for what it’s worth. But don’t get upset when it goes the other way

You still haven't linked to where you claim I said people are stupid for not having an EV.
This is three times now - you just say "Sorry I got you mixed up with somebody else".

 

[Simon]

You still haven't linked to where you claim I said people are stupid for not having an EV.
This is three times now - you just say "Sorry I got you mixed up with somebody else"

Merry Xmas. Will have a look when I get chance

 

[Em3bbs]

You still haven't linked to where you claim I said people are stupid for not having an EV.
This is three times now - you just say "Sorry I got you mixed up with somebody else".

If he said he got it mixed up with somebody else, then how do you expect him to provide links.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

If he said he got it mixed up with somebody else, then how do you expect him to provide links.

That's all he needs to do, say sorry because there are no links.
From day one I have said it's a personal choice and I feel sorry for ICE owners who will eventually be forced up this route.
I have no idea why he came out with the comment he did.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

The issue I see with this is making a 2 tier society of those that can afford BEV cars being authorised to park on their street and those that cannot afford a BEV having to park on other streets which then causes problems for people that live on those other streets being unable to park.

Sure, there are allocated BEV spaces in proper car parks but that's different than banning ICE cars from parking on a street they have a permit for simply because there are no non-BEV spaces left but plenty of BEV ones.

The idea behind allocated spaces is that you have a space allocated to your property - it doesn’t matter if it is an EV or not. The space if yours to park what you want in. If you don’t need it, it can be allocated to another house until the point that you do (e.g. you always get first refusal).


Not sure I’d call it a 2 tier society. In reality, people with multiple cars are already parking them 3 streets away wherever they can find a space. The problem is too many cars not that those cars are EVs.

Even if the answer is public charging equipment which anyone can use on that particular street, those spaces are only going to be able to be used by people with an active charging session. The alternative is they have to charge in a public charger at the supermarket etc. which will always be very expensive compared to charging at home.

It’s inevitable that those without a driveway are going to get a worse deal compared to those that do - that’s already the case and has been since EVs were a thing.

When we moved house in 2019, I vetoed serval houses because I would see where this was going and houses with proper driveways are going to command even more of a premium compared to now.

Not only does the house we bought have 2 spaces, it is one of a handful that also has side by side parking and a double garage which is even better.

 

[GGizmo]

To answer OP's question, as late as possible.

 

[Richie]

The idea behind allocated spaces is that you have a space allocated to your property - it doesn’t matter if it is an EV or not. The space if yours to park what you want in. If you don’t need it, it can be allocated to another house until the point that you do (e.g. you always get first refusal).


Not sure I’d call it a 2 tier society. In reality, people with multiple cars are already parking them 3 streets away wherever they can find a space. The problem is too many cars not that those cars are EVs.

Apologies, I read your post as a follow on from @OspreyO post and assumed you meant making dedicated EV only bays which have the charging points and not allowing ICE cars to use them. That would obviously make it a little unfair for people that cannot afford EVs in a parking permit/allocated parking zone.

If that was not what you meant, ignore me.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Apologies, I read your post as a follow on from @OspreyO post and assumed you meant making dedicated EV only bays which have the charging points and not allowing ICE cars to use them. That would obviously make it a little unfair for people that cannot afford EVs in a parking permit/allocated parking zone.

If that was not what you meant, ignore me.

No, that would certainly make things tricky but it’s not dissimilar to putting public chargers on street (e.g. the existing lamp post chargers).

 

[Journey]

To answer OP's question, as late as possible.

Doesn't really answer it though, as they'll never ban ICE that already exists so you could literally avoid using an electric powertrain until you either stop driving, or die.

 

[ICDP]

Doesn't really answer it though, as they'll never ban ICE that already exists so you could literally avoid using an electric powertrain until you either stop driving, or die.

Exactly. The ridiculous notion that the push to EVs won’t work because a few % of people have fringe case issues around charging point access. It’s not about getting 100% conversion, it’s about reducing the impact of climate change. There will still be cases where ICE exists, but it’s still worth doing.

It’s like saying safety belts are pointless because they might chafe in a crash.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

Doesn't really answer it though, as they'll never ban ICE that already exists so you could literally avoid using an electric powertrain until you either stop driving, or die.

Don't you think fossil fuel will become so expensive they will price ICE out?

 

[Journey]

Don't you think fossil fuel will become so expensive they will price ICE out?

No. Because people who are so vehemently against having a battery power their vehicle would likely cut their nose of to spite their face, so I am sure they'll happily pay a few quid more to run ICE to prove their point. They are also they type of people who could have a BEV car now and be saving a load of money, you know detached house, drive way, loads of space, but they do 3 trips a year where they'll have to charge so they don't want to spend 20 mins charging as they value there time so much, forgetting they waste many hours a year putting fuel in a car.

Its actual started to become funny the excuses and rubbish that are brought up, here's one I had in the last week from my in-laws neighbour who has an Aygo and goes to the local park, and takes his wife to the hair dressers. He said he looked at an electric car, but was told by the Toyota garage that they would be displaced by hydrogen in the next 2-3 years and his vehicle would become worthless and they wouldn't trade it in. He totally believed everything he was told as he has bought Toyota for the last 20+ years, and when I tried to explain that he was being lied to, he accused me of being brainwashed, the irony.

 

[Deleted User 298457]

No. Because people who are so vehemently against having a battery power their vehicle would likely cut their nose of to spite their face, so I am sure they'll happily pay a few quid more to run ICE to prove their point. They are also they type of people who could have a BEV car now and be saving a load of money, you know detached house, drive way, loads of space, but they do 3 trips a year where they'll have to charge so they don't want to spend 20 mins charging as they value there time so much, forgetting they waste many hours a year putting fuel in a car.

Its actual started to become funny the excuses and rubbish that are brought up, here's one I had in the last week from my in-laws neighbour who has an Aygo and goes to the local park, and takes his wife to the hair dressers. He said he looked at an electric car, but was told by the Toyota garage that they would be displaced by hydrogen in the next 2-3 years and his vehicle would become worthless and they wouldn't trade it in. He totally believed everything he was told as he has bought Toyota for the last 20+ years, and when I tried to explain that he was being lied to, he accused me of being brainwashed, the irony.

The Hydrogen-believers x Toyota owners are a weird crossover that has happened too many times to be a coincidence.

 

[OspreyO]

Apologies, I read your post as a follow on from @OspreyO post and assumed you meant making dedicated EV only bays which have the charging points and not allowing ICE cars to use them. That would obviously make it a little unfair for people that cannot afford EVs in a parking permit/allocated parking zone.

If that was not what you meant, ignore me.

Consider how do we have lamppost chargers that aren't blocked by ICE vehicles.

 

[Simon]

That's all he needs to do, say sorry because there are no links.
From day one I have said it's a personal choice and I feel sorry for ICE owners who will eventually be forced up this route.
I have no idea why he came out with the comment he did.

your name is sexygreyfox. I searched stupid and your name and got 25 pages. To be honest I not sure why you so nervous about it. It’s the impression I get from you. I mean showing your neighbours that cars drive past their house on CCTV is a bit weird. Then you bought a nearly new EV to drive 50miles a week to save money just shouts out you are missing the TCO.

But hey. I have a EV and a ICE and haven’t joined the KKK or had a bar mitzvah yet so I’m kind of in middle and don’t suffer from purchase justification syndrome

Merry Christmas ‘sexy’

 

[ICDP]

Had a conversation from a relative about why my wife and I both have EVs. It was the typical FUD bingo.

- Expensive to buy.
- Very short range.
- Take hours to charge.
- Yeah but what about on longer trips.
- The battery will fail in a few years.
- Fire risk

I debunked every point with ease as usual before they got bored a moved on. I just finished with a “I didn’t take you for a daily heil reader”.

 

[Demon]

Had a conversation from a relative about why my wife and I both have EVs. It was the typical FUD bingo.

- Expensive to buy.
- Very short range.
- Take hours to charge.
- Yeah but what about on longer trips.
- The battery will fail in a few years.
- Fire risk

I debunked every point with ease as usual before they got bored a moved on. I just finished with a “I didn’t take you for a daily heil reader”.

Lol, we had a guy in work basically echoing the same comments, I just kept politely pointing out the realities of EVs, good and bad..

Fast forward a few months, we now have 28 free chargers in work for EVs and I was gobsmacked when the same guy announced his Pug 3008 needs replacing and he’s looking at an e2008 as they have good deals on (nearly £8k) and his Mrs thought it felt the most familiar. I did mention you can get faster/longer range in that segment, but they seem to be Peugeot through and through and understand the 250 miles wltp is more likely to be 150-180 in reality.. but he does 12-15k per year so fuel savings (42mpg in his 3008) are significant.

It helps that we’ve had an EV uprising in work, Sal sac and free chargers a plenty have really hammered home fuel savings for those that can buy them efficiently.

 

[lordrobs]

As EVs become more common the infrastructure and legislation will be changed to keep up. It already happened in Norway over the past decade or so. Yet people did not suddenly wake up one morning in Norway and found BEVs were the slight majority. It took a long time and will still take years for that majority to be significant.

Is there any irony intended when people play the "what about Norway?" card?

A country with less than 10% of our population and massive wealth from selling fossil fuels to the rest of the world.

If the dream really is to become more Norway we better start rinsing that North Sea before the oil and gas ship has sailed. As for the population... Do we go full Logan's Run? Or maybe a lottery based system starting with those without off street parking?

This is all in gest of course because it doesn't really matter. Why people get so worked up about it is a little odd. Simon has the right idea, it's just another fuel option. If it works for you, get on it while it's cheap.

The problem is too many cars on the road and not enough viable alternatives and I say that with no disillusionment that I'm not part of the problem, I've got two of the things.