A starbucks Brexit latte with organic soy milk lite.
Poll: Exit Poll: UK General Election 2017 - Results discussion and OcUK Exit Poll - Closing 8th July
- Thread starter JohnnyG
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A starbucks Brexit latte with organic soy milk lite.
some thoughts
For the best of the nation overall imo and a somewhat probable vision of the future
1.May forms her Govt
2.Brexit negotiations start
3.Talks end (12 or so months form now)
4.May steps down/forced out,cons have a leadership election
5.Another election called by new PM(Hope it would be David Davis)
6.New govt formed(hopefully majority in either direction,hung parliament is bad in general imo)
7.Whatever is negotiated is either accepted/rejected by the commission/nation states after their deliberations(assumed to take 4-6 months)
8.Newly formed Govt responds
9.???
Another Tory leadership contest or GE in the short term would be extremely bad for the nation IMO when it comes to negotiation with the EU.An uncertain govt and lack of clear leadership is terrible for foreign relations and for our geo-politics
As an aside,Labour under corbyn has clearly exceeded expectations and increased their vote share aswell as their overall seats.The torys lost seats,yet also increased their vote share which seemed to have been glossed over in the media and in the discourse.
Maybe finally we will have an honest discussion about public services,clearly the result has proven a lot are in general unhappy about the current situation with spending,yet we are currently still running a deficit.If we want substantial increases it does have to be paid for,maybe we will finally admit the spending people want needs to be properly funded via taxes across the board,a permanently increasing the debt is not a tangible position. Labs manifesto about no tax or living cost increases due to to their spending pledges for 95% of the population does not seem at all in the realm of realistic(Bar massive borrowing).In scotland we have higher spending per head than in the England,buts its untenable,it has to be paid for somewhere down the line,maybe some1 will raise their head above the parapet and admit,everyone has to pay more if they want it to continue/increase that many are advocating for.Im pragmatic not an ideologue.
The most interesting thing about the outcome is the lack of a substantial lib-dem surge in votes or seats on the anti brexit platform,Lab and the Cons both implied an end to FoM in their manifesto which clearly points towards a 'hard brexit'(As usual Immigration as an issue was ignored in the GE,at what point does this become an honestly addressed issue in a GE?)
I supported the Torys myself as an anti SNP vote primarly,but also against labours current 'left' leadership.Clearly we are close to 50/50 split as a nation when it comes to how our society and Govt functions.Im pragmatic,make a case and make it a realistic goal,dont promise me the world with no substance,SNP tried this with Indy so far,lab in their current incarnation are doing this atm imo.I cant support that,its disingenuous.
At least Alex 'Mr Smug' Salmond lost his seat,and indeyref2 is dead for the foreseeable future joyous news xD
For the best of the nation overall imo and a somewhat probable vision of the future
1.May forms her Govt
2.Brexit negotiations start
3.Talks end (12 or so months form now)
4.May steps down/forced out,cons have a leadership election
5.Another election called by new PM(Hope it would be David Davis)
6.New govt formed(hopefully majority in either direction,hung parliament is bad in general imo)
7.Whatever is negotiated is either accepted/rejected by the commission/nation states after their deliberations(assumed to take 4-6 months)
8.Newly formed Govt responds
9.???
Another Tory leadership contest or GE in the short term would be extremely bad for the nation IMO when it comes to negotiation with the EU.An uncertain govt and lack of clear leadership is terrible for foreign relations and for our geo-politics
As an aside,Labour under corbyn has clearly exceeded expectations and increased their vote share aswell as their overall seats.The torys lost seats,yet also increased their vote share which seemed to have been glossed over in the media and in the discourse.
Maybe finally we will have an honest discussion about public services,clearly the result has proven a lot are in general unhappy about the current situation with spending,yet we are currently still running a deficit.If we want substantial increases it does have to be paid for,maybe we will finally admit the spending people want needs to be properly funded via taxes across the board,a permanently increasing the debt is not a tangible position. Labs manifesto about no tax or living cost increases due to to their spending pledges for 95% of the population does not seem at all in the realm of realistic(Bar massive borrowing).In scotland we have higher spending per head than in the England,buts its untenable,it has to be paid for somewhere down the line,maybe some1 will raise their head above the parapet and admit,everyone has to pay more if they want it to continue/increase that many are advocating for.Im pragmatic not an ideologue.
The most interesting thing about the outcome is the lack of a substantial lib-dem surge in votes or seats on the anti brexit platform,Lab and the Cons both implied an end to FoM in their manifesto which clearly points towards a 'hard brexit'(As usual Immigration as an issue was ignored in the GE,at what point does this become an honestly addressed issue in a GE?)
I supported the Torys myself as an anti SNP vote primarly,but also against labours current 'left' leadership.Clearly we are close to 50/50 split as a nation when it comes to how our society and Govt functions.Im pragmatic,make a case and make it a realistic goal,dont promise me the world with no substance,SNP tried this with Indy so far,lab in their current incarnation are doing this atm imo.I cant support that,its disingenuous.
At least Alex 'Mr Smug' Salmond lost his seat,and indeyref2 is dead for the foreseeable future joyous news xD
But negotiations will start in 10 days and the EU already said they didn't care about her majority (or lack of lol).
Plus they now have definitive proof that the public back brexit and double manifesto pledges to end freedom of movement.
Soldato
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the dup doesn't hold power for their own agenda, just enough to slow down maybot on her more extreme choices like a hard brexit, this isn't going to become some Presbyterian machine like many fear.
any stupid agenda pushed by the dup will merely be shot down by the con's, their only hope is to make negotiations slightly more in favour of ni, who has a significant number of businesses who are very much in favour of free trade in the eu.
not to mention a hard brexit means a land border with eire which genuinely stands a chance of re-igniting the troubles of old, which no sane person wants.
Tbh I don't really see how another GE in the middle of Brexit negotiations helps us much.
The Tories created this whole situation. Called the EU ref; called the latest GE.
They made our collective bed; let them try to sort it out. Cameron ran away after the EU ref (quitter); the poisoned chalice of Brexit belongs to the Tories and the Tories alone.
If it's really bad, another party can step in at the next GE post-Brexit, and the Tories will be unelectable for years after.
The Tories created this whole situation. Called the EU ref; called the latest GE.
They made our collective bed; let them try to sort it out. Cameron ran away after the EU ref (quitter); the poisoned chalice of Brexit belongs to the Tories and the Tories alone.
If it's really bad, another party can step in at the next GE post-Brexit, and the Tories will be unelectable for years after.
Soldato
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There will be another general election in October say BBC Political Editor Laura Kuenssberg
Soldato
Speaking of which, what did you reckon to Mr Fish Finger, the guy in the fishfinger outfit stood behind Farron last night? I checked his Twitter where he was saying how Farron referred to him as Mr Finger and nearly wet myself. God bless some of our indies, Lord Bucketheads promo video wa spretty funny too.
I like to think of it as peculiarly British, but I suppose most countries have them too...
You see, the thing with joining EEA or whatever is that ultimately the EU has so many disparate groups wrt to economy, that it's had enough in Brussels of this situation.
I can see in the next 10 years that they'll be eliminating most of them and forcing the EURO on people if they wish to remain in the market.
The EU knows that the Tory party will never have a responsible leadership to govern after Brexit and the left leaning parties all (regardless of words that have spewed forth) gravitate back to centralising power in supra-national efforts.
Its over, you should just sell the pound while its hot.
I can see in the next 10 years that they'll be eliminating most of them and forcing the EURO on people if they wish to remain in the market.
The EU knows that the Tory party will never have a responsible leadership to govern after Brexit and the left leaning parties all (regardless of words that have spewed forth) gravitate back to centralising power in supra-national efforts.
Its over, you should just sell the pound while its hot.
Soldato
of course the EU don't care because it gives them almost carte blanche as they know she has no power or control of her own parliament. They have definitive proof of nothing untill we see what the price of Mays news Terrorist friends is for their loyalty. Brexit will now be shaped according to what the DUP want for NI and that is not fully compatible with what the Tories were talking about for the UK as a whole
Permabanned
When it comes to votes in parliament on BREXIT May has no majority even with DUP support...
When parliament reconvenes there will be vote on guaranteeing EU citizens right in the UK which will pass.....
When parliament reconvenes there will be vote on guaranteeing EU citizens right in the UK which will pass.....
Definitive proof? The election result sends a clear signal that the electorate are not happy with TM's plans for a hard 'at all costs' Brexit. She fought the election campaign primarily (in fact almost exclusively) on a "give me a mandate for a strong and stable Brexit" ticket and it backfired. Partly because it seems enough of the electorate reject this and partly because there's a whole host of other issues which voters are worried about, not least of them austerity and provision of public services.
Brexit may not fully come off the rails (although that remains a possibility) but it will likely not be the clinical hard Brexit TM was (still is?) pushing for.
The UK has just failed
Associate
Forget May she has caused all this instability herself when it didn't need to happen. She's incompetent.
I think parliament needs to come together and deliver Brexit together as a whole for the good of the nation.
I think parliament needs to come together and deliver Brexit together as a whole for the good of the nation.
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Soldato
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no ****, i challenge any poster who thinks this is a good thing to come and build that wall.
i promise that at least 1/3 of the local population won't be openly trying to kill you.
Soldato
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Wow, I'm shocked. I actually left these threads early on when I could see the horrible campaign May was having. I thought I was alone in my thoughts on this. I started to warm to Corbyn as well. This being a very pro conservative forum usually, and me being a little bit embarrassed about warming to Corbyn after my criticisms of him, I thought I really was the minority and decided not to read or engage in the threads. But wow, you guys have shocked me. I didn't realise people were warming to him and Labour here as well - thought it was just me! Maybe I should have stuck around in the end ? 
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Lib Dems have/had better people for that kind of stuff - get Vince Cable and David Laws on it.
Caporegime
Soldato
They agreed to an election when they were 22 points behind in the polls.
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