Former Russian double agent seriously ill in Salisbury.

[Nasher]

Have the BBC got around to reporting the £800000 donations from Russian oligarchs to the Conservative party in the last year?

The £15000 ticket to dine with Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson?

Of course not.

**** Westminster and the BBC.

Not all of the oligarchs back Putin though. Many are in the UK trying to hide from him and aren't doing anything illegal in the UK. The oligarch killed a few days ago was a Putin critic.

 

[Danny75]

Of A Type Developed By Liars

I have now received confirmation from a well placed FCO source that Porton Down scientists are not able to identify the nerve gas as being of Russian manufacture, and have been resentful of the pressure being placed on them to do so. Porton Down would only sign up to the formulation “of a type developed by Russia” after a rather difficult meeting where this was agreed as a compromise formulation. The Russians were allegedly researching, in the “Novichok” programme a generation of nerve agents which could be produced from commercially available precursors such as insecticides and fertilisers. This substance is a “novichok” in that sense. It is of that type. Just as I am typing on a laptop of a type developed by the United States, though this one was made in China.

To anybody with a Whitehall background this has been obvious for several days. The government has never said the nerve agent was made in Russia, or that it can only be made in Russia. The exact formulation “of a type developed by Russia” was used by Theresa May in parliament, used by the UK at the UN Security Council, used by Boris Johnson on the BBC yesterday and, most tellingly of all, “of a type developed by Russia” is the precise phrase used in the joint communique issued by the UK, USA, France and Germany yesterday:

This use of a military-grade nerve agent, of a type developed by Russia, constitutes the first offensive use of a nerve agent in Europe since the Second World War.

When the same extremely careful phrasing is never deviated from, you know it is the result of a very delicate Whitehall compromise. My FCO source, like me, remembers the extreme pressure put on FCO staff and other civil servants to sign off the dirty dossier on Iraqi WMD, some of which pressure I recount in my memoir Murder in Samarkand. She volunteered the comparison to what is happening now, particularly at Porton Down, with no prompting from me.

Separately I have written to the media office at OPCW to ask them to confirm that there has never been any physical evidence of the existence of Russian Novichoks, and the programme of inspection and destruction of Russian chemical weapons was completed last year.

Did you know these interesting facts?

OPCW inspectors have had full access to all known Russian chemical weapons facilities for over a decade – including those identified by the “Novichok” alleged whistleblower Mirzayanov – and last year OPCW inspectors completed the destruction of the last of 40,000 tonnes of Russian chemical weapons

By contrast the programme of destruction of US chemical weapons stocks still has five years to run

Israel has extensive stocks of chemical weapons but has always refused to declare any of them to the OPCW. Israel is not a state party to the Chemical Weapons Convention nor a member of the OPCW. Israel signed in 1993 but refused to ratify as this would mean inspection and destruction of its chemical weapons. Israel undoubtedly has as much technical capacity as any state to synthesise “Novichoks”.

Until this week, the near universal belief among chemical weapons experts, and the official position of the OPCW, was that “Novichoks” were at most a theoretical research programme which the Russians had never succeeded in actually synthesising and manufacturing. That is why they are not on the OPCW list of banned chemical weapons.

Porton Down is still not certain it is the Russians who have apparently synthesised a “Novichok”. Hence “Of a type developed by Russia”. Note developed, not made, produced or manufactured.

It is very carefully worded propaganda. Of a type developed by liars.

UPDATE

This post prompted another old colleague to get in touch. On the bright side, the FCO have persuaded Boris he has to let the OPCW investigate a sample. But not just yet. The expectation is the inquiry committee will be chaired by a Chinese delegate. The Boris plan is to get the OPCW also to sign up to the “as developed by Russia” formula, and diplomacy to this end is being undertaken in Beijing right now.

I don’t suppose there is any sign of the BBC doing any actual journalism on this?

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/03/of-a-type-developed-by-liars/

 

[Angilion]

Because they'e not talking about bloody world war 2 which was over 70 years ago they're talking about the response of the UK's present day allies.

Most of the world isnt stuck in some ww2 fantasy and understands the use of the word allies to simply be plural to ally and not a ww2 reference.

That depends on how it's used. 'allies' is simply the plural of ally. 'Allies' might not be and 'the Allies' almost certainly won't be.

 

[garnett]

To think that Putins government is any different than our own is laughable.

Inability to see any differences. Lol.

 

[Mynight]

Maybe I'm being thick but are there readily available public nerve agents?

I'm confused why it always has the "military" distinction.

 

[dowie]

Maybe I'm being thick but are there readily available public nerve agents?

I'm confused why it always has the "military" distinction.

I was thinking the same... it is often a nonsense phrase when attached to things in that manner

like "military grade" encryption... as though it uses some special secret mathematics only the military have access too...

It can have a purpose I guess in signifying that something has been manufactured to military specifications... though that doesn't necessarily imply that that something has been manufactured in the best possible way which is in contrast to how the phrase is seemingly often used

 

[Pants]

I take it to mean that the agent needed significant resources, for example of a military, to develop. That it wasn't made without state funding.

 

[dowie]

There's also talk of Skripal being about to defect back to Russia, and that he was possibly involved in all this, plus what he will have learnt about working for MI6, ensured he had to be bumped off.

It is quite possible he's never even set foot in the building, aside from perhaps coming in as a guest to deliver a talk or something. He was an agent not an Intelligence Officer (for them).

Likewise Kim Philby (perhaps rather naively) believed he was a colonel in the KGB rather than just an asset/agent and was a bit disappointed when he arrived in Moscow and was basically confined to an apartment and constantly kept under surveillance - he ended up as a depressed alcoholic and died of heart failure.

 

[Rroff]

I take it to mean that the agent needed significant resources, for example of a military, to develop. That it wasn't made without state funding.

That or in the case of chemical/biological warfare weaponised in terms of how it works for instance tweaked to kill faster, etc.

 

[dowie]

That or in the case of chemical/biological warfare weaponised in terms of how it works for instance tweaked to kill faster, etc.

as opposed to the non-military grade nerve agents which don't kill so fast? Who develops and purchases those ones?

 

[Werewolf]

as opposed to the non-military grade nerve agents which don't kill so fast? Who develops and purchases those ones?

From memory many fly sprays are effectively nerve agents, as are many farming pesticides, some industrial chemical compounds etc.
It's much the same way you can get "military spec" technology vs standard spec (and vehicles)

The main difference is concentration and if they are "optimised" for use against humans as weapons (as opposed to being low concentration, hard to deploy or require long term exposure), I think the organophosphate family of pesticides are well known for causing a lot of the same issues as trace exposure to some of the "military" nerve agents as they work in similar ways (except one is optimised for use against large mammals, and one is optimised for use against insects).

It is possible to make many of the more basic nerve agents in fairly simple labs from my understanding (Sarin gas was used by a cult in Japan in one attack), but the resources and knowledge to make the more deadly/weaponized versions tends to be much higher. A bit like it's possible for virtually anyone with basic skills to make a single shot gun out of fairly basic tools/parts, but to make an M16 takes a lot more equipment, knowledge and far better materials (all of which makes it easier to trace who likely made it).

 

[jpaul]

as opposed to the non-military grade nerve agents which don't kill so fast? Who develops and purchases those ones?

agree - predominately a label for un-necessary dramatic effect, and does a dis-service to speech, let's have plain speaking.
(same as marketting of many professional products, pharmaceutical grade has more credibility)

 

[Chris Wilson]

Gee that Craig Murray human rights activist chap has had some lousy jobs, none of which he remained at long, I wonder why....?

 

[Sankari]

Interesting read.
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2018/03/the-novichok-story-is-indeed-another-iraqi-wmd-scam/

Hysterical nonsense.

 

[Zethor]

Ya former Russians spies dropping like flies is a conspiracy organised by the West/Muslims/the Left etc.

How can one be so stupid and function in life?

 

[gettothechopper]

It's military grade because it's a weapon of war, like a tank or machine gun or missile

 

[RaohNS]

Inability to see any differences. Lol.

Its the nature of governments to lie and behave in an extra judicial way. Lets not ignore JPEL that we operate constantly.

 

[stockhausen]

Russia to close the British Council in Russia - I imagine that they have looked forward to that for ages.
The BBC next?

 

[Chris Wilson]

Russia to close the British Council in Russia - I imagine that they have looked forward to that for ages.
The BBC next?

I used to do some work for members of The British Council and they were more Trotskyist than anyone else I have met, they'll be far too Left for the modern day Russians and as you say, they'll not be missed

 

[Delvis]

So, is there any actual conclusive evidence yet? Other than lolrussians