Soldato
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They defo have too many uk mps, need pr.
Good news for Scotland (and the rest of us)..
- Thread starter n111ck
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Man of Honour
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Its far too early for Labour to be jumping for joy as if they suddenly think SNP voters are going to immediately swing back to Labour, I don't see it.
If anything Sturgeon leaving gives a chance for her successor to "fix" the GRA mess and draw a line under it.
I know public opinion in the UK is different but there are only 2-3 contentious parts of it that Scots are really not keen on - the 16 Years old age minimum and being able to go ahead without Medical Certification, there are plenty of SNP MSP's who think that too (including a couple of potential leadership candidates).
Labour's polling in Scotland is still broadly where its been for the last 3-4 years with a slight increase of late due to the Scottish Tories dropping.
If anything Sturgeon leaving gives a chance for her successor to "fix" the GRA mess and draw a line under it.
I know public opinion in the UK is different but there are only 2-3 contentious parts of it that Scots are really not keen on - the 16 Years old age minimum and being able to go ahead without Medical Certification, there are plenty of SNP MSP's who think that too (including a couple of potential leadership candidates).
Labour's polling in Scotland is still broadly where its been for the last 3-4 years with a slight increase of late due to the Scottish Tories dropping.
Man of Honour
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You can only work with the electoral system we have, FPTP is well beyond being fit for purpose but neither the Tories or Labour want to do anything to fix it
You're incredibly forgiving lol..
Exit the walking pant-suit of paradox from a Scotland poorer and less healthy than ever
First Minister’s ostrich neck turned to brass as her rambling, self-congratulatory resignation blamed her political bumps on others
www.telegraph.co.uk
Some choice extracts from behind the paywall..
The First Minister declared with a perfectly straight-face, her pride at being the first female to hold that office – despite her recent struggles with defining what a woman is. “I’m a feminist”, insisted she who was content to house a double rapist in a women’s prison.
She was “convinced” the cause for independence was being won: in much the same way that an ostrich is convinced the sand in which it has plonked its head is an effective form of camouflage. Ms Sturgeon is a walking pantsuit of paradox; sketch writers will miss her. Perhaps she’ll use her departure to reestablish closer terms with reality; currently, she’s barely on nodding acquaintance.
Soon we moved from ostrich neck to brass neck. Ms Sturgeon called for a less polarised, less toxic politics; it was the voters who were wrong of course. A homily on the perils of political polarisation from the SNP is a bit like getting a lecture on marital fidelity from Boris Johnson.
Rambling, self-congratulatory, with any bumps along the way being the obvious fault of other people; this was the Apologia Pro Nicola Sua.
Scotland is “fairer” today, she insisted, picking a nice, impossible-to-measure metric to end on. What does it even mean? She might as well have said “Scotland is rainblowier today”, “Scotland is Papier-mâché-er today”, or “Scotland is Jabberwockier today”. Perhaps this was why, despite addressing reporters from the capital of the Scottish Enlightenment, she didn’t go down the road of empirical evidence: she leaves Scotland poorer, less healthy, more addicted than ever.
Soldato
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Labour in England is completely different from Scotland; just as we view Sturgeon as the SNP leader when it's actually Stephen Flynn we also view the Labour leader as Anas Sarwar. And if you think he's a non entity, don't get me started on Douglas Ross.
Your comments regarding Starmer are closer to revealing why the SNP are so successful - this Tory government are so awful that a vote for Labour should be a shoe-in but it isn't, and that's testament to how weak Labour are. The SNP provide a viable alternative to them both and that's what the English electorate is crying out for.
There are plenty of people, including myself, who vote for the SNP and don't want independence from the UK; we just want an independent government because for the majority of Scots the Tories do not even come close to reflecting our values.
My personal opinion is that there is absolutely no point in voting for a Westminster party to lead a devolved government and I would like to see a day when the SNP no longer lead on an independence mandate and simply provide an independent [from Westminster] choice of government. Sturgeons resignation is a step towards that evolution of the party, and whilst I admire her greatly I am glad to see the next chapter open.
I know it goes against the independence argument but why not expand the party into the UK? It would be more successful that way. It would have to change some policies but it could be more positive to bringing people together.
Soldato
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I think that's a contradiction; an SNP party encompassing the UK would be a Westminster based party, a UK party. That's the broken system the UK already has.
From a wider UK perspective then it's SNP, Plaid Cmryu, Sinn Féin. The notable absence is the English representative. Nationalism in each of the home nations can unfortunately differ. Scotland and Wales enjoy a brand of nationalism that is progressive and compassionate, England doesn't and NI certainly doesn't.
The UK is very complicated politically, and I personally believe that an encompassing Westminster government serves no-one, and that includes our English colleagues.
I don't know what the answer is for the English electorate; I don't envy their choice one bit - if I were resident in England I might not bother voting at all.
Permabanned
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How does support for the SNP vary between Highlanders and Lowlanders? I have a Highlander friend who believes the split is obvious, but it was merely pub talk, I have never observed any data on a potential split.
To be fair, that's a reasonable advantage!
Then spin out into sister parties? An ENP, WNP, NINP? Create a set of independent parties that collaborate rather than oppose.
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She oversees part of the governance of one country in the union with eight million population largely of one culture . Westminster oversees the governance of all the Union, about seventy million people and multicultural as well. Being first minister is similar to a medium level cabinet position in the Westminster governing party. She did well with Covid after being given the tools to do the job.
A Torygraph article? Really?You're incredibly forgiving lol..
Exit the walking pant-suit of paradox from a Scotland poorer and less healthy than ever
First Minister’s ostrich neck turned to brass as her rambling, self-congratulatory resignation blamed her political bumps on others
Some choice extracts from behind the paywall..
The First Minister declared with a perfectly straight-face, her pride at being the first female to hold that office – despite her recent struggles with defining what a woman is. “I’m a feminist”, insisted she who was content to house a double rapist in a women’s prison.
She was “convinced” the cause for independence was being won: in much the same way that an ostrich is convinced the sand in which it has plonked its head is an effective form of camouflage. Ms Sturgeon is a walking pantsuit of paradox; sketch writers will miss her. Perhaps she’ll use her departure to reestablish closer terms with reality; currently, she’s barely on nodding acquaintance.
Soon we moved from ostrich neck to brass neck. Ms Sturgeon called for a less polarised, less toxic politics; it was the voters who were wrong of course. A homily on the perils of political polarisation from the SNP is a bit like getting a lecture on marital fidelity from Boris Johnson.
Rambling, self-congratulatory, with any bumps along the way being the obvious fault of other people; this was the Apologia Pro Nicola Sua.
Scotland is “fairer” today, she insisted, picking a nice, impossible-to-measure metric to end on. What does it even mean? She might as well have said “Scotland is rainblowier today”, “Scotland is Papier-mâché-er today”, or “Scotland is Jabberwockier today”. Perhaps this was why, despite addressing reporters from the capital of the Scottish Enlightenment, she didn’t go down the road of empirical evidence: she leaves Scotland poorer, less healthy, more addicted than ever.
The Daily Telegraph is politically conservative and has endorsed the Conservative Party at every UK general election since 1945. The personal links between the paper's editors and the leadership of the Conservative Party, along with the paper's generally right-wing stance and influence over Conservative activists, have led the paper commonly to be referred to, especially in Private Eye, as the Torygraph. Even when Conservative support was shown to have slumped in the opinion polls and Labour gained the ascendant, the newspaper remained loyal to the Conservatives. This loyalty continued after Labour ousted the Conservatives from power by an election result in 1997, and in the face of Labour election wins in 2001and the third successive Labour election win in 2005.
they’re hardly going to write an unbiased or even fair article in support of the leader of the party that has all bust made the Tory party in Scotland has beens.
From what I've read I don't think Trans people thought of it like that.
So you are saying she left Scotland richer, healthier and less addicted?
Its only really some Scottish media that actually liked her so most media will be negative so not surprising you would class this as biased.
Trans people are a tiny percentage - she couldn't care less about them - she thought woke = popular and misjudged the mood of the UK spectacularly.
It's just as split here in the Highlands as it is anywhere else. Hard to compare the two lands due to the population difference (15% vs 85% roughly).
I just hope that Scotland can put Sturgeon and indefyref behind them and can focus on more important aspects of life.
Another out of touch politician who doesn't see that the noisy minority are not representative.
It’s exactly that.
Well the hill was was the GRR not the GRA and she absolutely did make a right fool of herself, and in doing so at least partially contribute to her downfall by allowing herself to be left in the position she was found in that recent interview where she could neither appease the cultists nor the plurality of the general public, who had by now seen the metaphorical naked emperor in all his glory, all whilst she was desperately trying to cling onto the nonsence she had just legislated for whilst calling her opponents bigots!
It's a shame there wasn't more public and media scrutiny of the GRA back in before/2004.
One can read the objections raised to the bill by politicians on Hansard and see that the objections raised have rather been vindicated with the passage of time. And all from a bill with homophobic undertones of a fiction/ fudge designed mostly to get around the unwillingness of the parliament at the time to just legislate for same sex legal unions.
The GRA has only flown under the radar to the extent it was because access to its provisions had quite a few steps and at least a veneer of 3rd party scrutiny and too few politicians were put in the position Sturgeon was, were they actually had to defend the stuff they had legislated for (or accept they were utterly wrong).
Sturgeon could do neither of the above (actually stick by her policy and its logical consequences or accept it was wrong).
A craven excuse for a politician, albeit one amongst many others.
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