Grooming gangs

asim18 said:
No it's not. If you try to rape someone's child who the parent actually cares for, you will most likely get shot with a double barrel and no one will ever hear from this person again and the chief of police will get paid a small fee to keep his mouth shut.

I mean most of the girl's parents in this particular scandal were completely absent. No father whatsoever so you need to compare like for like here. Yes poor people/children without families get abused in poor countries like India/Pakistan. The girls had no families, no family structure, were easily enticed to drugs, etc.

You saying "Pakistan child abuse is common" makes it sound as if no parent in Pakistan gives a crap about their own kids and just rents them out as prostitutes. A good parent is a good parent regardless of where they come from, but it's certainly not as normalised as you make it sound.
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Just because it's common doesn't mean it's got the green light from parents, and so doesn't really indicate if they are good or bad.

Here's an article which highlights the issue -

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....00-child-abuse-talk-still-a-taboo-in-pakistan

On a related point I did say that we ought to look at improving the situation that vulnerable children are in to make them less vulnerable and protected one way or another from abusers but that was interpreted as victim blaming...

robgmun said:
The problem is that in the middle-east culture and religion are so intertwined it's difficult to separate the two, even for those in the middle-east. For example the full face veil, i bet a big section of middle-east men think it's religious when it's not
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Technically there is some basis for the veil in jurisprudence but yes you're right although I was referring to a specific issue (i.e.grooming) and doesn't concern the Middle East as such.
 
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asim18 said:
Exactly. And the only reason one would feel self-conscious about being racist, is if they actually were a racist, and racism is increasing. If someone was truly honest with themselves and knew they weren't a racist, why on earth would they feel self-conscious about appearing racist to others? [..]
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Because how you appear to other people determines how you are treated, obviously. For example, you openly state that everyone who is concerned about other people wrongly thinking they are racist is racist. You are a perfect example of the answer to your own question.

This is why defamation of character, slander and libel are real things and are covered by law - what other people think is true about a person does affect that person. If it didn't, none of those things would matter or even be considered things at all. In the current society, a "white" person being perceived as racist will harm them. It will reduce their social status and could cost them promotion, their job, their home, their family, even their freedom. It's always harmful to be perceived as either supporting unfashionable strains of irrational prejudice or not supporting fashionable strains of irrational prejudice. Which strains are fashionable and which are unfashionable change from time to time and place to place, but it's always true that being perceived as being unfashionable in irrational prejudice is harmful. The reality doesn't matter at all, only the perception of others.
 
Angilion said:
Because how you appear to other people determines how you are treated, obviously. For example, you openly state that everyone who is concerned about other people wrongly thinking they are racist is racist. You are a perfect example of the answer to your own question.

This is why defamation of character, slander and libel are real things and are covered by law - what other people think is true about a person does affect that person. If it didn't, none of those things would matter or even be considered things at all. In the current society, a "white" person being perceived as racist will harm them. It will reduce their social status and could cost them promotion, their job, their home, their family, even their freedom. It's always harmful to be perceived as either supporting unfashionable strains of irrational prejudice or not supporting fashionable strains of irrational prejudice. Which strains are fashionable and which are unfashionable change from time to time and place to place, but it's always true that being perceived as being unfashionable in irrational prejudice is harmful. The reality doesn't matter at all, only the perception of others.
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But the police force isn't "a person". You might have one arresting officer, but it's not that individual officer's personal investigation, that officer isn't magically racist just because he's arresting someone based on ACTUAL evidence and support from his force. You are coming across as if there was no evidence of crime here, these criminals were eventually brought to justice, right? Or have the arresting/investigating officers been labelled racists regardless of the fact that these scumbags were actually criminals?

If someone calls the police to tell them they've been drugged and raped, why on earth would you not even go there to at least recover drugs?
 
asim18 said:
But the police force isn't "a person". You might have one arresting officer, but it's not that individual officer's personal investigation, that officer isn't magically racist just because he's arresting someone based on ACTUAL evidence and support from his force. You are coming across as if there was no evidence of crime here, these criminals were eventually brought to justice, right? Or have the arresting/investigating officers been labelled racists regardless of the fact that these scumbags were actually criminals?
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Individual police officers are people. They have to obey orders from people with a higher rank than them, who are also people. Those people also receive orders from people. Eventually, you get to a single person giving broad orders. The police also have to consider politicians, public image and media coverage. All of which stem from people.

A tiny minority of the criminals were eventually brought to justice. Long after they would have been if it wasn't for the pressure to not investigate for fear of being perceived as being racist.

The issue wasn't lack of evidence and I have not come across as saying it was. The issue was lack of will to act on the evidence, to investigate to uncover more evidence.

If someone calls the police to tell them they've been drugged and raped, why on earth would you not even go there to at least recover drugs?
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For the reasons already given. It's a simple cost/benefit analysis - the benefit of some minor drug seizures would be far outweighed by the cost of being perceived to be racist.
 
Angilion said:
Individual police officers are people. They have to obey orders from people with a higher rank than them, who are also people. Those people also receive orders from people. Eventually, you get to a single person giving broad orders. The police also have to consider politicians, public image and media coverage. All of which stem from people.

A tiny minority of the criminals were eventually brought to justice. Long after they would have been if it wasn't for the pressure to not investigate for fear of being perceived as being racist.

The issue wasn't lack of evidence and I have not come across as saying it was. The issue was lack of will to act on the evidence, to investigate to uncover more evidence.
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Very interesting stuff. Are you saying that police officers out there are constantly self-conscious about not coming across as racist, enough that it is hindering their ability to police properly?

So for example, officers are on patrol in south London at 2 in the morning, they smell some cannabis and there is only one person in the vicinity and he's been seen exhaling smoke, yet the officers will think twice about stopping the only person in the vicinity simply because he's black?


Angilion said:
For the reasons already given. It's a simple cost/benefit analysis - the benefit of some minor drug seizures would be far outweighed by the cost of being perceived to be racist.
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We're not talking about minor drug seizures. We're talking about supplying to minors.

Lets just say I was a 13 year old school kid again, and a 40 something year old ethnic minority guy gave me a joint and told me to smoke it, but I called the police, but they ripped up my statement and told me they aren't going to do anything because the dude's an ethnic minority.

Sorry if this is wrong and please correct me if so, but you seem to be almost justifying such action from the police.
 
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It's been rumbling for years in Telford, and that's too damned close for comfort, but it seems the biggest Asian kiddie grooming scandal in the UK has finally hit the mainstream media. Child murder suspected by car crash and by fire. People on here have sniggered about my preferences for some races over others and the low immigrant levels in Shropshire. Statistically that may be the case, but you don't need many to hit the national headlines with tales of depravity and systemic abuse of kiddies, it seems. Up to one thousand children suspected of being drugged beaten or raped by men of south Asian descent, and sold as chattel. Horrendous story:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...x-scandal-involving-1-000-Britains-worst.html

Historically this has been linked to so called "Indian" restaurants and take aways, and the goings on have been carefully logged by street pastors and brought to the attention of social services and the police who have done, surprise surprise, pretty much sod all, for years and years.
 
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Angilion said:
This is why defamation of character, slander and libel are real things and are covered by law - what other people think is true about a person does affect that person. If it didn't, none of those things would matter or even be considered things at all. In the current society, a "white" person being perceived as racist will harm them. It will reduce their social status and could cost them promotion, their job, their home, their family, even their freedom.
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The legal system doesn't appear to be working though. 5 minutes on twitter and you could find hundreds of potential slander/libel cases. I'm not sure why, but the prosecutions don't actually happen.

Regardless, it's not really possible to un-hear things. Like when the jury is asked to disregard something they've heard, it's never actually disregarded.

Knowing this about the system changes the 'game'. It becomes a 'ruin them before they ruin you' race.
 
 
When the establishment fail to act and protect its children, its only a matter of time before the public decide to take matters into its own hands.

This could be the catalyst for a very dangerous series of events.......
 
Vigilantism seems alive and well already here in some rural parts of north Shropshire. Apparently `tis always been the way.Three examples. A serial burglar's vehicle used in his "trade" sets itself ablaze one night. An aggressive beggar intimidating old folk is frog marched to Whitchurch station by two sons of a frail old chap. Only to be told half way there he has his 17 plate car parked in Tesco's car park. (That one tickled me...). A charity box thief is found looking like he's been hit by a car or something, but claims to have memory loss as to what occurred.
 
Rifte said:
When the establishment fail to act and protect its children, its only a matter of time before the public decide to take matters into its own hands.

This could be the catalyst for a very dangerous series of events.......
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This is why all these “Hate” laws are popping up or being expanded with disproportionately harsh punishments, plus the apparatus of the state being used to silence as much as possible anyone that pokes the hornets nest. I imagine those in the know, know that we’re 1-2 incidents away from something very unpleasant. Group conflicts gain momentum quickly and are difficult to stop.
 
Ayahuasca said:
It's apparent this abuse is on a large scale but it seems now that there could be an abuse ring for pretty much any town/city in the country.
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*ANY* town or city???? Hmm, you don't think something the liberals like to call cultural diversity plays a hugely significant part looking at those Wikipedia links then?

None seem to be towns or cities that are not ethnically diverse. Multiculturalism seems to have some incredibly toxic downsides. Major cities are showing depravity that's been literally imported.
 
Skunkworks said:
This is why all these “Hate” laws are popping up or being expanded with disproportionately harsh punishments, plus the apparatus of the state being used to silence as much as possible anyone that pokes the hornets nest. I imagine those in the know, know that we’re 1-2 incidents away from something very unpleasant. Group conflicts gain momentum quickly and are difficult to stop.
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The problem with this strategy however is that it is a bit like trying to deal with an overheating pressure cooker by winding in the pressure release valve. The more you wind it in, the bigger the eventual explosion...
 
Chris Wilson said:
*ANY* town or city???? Hmm, you don't think something the liberals like to call cultural diversity plays a hugely significant part looking at those Wikipedia links then?

None seem to be towns or cities that are not ethnically diverse. Multiculturalism seems to have some incredibly toxic downsides. Major cities are showing depravity that's been literally imported.
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I haven't denied it plays a part, I think that's stating the obvious, but there are far more towns and cities than the ones on that list that are ethnically diverse.

As we've seen from some of the previous convictions, it only takes a small group to mastermind widescale abuse.
 
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This excerpt is particularly disturbing, kudos to those who did try and push the authorities to take off their politically correct coward's hats:

"And it has now been revealed that two whitstleblowers who wanted to raise their concerns about the crimes were hushed and one woman even lost her job.

According to the Mirror, police chaplain Keith Osmund-Smith was suspended after he passed papers to the newspaper and a report commissioned by the council revealed social workers knew of the sex crimes before the turn of the millennium.

Meanwhile, a woman who was hired by sex abuse charity Axis Counselling, based in Shrewsbury, was forced to leave her role after she tried to speak up"

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...sed-fears-scandal-silenced.html#ixzz59XF5GMZJ
 
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