***Gym Exercise Guide, and Form Discussion/Feedback***

Syla5 said:
Watch the Deadlift vid in the exercise gym thread and take notes :) I do that every so often still.

Your not getting tight on the bar for deadlifts before you start the lift, and your back isn't neutral. You could do with your head being a little more neutral then it is, this is one of my bad habits to. As for the dead portion of the lift well your barely even tickling the floor between reps, you need to put the weight back on the ground and get tight on the bar again and go again, your currently doing touch & go. More to be said but watching the vid should help you out :)
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Yeah, I reread the stuff again, and realised just how much I'm missing. I feel like I need something to etch this into my brain. May actually write down methodology on a piece of paper and stick it between my feet.

LiE said:
KD

Firstly, put the weight down between each rep, reset and lift. A deadlift by nature should be lifted dead, not touch and go and definitely not even touching the floor at all.

Your initial setup isn't great - watch this :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-DJu0bEVPw

On the neg, push your hips back more.

Need to work on keeping the core tight and controlling your spinal position.
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Right, have now watched this (about ten times), and re-read plenty of stuff, alongside setting up without a bar, and pretending there's a bar in my hands.

I'm kind of hoping I've got more control of it now, and the aim is to get back to the gym tomorrow at the earliest, Tuesday at the latest, and reset up with again, not massive weights, but something that allows me to set up properly, and I'll try and get another video up.

Delvis said:
Just saying really mate, your lower back probably shouldn't be movibg like that in a normal situation let alone with a weight attached to it :p luckily you don't lift it in that position, just a point to note :)
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Aye, that's probably true, my back has got used to being all kinds of moving from butterfly. Not quite so useful here xD Seems the cost of shoulder mobility :(

Has anyone got some good stuff bookmarked on hamstring mobility? Definitely seems tight setting up just now. I'd certainly have to start bending knees before I can reach the bar, that's for sure, and actually, any kind of toe touch exercise I'm dire at due to hamstring tightness.

kd
 
Barbell rowing...

You look like you push the bar back towards your waist as it comes up.

Lift it by pulling your elbows back; everything else in your arms should notionally be disengaged. Keep your core tight, as it also looked a taf wobbly.
 
Hamstring mobility: look at the stuff I posted for the squatting guide. Doesn't sound like you're too tight though, you just don't know how to hip hinge.

I'd be interested to see your next deadlift session now you've been given feedback and have realised some stuff. I won't overcomplicate by giving you more stuff to think about at this stage.


However, your rows need a lot of work too.

Your shoulder mechanics are....... "not ideal". Notice how they rotate forwards out of their sockets as you get to the top of the rep? This is as bad as doing similar during pressing movements, in terms of long term progression and mechanics.

Watch the cable row videos in the OP, I think there is one that covers all of the common faults. But basically, you need to retract and depress your scapula as you row up (scaps back and down).
 
icecold said:
Hamstring mobility: look at the stuff I posted for the squatting guide. Doesn't sound like you're too tight though, you just don't know how to hip hinge.

I'd be interested to see your next deadlift session now you've been given feedback and have realised some stuff. I won't overcomplicate by giving you more stuff to think about at this stage.


However, your rows need a lot of work too.

Your shoulder mechanics are....... "not ideal". Notice how they rotate forwards out of their sockets as you get to the top of the rep? This is as bad as doing similar during pressing movements, in terms of long term progression and mechanics.

Watch the cable row videos in the OP, I think there is one that covers all of the common faults. But basically, you need to retract and depress your scapula as you row up (scaps back and down).
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Hm, ok.

When you say, not ideal, do you mean the mechanics during movement? Or more of a postural thing that needs to be fixed?

I'll take a look at the cable row videos though :) and try and fix that stuff.

(P.s. did you get that video of your reverse crunch with extension? - I feel like I might almost be nagging you about this, which I really hope I'm not)

kd
 
Ok. Round Two.

Gf went into a class for an hour so I figured I'd come along, and do some DL practice. Went in for an hour just stretched, did deadlifts and such. Wasn't really paying attention to weight, reps, or sets.

Did most of the stuff at 50kg again. So not really pushing me. There is one video (3.5) where I've upped it to 80 for fun. Slightly more challenging obviously. (That one was actually the second of that weight - first didn't film, and my grip was going hence the awful negative).

So, following on from before, these are the things I tried to work on in order:
Stand behind bar.
Breathe In
Tense Abs - (feel perhaps more breathing through stomach needed here)?
Tense Glutes
Hinge around hips until back of knee is tight - maintain tightness in core
Bend knees until arms are at bar
Grip bar
Based on the stuff Kelly was saying, I then tried straightening legs on some whilst still under load.
Push the ground away with feet.
Once bar is past knees start the hip thrust - this probably wasn't so focussed on.
Lowering bar - At top of rep, make sure tension is still there - tense glutes and abs -throw hips back, lower bar down legs, once past knees bend them to complete lowering.

The real thing I was paying attention to was the setting up and getting it off the ground. The hip thrust and negative was probably less paid attention to, because I was mainly focussing on the getting it off the ground and setting up.

There's some more stuff I was going to say that I've now forgotten. But oh well.

Apologies for so many videos! (This wasn't even all of them xD)








I've also just had a look at the Cable Row videos, I see what you mean about the rowing issues and shoulders now more so Ice. Have a feeling I need to try and pin them back slightly more on the deads too xD

I'm thinking maybe I should avoid the stretching the legs out bit before lifting, despite what Kelly says, just in case it encourages me to lift my butt too early (this certainly seems an issue on the 80kg - 3.5)

kd
 
You can definitely hip hinge more than that before you bend your knees. You're barely hitting 45 degrees, and I'm sure you're capable of nearer 90. It's not tightness behind your knees that you're looking for, it's tightness in your high hamstring that you sit back on with a slight knee bend.

Also, watch the video on head positioning in the OP.

Much better, but still some way to go.
 
So my knees should be slightly bent when hip hinging?

There were a couple of conflicting things here, so went with straight legs?

Would certainly explain the mobility issue xD

I'll take a look at head stuff.

Beyond that, what are the major things to improve upon, and, arguably more importantly, would it be worth sticking to the kind of 50-60kg range whilst I fix form first?

Edit: A big thing about head positioning, is it tends to be up to have a look at the mirror so I can see my back xD

kd
 
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Stop looking in the mirror, and everyone that walks past during your negative. Keep your head more neutral to your spine, although you'll no doubt end up having to fight that :p

Looks better though, no weird back bending going on like in the last vid. I'll try and find the core bracing webpage
 
Delvis said:
Stop looking in the mirror, and everyone that walks past during your negative. Keep your head more neutral to your spine, although you'll no doubt end up having to fought that :p

Looks better though, no weird back bending going on like in the last bid. I'll try and find the core bracing webpage
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This one?

But yeah, I do need to sort out my head. It's one of the things where I looked back at the video and went '****!'...

kd
 
King Damager said:
So my knees should be slightly bent when hip hinging?

There were a couple of conflicting things here, so went with straight legs?

Would certainly explain the mobility issue xD

I'll take a look at head stuff.

Beyond that, what are the major things to improve upon, and, arguably more importantly, would it be worth sticking to the kind of 50-60kg range whilst I fix form first?

Edit: A big thing about head positioning, is it tends to be up to have a look at the mirror so I can see my back xD

kd
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A knee bend isn't mandatory, but it allows your hamstring to be more active and can allow for a better feel. Your knee shouldn't move forward more than a fraction though.

60-ish kg is enough for now while you're learning, but don't be afraid to practice every session because the stress isn't going to be very high.

You need to learn to consistently generate tension through your torso. It's there on some reps but not others, and your head/neck wandering around does you no favours.
 
Delvis said:
Its a website I'm looking for, I'm pretty sure ice and Dom have both linked to it before. The positioning thing, as I've said causes debates from both sides of the camp ;)
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Ah ok. Update me once you've found it :)

icecold said:
A knee bend isn't mandatory, but it allows your hamstring to be more active and can allow for a better feel. Your knee shouldn't move forward more than a fraction though.

60-ish kg is enough for now while you're learning, but don't be afraid to practice every session because the stress isn't going to be very high.

You need to learn to consistently generate tension through your torso. It's there on some reps but not others, and your head/neck wandering around does you no favours.
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Oh ok. The hip hinge was a weird experience to be fair at first, and felt easier to ensure the hinge worked around the hips rather than my lower back bending. That's where the, I'm at home practicing in the mirror and looking, seeing how it feels when it looks right and trying to get that greater awareness.

How do you do the consistently generating tension through your torso thing? What's the easiest way to practice, how's it supposed to feel? Presuming Delvis' magic link will help with this?

I will spend a couple of weeks trying it every session then at the lower weight to just nail form, and will try and get videos as often as possible (the videoing position I've got is basically the only one where you can get a decent angle in the gym and relies on it being reasonably empty...

kd
 
I think you just need to practice and feel your way through it now. It seems like you've got the right attitude to learn how fairly quickly. Keep posting vids :)
 
The tension thing icecold is talking about can be explained a little easier by remembering this - your body shouldn't feel like a floppy ****, more like a hard one.
 
Delvis said:
Can't find it currently, basically goes on about breathing in to your lungs, exhaling slightly then breathing in to your lower back. Annoyed I can't find it actually
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Hmm, ok. I've done some breathing drills in the past when I did some research into freediving. Somehow I don't think that's the same though, but I understand the breathing concept :)

icecold said:
I think you just need to practice and feel your way through it now. It seems like you've got the right attitude to learn how fairly quickly. Keep posting vids :)
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Yeah, there are still a few things that I know I need to focus on more I think:
Head positioning. - Even if we went with the it can be slightly more upright, I think it's still too upright.
Glute Drive - the 'humping' phase, a bit more practice just tensing glutes at this stage does wonders to show some things.

Uhm, also, the 'stretching' at the grip stage, that Kelly mentions where you push your bum up as such, do you reckon this is still worth doing?

Zefan said:
The tension thing icecold is talking about can be explained a little easier by remembering this - your body shouldn't feel like a floppy ****, more like a hard one.
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I'm not talking to you anymore :p

kd
 

Been going through my head all day, is this really as cringe tastic as I am thinking it out to be, or is it just a case of being mindful to stop it?

Working on my core strength quite a bit at the moment and I am going to be throwing in some goblets with pulse as well to help even more.
 
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