Heavy fines for those that refuse vaccination in Germany

[StriderX]

I wonder what opinion it is with regards to Avian-Human flu's or Ebola, should we just let these disastrous plagues run amok?

Or what about a state-sponsored biological attack, totally fine seemingly? Just bad luck huh?

 

[Hades]

No. At the heart of this issue, the question is whether each of us will accept the benefits of proven medical science, or ignore it and put our children at risk.

People are still free to make their own decisions about the healthcare of their children. They simply have to accept that there may be unpleasant consequences.

We disagree on the subject. It may be the heart of the matter to you but other people have differing views and drives to yourself

 

[pooley]

Fine.

In that case don't go to the GP next time you have an infection, after all what does the medical profession know about diseases that you don't.
you are far more likely to have a reaction to some of the antibiotics than you are to a vaccine, and what's the worst that can happen if you get a bad infection, well apart from death.

Vaccines are safer than many other medications, and if you're worried about them then you really don't want to take painkillers, antibiotics, let alone ever have a sedative.

We would just like you to admit that you're also risking others with your decision and take appropriate steps, I hear the Shetland Isles are nice this time of year...

'vaccines are safer than other medications' that's makes it a ok then love the logic there. again it's MY and YOUR choice as to what goes into your body and i dont need to to justify it to who is WE?

 

[StriderX]

Simplifying this, the state has to think about everyone, they are people after all and don't want to die horribly from something they could have prevented, this includes any future children (citizens of the state). The parents need only think of their own children and their well being (which non-amusingly they are probably vaccinated themselves and aren't at risk), if they feel they need to protect their children from the evils of the state, then so be it.

But they will submit to the states punishment for harming future generations with their tripe opinion on a matter of public safety. Or they can leave.

 

[dowie]

i choose NOT to have a cocktail of foreign bodies injected into me and any of your so called experts, reviews, tests claims or whatever they do to justify in doing to so means nothing to me. and i should not be punished for it.

So do you reject all medicine then? Or is there some selective irrationality going on whereby you'll accept the risk of side effects for say some drugs but you'll not for vaccines?

 

[pooley]

So do you reject all medicine then? Or is there some selective irrationality going on whereby you'll accept the risk of side effects for say some drugs but you'll not for vaccines?

that's is my free will and choice simples. people seem to have a hard time accepting this, if you choose to have a vaccine or chemo or NOT or take whatever pill or NOT that is YOUR choice. i and nobody else have the right to punish you or cause you a hardship for doing so.

 

[Werewolf]

'vaccines are safer than other medications' that's makes it a ok then love the logic there. again it's MY and YOUR choice as to what goes into your body and i dont need to to justify it to who is WE?

Lets put it really really simply.

The vaccine is far less likely to cause an issue than most of the medications you would be likely to need to help you deal with a lot of the things they vaccinate you for...And those medications are likely to cause less issues than leaving you untreated.

If you really have that much of a problem with not trusting the scientists, doctors and government over the safety of vaccines (which are a medication), then why on earth would you be willing to take other medications that are known to have for more common and serious side effects.
Off the top of my head with common painkillers alone you've got:
Paracetamol - liver damage if you take too many
Ibuprofen - can stomach problems such as ulcers if taken regularly (if prescribed long term the GP will likely also prescribe Omeprazol to protect the stomach lining), I think it can also cause liver and kidney function to drop.
Omeprazol - can cause a variety of minor problems (upset stomachs. nausia)
Then you've got the classic allergy to penicillion based anti biotics, of the sort you're likely to need if you get some of the diseases that the vaccines help protect you against.
Those are just 4 that spring to mind, with two of them being over the counter*.


Seriously have a look at the known and possible side effects of any medication you take, pretty much everything has a risk, however the risks from vaccines are so much smaller than most of the risks you'll happily accept from those other medicines.

The difference is, if you decide you don't want to take another medication it only affects you.
If you decide to not have a vaccine for a common and easily transmitted disease it becomes and issue that can affect large numbers of people around you - likely to include any small children and elderly.
To be quite blunt, I don't care if you decide to avoid having a vaccine and you end up suffering from that decision.
I do however care about the people that can be affected by that decision and you are likely to (unknowingly) infect and who may not be able to fight the infection as well as you.


*In america Paracetamol accounts for a large percentage of liver damage cases because people don't realise the dosages, and will take it rather than going to see the doctor when they've got some diseases (as it's often included in things marketed as helping common illnesses).

 

[dowie]

that's is my free will and choice simples. people seem to have a hard time accepting this, if you choose to have a vaccine or chemo or NOT or take whatever pill or NOT that is YOUR choice. i and nobody else have the right to punish you or cause you a hardship for doing so.

I'm well aware it is your free choice - however you're avoiding the question, why is that exactly? I'm presuming because you have an obviously inconsistent position.

 

[pooley]

I'm well aware it is your free choice - however you're avoiding the question, why is that exactly? I'm presuming because you have an obviously inconsistent position.

to reject all allopathic medicine out of hand would be a little foolhardy so no i don't.
but to consider it a one stop shop us v them mentality and to punish men and women who choose not to be vaccinated is wrong imo.

 

[Destination]

to reject all allopathic medicine out of hand would be a little foolhardy so no i don't.
but to consider it a one stop shop us v them mentality and to punish men and women who choose not to be vaccinated is wrong imo.

You didn't reject your vaccines either, you got them.
You're missing a massive total of none! unless you've travelled and decided to go places where it is recommended you get various things and didn't.
Have you travelled to such places?

 

[Woden]

to reject all allopathic medicine out of hand would be a little foolhardy so no i don't.
but to consider it a one stop shop us v them mentality and to punish men and women who choose not to be vaccinated is wrong imo.

Not as wrong as knowingly endangering the health and lives of those without the choice.

 

[dowie]

to reject all allopathic medicine out of hand would be a little foolhardy so no i don't.
but to consider it a one stop shop us v them mentality and to punish men and women who choose not to be vaccinated is wrong imo.

the use of that phrase is telling and perhaps highlights where your irrationality is coming from - it is a term used by believers of 'woo'/'alternative medicine' types

Where do you draw the line then - I take it you never take painkillers? I mean surely it would be crazy to expose yourself to the side effects of paracetamol for a mere headache if you're averse to exposing yourself to side effects to avoid life threatening illnesses?

 

[Destination]

As we all know, if alternative medicine works, it gets called medicine.

 

[godinman]

to reject all allopathic medicine out of hand would be a little foolhardy so no i don't.
but to consider it a one stop shop us v them mentality and to punish men and women who choose not to be vaccinated is wrong imo.

Incorrect, those who willingly endanger others for scientifically proven bull-**** reasons should be punished to help protect the rest of society.

 

[pooley]

You didn't reject your vaccines either, you got them.
You're missing a massive total of none! unless you've travelled and decided to go places where it is recommended you get various things and didn't.
Have you travelled to such places?

ha good one yeah at 10 yrs old, and no i have not traveled to such places.

 

[pooley]

the use of that phrase is telling and perhaps highlights where your irrationality is coming from - it is a term used by believers of 'woo'/'alternative medicine' types

Where do you draw the line then - I take it you never take painkillers? I mean surely it would be crazy to expose yourself to the side effects of paracetamol for a mere headache if you're averse to exposing yourself to side effects to avoid life threatening illnesses?

that is the correct term for it what you want me to do?

 

[dowie]

that is the correct term for it what you want me to do?

not really - it is a term used by believers in/practitioners of 'woo'

anyway you've not explained where you draw the line re: actual evidence based medicine or 'allopathic medicine' as you call it? It is actually quite ironic to use that term given we're discussing vaccinations.

Do you use pain killers? Antibiotics? Would you have an X-ray? At what point do you start using it?

 

[pooley]

not really - it is a term used by believers in/practitioners of 'woo'

anyway you've not explained where you draw the line re: actual evidence based medicine or 'allopathic medicine' as you call it?

Do you use pain killers? Antibiotics? Would you have an X-ray? At what point do you start using it?

jeez this is your life or what! i'm done in here, it's like lemmings.. if you cannot get through life without taking drugs for everything then that's sad

 

[spoffle]

if you are not concerned about chick embryo's tesco's or otherwise, monkey kidney cells, human diploid cells or fetal rhesus monkey lung cells and things of that nature being used as a medium in your vaccine's then fine that's your choice but it does not mean i am, irrelevant what dose you claim is safe.

as above if you think that's a ok for for you then great, it's my choice not to have this foreign material injected into me and i should not be punished for it.

I really think you should learn how to use apostrophes before moving on to something as advanced as chemistry.

 

[tinder]

Talks about wanting a world with stronger/better genetics whilst displaying below average intelligence, hmmmm

.