Poll: Hungarian Grand Prix 2021, Budapest - Race 11/23

[JRS]

May hopefully solve the following issue, but doesn't solve the issue these cars are absolutely massive now. Hopefully if the next set of engine regs can be agreed the cars can also go on a diet.

It's not the engine regs that make the cars longer than an Imperial Star Destroyer - if engines made cars big then the Ferrari 640 I mentioned earlier in the thread would have been gargantuan. 3.5l V12, bulky 1st gen semi-auto gearbox, ~200l fuel tank...

 

[.:MBK:.]

I know, but it makes a good excuse for timing as "next available opportunity", given they appear to have missed a trick with the new chassis coming in on capping some of the more crazy dimensions of these things.

 

[MagicBoy]

It's not the engine regs that make the cars longer than an Imperial Star Destroyer - if engines made cars big then the Ferrari 640 I mentioned earlier in the thread would have been gargantuan. 3.5l V12, bulky 1st gen semi-auto gearbox, ~200l fuel tank...

Good chunk of the Ferrari fuel tank was around the drivers hips, which wouldn't be allowed now. That's where it failed during Berger's fiery accident at Imola.

 

[pallys]

I thought stewards were a bit harsh on bottas there given it was t1 and raining and he did pull out but front wing was downforce starved.

Stroll prolly a definite penalty yeah as that was wreckless and weaved from left of track to the grass.

I'm not sure what else Masi was expecting in these conditions on a long run down to t1? I knew it would be carnage.

I'd argue it should have been a safety car start, very lucky Leclerc didn't have his neck sliced because it was close.

 

[pallys]

Alonso I thought was anti racing and overstepped the mark once with the wheel banging.

Alonso of 2005 imola never made a mistake of out braking himself.

Sainz I also thought was a bit dirty in his late move the to the right once Hamilton had already commited, you not allowed to do that.

 

[Entai]

I know, but it makes a good excuse for timing as "next available opportunity", given they appear to have missed a trick with the new chassis coming in on capping some of the more crazy dimensions of these things.

You do realise that the single reason for over 95% of these "crazy" dimensions is purely safety.

Designated crash structures, rules like feet must be behind front axle line, cockpit opening must be certain size to allow ease of exit, fuel tank must be certain distance away from driver etc.

They determine the size of the car more than anything else.

So wanting a smaller car is exactly the same as saying you want a more dangerous car.

The longer, and wider the car, the safer car, simple as.

Puts the driver further away from anything the car impacts.

Reduce length, reduce width, increase risk and danger of worse injuries.

 

[KiNgPiN83]

You do realise that the single reason for over 95% of these "crazy" dimensions is purely safety.

Designated crash structures, rules like feet must be behind front axle line, cockpit opening must be certain size to allow ease of exit, fuel tank must be certain distance away from driver etc.

They determine the size of the car more than anything else.

So wanting a smaller car is exactly the same as saying you want a more dangerous car.

The longer, and wider the car, the safer car, simple as.

Puts the driver further away from anything the car impacts.

Reduce length, reduce width, increase risk and danger of worse injuries.

Id never thought about it like this but that makes sense. I just assumed bigger fuel tank due to no refuelling meant a bigger car without factoring in all that other stuff too.

 

[cuke2u]

Alonso I thought was anti racing and overstepped the mark once with the wheel banging.

Alonso of 2005 imola never made a mistake of out braking himself.

Sainz I also thought was a bit dirty in his late move the to the right once Hamilton had already commited, you not allowed to do that.

Alonso of 2005 was driving a completely different car with different tyres. Perhaps if he was in the same car then the outbraking would not have occurred...

 

[GR63]

Leaked picture of Bottas sabotaging Vettel's car.

For years I found Vettel unpleasant (especially after Multi 21) but Seb has grown up.. I was rooting for him.... I would have happily taken a Vettel win with Lewis 2nd and even Nando in 3rd... but fate handed it to Ocon

Poor Seb

 

[Stumble Bum]

For years I found Vettel unpleasant (especially after Multi 21) but Seb has grown up.. I was rooting for him.... I would have happily taken a Vettel win with Lewis 2nd and even Nando in 3rd... but fate handed it to Ocon

Poor Seb

Yeah he was annoying when he was winning everything. I think he's brilliant now. Very funny guy too. 'tis a shame.

 

[MagicBoy]

I've mellowed to Vettel since leaving Red Bull. He's still a bit rubbish in wheel to wheel combat though. One wonders if it's the environment within the team that results in toxic behaviour?

 

[mmj_uk]

Watching the race yesterday it dawned on me how many years of excellent racing we've missed out on with Alonso being in third rate cars. Even though he's been an also-ran for years I still rate him highly.

 

[RoboCod]

Vettel is a classic case of populism. We all like him now he's come to terms that he isn't actually all that good and now just acts more like himself, does some nice things at track and appears more human. He can drive a good car well and win. He did what he needed to do but never evolved to the new age of F1. Personally I think he's decent and now shows some humility, he has nothing to prove but I do think if you had a man to man with him he'd admit he wasn't ever up there with the greats. That's why today he's all fun and not so serious. He can only win hearts now, but that isn't really such a bad thing, he's a good role model.

 

[Psycho Ned]

I've mellowed to Vettel since leaving Red Bull. He's still a bit rubbish in wheel to wheel combat though. One wonders if it's the environment within the team that results in toxic behaviour?

I think it’s whoever is Horners boy gets their arse kissed and pandered too morning, noon and night they end up a bit of an egomaniac.

Vettel was no Max in the spoilt petulant child stakes but he had his moments with Webber!

 

[GR63]

I think it’s whoever is Horners boy gets their arse kissed and pandered too morning, noon and night they end up a bit of an egomaniac.

Vettel was no Max in the spoilt petulant child stakes but he had his moments with Webber!

Now there is an image that will be hard to get out of my head... Christian Horner kissing arse... I wish you hadn't inserted that!!!

 

[englishpremier]

Looking back on it now, really pleasing to see Fernando has much fight in him. I was expecting him to have a hard time readjusting to F1 but he's doing well. I hope his enthusiasm and passion continue.

Really happy for Williams too. Just curious as to whether Mr Saturday has ever outscored a team mate in F1 (points wise)?

Nope Russell has never outscored a teammate in F1.

To favour High Rake cars and slow down Merc & Pink Mercs?

What counts as low rake though? Plenty of teams have had a much lower rake than RB for years.

Watching the race yesterday it dawned on me how many years of excellent racing we've missed out on with Alonso being in third rate cars. Even though he's been an also-ran for years I still rate him highly.

It is funny reading all the comments on Alonso, then some races ago there were a ton them saying he's past it, shouldn't have returned, Ocon is better etc... Some (not necessarily you) seem so quick to judge. Then change their tune without acknowledging their previous comments.

 

[Mr Jack]

Then change their tune without acknowledging their previous comments.

Happy to acknowledge I was wrong about both Alonso and Vettel, and pleased to be so.

 

[bazzabear]

Really happy for Williams too. Just curious as to whether Mr Saturday has ever outscored a team mate in F1 (points wise)?

Well this is the first time he's ever scored any points at all, except in his one race for Mercedes. And given that Latifi finished ahead of him in this race, I think the answer's a pretty clear no.

 

[Kenai]

This is the sort of scenario where you can look behind the statistics a little bit, depending on what you want to know - if you want to know whether Russell actually outperforms teammates, just looking at points only tells one part of the story.

2019 for example, Kubica scored 1 point to Russell's 0. But Russell only finished behind Kubica in 2 races (where both cars finished), one of which Kubica finished 10th and Russell 11th at the German GP with 6 DNFs. Any other weekend and both would have been on 0 again. So Kubica picked up the point and outscores him over the season but Russell won the head to head results by a huge amount if you're comparing just the 2 drivers performance.

2020 vs Latifi. In races where both cars finished, Latifi only finished in front of Russell once but both finished on 0 points (for Williams).

2021 so far, Latifi is now ahead on points thanks to this race but it's only the second time this season he's finished in front of Russell (when both finish).

Points scored can be a bit of a misleading measure at a team like Williams where they're only likely to score points at one or two races a year anyway - one or two isolated good performances and drivers like Latifi and Kubica end up in front on that metric.

In two and a half seasons of racing in F1, he's only finished 5 races behind teammates (where both cars finished) but of those 5 races, 2 have been races where a Williams has actually scored a point or two The other way to look at it I suppose is that his team mates have done it when it counted

 

[the wopster]

Well this is the first time he's ever scored any points at all, except in his one race for Mercedes. And given that Latifi finished ahead of him in this race, I think the answer's a pretty clear no.

Edit
He did score points for merc