e36Adz said:Its not so much about freewill, its about choice isnt it? Islam basically says that this is the way it is... this is what will happen, look around you and see the signs for yourself, a time will come when you will to account for your actions etc. It is pretty clear cut in what it says but ultimately the person is left with his/her own choice as to what they want to do about it. Its a belief, so no matter what, if someone doesnt believe it, they cant be 'forced' too can they?
But there was no choice for many thousands who either had to commit to Islam or die....what sort of "choice" is that.
Correct me if I am wrong, but is there not something in Mohammed's scriptures that says be wary of the convert to Islam, for he is still not a "true" believer.
Do the captives who are paraded on Al-Jazeera tv truly believe in the words they are saying or are they made to say them under threat of death\decapitation. Do you truly believe that these people have "converted" and have "free will\choice" in what they are saying?.
Were the slaughter and conversions of Hindus a myth?, or are the muslims in those countries reaping the backlash even today from a centuries old vendetta, against a conqueror who had little pity for non-converts.
"After the sack of the temples in Orissa, Firoz Shah Tughlaq attacked an island on the sea-coast where "nearly 100,000 men of Jajnagar had taken refuge with their women, children, kinsmen and relations". The swordsmen of Islam turned "the island into a basin of blood by the massacre of the unbelievers". "
"In 1195 AD the Mher tribe of Ajmer rose in revolt, and the Chaulukyas of Gujarat came to their assistance. Aibak had to invite reinforcements from Ghazni before he could meet the challenge. In 1196 AD he advanced against Anahilwar Patan, the capital of Gujarat. Nizami writes that after Raja Karan was defeated and forced to flee, "fifty thousand infidels were dispatched to hell by the sword" and "more than twenty thousand slaves, and cattle beyond all calculation fell into the hands of the victors"."
"After Muhammad died, many people who had converted to Islam by force imagined freedom. They thought that Islamic leadership would be distracted with trying to establish a new authority, so they began to abandon Islam. However, Abu Bakr [UBAW ker"), one of Muhammad's closest friends, was quickly recognized as successor. He spent the first three months of his authority killing those who had tried to leave Islam—eighty thousand people. This is how Abu Bakr followed the example of Muhammad"
....and is the "choice" nowadays any different?......submit to our will on what you will or won't publish or we'll cut off your heads!!
Yes, even choice has a new identity......Political Islam is set to usurp Religious Islam as the "choice" of muslims everywhere.....so while muslims vent their angst against the West and the Great Satan, for perceived injustices, their very own leaders are set on a Caliphate to ensure their own dominance and the submission of the "ordinary" muslim to their will.....given the "choice" I am sure many muslims would like to live in peace in their own economically affluent societies.....but the truth remains that the power is held by the few and they do not wish this to change!!.