John Terry Racism Trial

[BaZ87]

Prosecution to Terry:

You used 'black' because it was a feature of him you chose to pick out. Like Paddy Kenny is 'fat' & other people are ugly

Poor Paddy Kenny, that's about the 3rd time that somebody at the hearing has called him fat. He's the real victim here!

edit: I'm not sure I'd have been able to stop myself from laughing if I was there with some of these comments.

Terry:

My mum dated a man from Liverpool and LFC fans made up a song 'My mum loves scouse ****

 

[Cosimo]

JT off the stand and:

Ashley Cole arrives in 3-piece suit and quite a strong cologne. Has left a scent trail in his wake.

 

[Gilly]

It's not really the point. Even if he laughed it off, it doesn't make Terry's comment any less racist.

Coming out with racist comments during a heated exchange shows the true colours of the person
saying it. Terry imo really doesn't have enough grey cells between his ears to make a controlled
comment designed just for a reaction. His angry outburst like a raging 12 year old counterstrike
gamer proves he's racist. Why else would skin pigmentation have been mentioned when he could
have just made the insult without elaborating on precisely what colour of **** he is?

What does it matter?

I really don't get it. Perhaps it's just because I'm not racist and haven't ever been a victim of racism either, but the quote of referring to someone as black like you might refer to Paddy kenny as fat makes the opposite point than designed to me. It's just a feature of his appearance, why not mention it when calling him a ****? It's the **** that's the insult, not black/fat/ugly/ginger...

 

[drunkenmaster]

It's not really the point. Even if he laughed it off, it doesn't make Terry's comment any less racist.

Coming out with racist comments during a heated exchange shows the true colours of the person
saying it. Terry imo really doesn't have enough grey cells between his ears to make a controlled
comment designed just for a reaction. His angry outburst like a raging 12 year old counterstrike
gamer proves he's racist. Why else would skin pigmentation have been mentioned when he could
have just made the insult without elaborating on precisely what colour of **** he is?

Why did Ferdinand happen to talk about his marraige when he could have just called him a ****. What you're actually ignoring, is that a racist would likely take more care to NOT make a racist comment, someone who doesn't associate black with being any worse than being white, fat, ginger, tall, short, whatever, won't automatically censor the word.

Or should we treat black people differently to everyone else in that their colour can never be mentioned ever? Yes, treat black people differently, so as to not offend them for being treated differently, I love irony and PC society, its sooo logical.


Wiki

Racism is behavior or beliefs motivated by racial stereotypes, it generally includes practices of racial discrimination, and ideologies of racial supremacy and hierarchy. Some sources emphasize that racism involves the belief that different racial groups are characterized by intrinsic characteristics or abilities and that some such groups are therefore naturally superior to others, [1][2] or follow practices that discriminate against members of particular racial groups,[1] for example by perpetuating unequal access to resources between groups

Is what he said even racist? he called him black, he didn't say "you have such a big arse because you're black, you **** ", or did he, I can't remember even what the latest thing he's accused of saying is exactly.

Why does describing him make it racist, he didn't treat him differently to anyone else on the pitch, he didn't refuse to play with him, he didn't refuse to insult him like he would have insulted anyone else giving him grief, he didn't make his insult based on a stereotype(unless you decide someone black actually being black is a stereotype of black people?.... my brain just exploded).

Another definition

1.
a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2.
a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3.
hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Did he show hatred or intolerance purely by calling him black, no he didn't. Using the word black hasn't and has never been racist, its the intent behind the comment.

Now, calling someone the n-word, repeatedly, while pinching someones skin and making multiple remarks (supposedly like I won't talk to people like you), is racist, using the word black, isn't.

 

[Cosimo]

Supportive statement from Jose Mourinho being read out.

 

[mmj_uk]

Coming out with racist comments during a heated exchange shows the true colours of the person
saying it. Terry imo really doesn't have enough grey cells between his ears to make a controlled
comment designed just for a reaction. His angry outburst like a raging 12 year old counterstrike
gamer proves he's racist. Why else would skin pigmentation have been mentioned when he could
have just made the insult without elaborating on precisely what colour of **** he is?

It really doesn't take a genius to know that blacks get their knickers in a twist whenever a white person points out their skin colour, however one racially offensive insult does not make someone a racist.

Claiming Terry is a racist over this one (alleged) incident is akin to saying that a hardcore Christian who uses the lord's name in vain once in their lifetime is suddenly an atheist because of that one comment, even if they continue being a hardcore christian after the incident.

A racist would not get on with half of the Chelsea dressing room let alone captain them and be a popular figure, a racist wouldn't hug the black players out on the pitch after a victory or scoring a goal, nor would one help with Desailly & Drogba's African charities.

I'm getting pretty sick of this mentality that you only have to racially offend a black person once and you're a racist for all eternity. Terry simply wanted to rile Anton in the same way his affair comments did Terry, he should (if found guilty) not have brought skin colour into it but he knew that it would cause the most distress to Anton.

 

[cm1179]

we all know what john terry is

 

[Merlin5]

Why did Ferdinand happen to talk about his marraige when he could have just called him a ****. What you're actually ignoring, is that a racist would likely take more care to NOT make a racist comment, someone who doesn't associate black with being any worse than being white, fat, ginger, tall, short, whatever, won't automatically censor the word.

Or should we treat black people differently to everyone else in that their colour can never be mentioned ever? Yes, treat black people differently, so as to not offend them for being treated differently, I love irony and PC society, its sooo logical.


Wiki


Is what he said even racist? he called him black, he didn't say "you have such a big arse because you're black, you **** ", or did he, I can't remember even what the latest thing he's accused of saying is exactly.

Why does describing him make it racist, he didn't treat him differently to anyone else on the pitch, he didn't refuse to play with him, he didn't refuse to insult him like he would have insulted anyone else giving him grief, he didn't make his insult based on a stereotype(unless you decide someone black actually being black is a stereotype of black people?.... my brain just exploded).

Another definition


Did he show hatred or intolerance purely by calling him black, no he didn't. Using the word black hasn't and has never been racist, its the intent behind the comment.

Now, calling someone the n-word, repeatedly, while pinching someones skin and making multiple remarks (supposedly like I won't talk to people like you), is racist, using the word black, isn't.

What if he called him the n-word? "You ****** ****" instead of "You black ****", you think the interpretation behind black and ****** would be different? Lol. You even said yourself it's the intent behind it. And so what was that intent? Just to wind him up? Nah, imo it was an angry spontaneous outburst demonstrating that he thinks black people are inferior.

I'm not taking sides here believe it or not, rather I'm playing devil's advocate (like a radio phone in presenter trying to see both sides of the coin ) to see if you can convince me that the intention behind Terry's insult wasn't racist. You still haven't given a good reason why he did add the 'black' bit.

 

[drunkenmaster]

the N word IS a word white people use to intimate black people are less than, he didn't do that, where was what he said intimating black people are inferior?

As for a good reason, I think a good reason NOT to use a descriptive word that is accurate is required, other than "don't say the word black because its a bad word", because its not. I showed two definitions of racism, calling someone a black anything isn't racist.

In what way for instance is calling someone a black doo doo head, showing his intolerance or hatred of black people? "You're a doo doo head like all black people", or "you're a doo doo head because you're black", would be racist, "you're a black doo doo head" is no difference to "you're a short doo doo head". If someone said that no one would think he was intolerant or had hatred for short people. It's merely an insult, most of us think of insults on the fly and it generally goes , look at person, pick distinguishing feature, add swear word, add volume, done, that is all I can tell that he did(he might not even have done that).

Insulting someone racially would be "i hate black people, he's black, all black people are..... whatever" they he says something racist to him ie "you're just like all the other black people" or whatever else. He didn't taunt him about being black, he didn't repeatedly call him black, he didn't call him names because he was black, he simply called him black.

I have no idea, Terry could well be a complete racist, I generally don't regard him as being a particularly lovely person, I've never seen him as worse than anyone else on the pitch(mouthy, sure, violent/malicious... can't remember seeing it). I just can't see anything inherantly racist or awful about what he called him and I've always found this kind of faux racism both, harmful to stopping real racism and more ultra PC nonsense.

How can we all avoid using the word black, while not doing that for any other group of people, its actively choosing to treat all black people differently, which is insane. You can insult anyone, except black people. Rather like feminism, there is "real" feminism where people fight for equality, then there are stupid feminists who want double standards, just all in womens favour.

 

[Cosimo]

we all know what john terry is

Yup, a great player and captain. I presume that you just don't have the guts to say it.

 

[cm1179]

Yup, a great player and captain. I presume that you just don't have the guts to say it.

great footballer, scummer of a human being.

 

[BaZ87]

Interesting to see how most of the Chelsea squad (+ the likes of Mourinho and Wilkins) gave statements in support of Terry, however Mikel (who was the closest player to the incident?), Drogba and Malouda didn't.

 

[Moothead2]

I'm taking the next person that calls me ginger to court .

 

[JohnnyG]

What if he called him the n-word? "You ****** ****" instead of "You black ****",...

He didn't though, you'd be **** as a prosecutor.

great footballer, scummer of a human being.

Is he, what is he actually guilty of to make him a scummer?

Interesting to see how most of the Chelsea squad (+ the likes of Mourinho and Wilkins) gave statements in support of Terry, however Mikel (who was the closest player to the incident?), Drogba and Malouda didn't.

What's interesting about it?
Drogba wasn't even on the pitch at the time, A.Cole did & he was.

 

[BaZ87]

What's interesting about it?
Drogba wasn't even on the pitch at the time, A.Cole did & he was.

The majority of Chelsea's squad, a lot who weren't on the pitch either, gave a statement saying they've never heard Terry make racist remarks etc. I can't think of another senior player other than those 3 that didn't give a statement. Mikel gave a statement to the police (which slightly contradicted what Terry said) on what he heard during the incident but didn't give the "character reference" type statement that the majority of the squad did.

 

[JohnnyG]

I still don't get what's interesting about it, so 3 players didn't give a statement, so what?

 

[BaZ87]

I still don't get what's interesting about it, so 3 players didn't give a statement, so what?

It would be interesting to know the reasons why they didn't provide a statement along with the rest of the squad. Mikel in particular had to answer questions for the police anyway so wouldn't have had to go out of his way to do so. I think it's clear that Terry/Chelsea asked the squad as a whole to provide these statemetns and I'd imagine that statements from 3 of Terry's black teammates would have aided his defense.

 

[JohnnyG]

Are you saying it's interesting because 3 of his black teammates declined to make a statement?

 

[BaZ87]

Are you saying it's interesting because 3 of his black teammates declined to make a statement?

The reasons why they (particularly Mikel) chose not to, yes.

 

[lewism]

I do not like John Terry for his demeanor and he comes across as a bit of a pillock (doing the dirty behind a mate) but for this whole shambles to get this far with the racism card being thrown about is just bloody mad.