"Just stop oil"

[Devilman]

Of course they should be feared if you are committing a crime. They should be respected when they actually do their job and uphold the law..

Again, as I said above, this is entirely the wrong mindset and the realm of bullies and dictactors.

At NO POINT should the police, either as individuals or an institution be feared.

They should fear the consequences of their actions, as deemed by the legal system.

This whole mentality of "They should fear them" is both regressive and frankly stinks of "tough guy attitude" that really is not helpful at any level of the legal system.

 

[labbby]

Do the police think by not removing these protestors they are helping their public image?

Job has changed so much from back in the day and the normal public hate how policing has become.

Problem is people need to work out what they want. Back in the day it was called a Police Force but it got changed in the 2000’s to Police Service…

That is where the decline started..

But to answer your question policing has gone soft because they worry about image more than doing a good job and they think their image is controlled my the loud minority.

 

[labbby]

Again, as I said above, this is entirely the wrong mindset and the realm of bullies and dictactors.

At NO POINT should the police, either as individuals or an institution be feared.

They should fear the consequences of their actions, as deemed by the legal system.

This whole mentality of "They should fear them" is both regressive and frankly stinks of "tough guy attitude" that really is not helpful at any level of the legal system.

Have you ever been a police officer ?

Read what I wrote. You are saying criminals shouldn’t fear the police.

I grew up with parents telling me if I was a bad boy the police would get me. I turned out pretty good.

 

[Devilman]

Have you ever been a police officer ?

Read what I wrote. You are saying criminals shouldn’t fear the police

No, but I have been friends with several over the years and not a single one of them ever expressed a sense that people should fear them, whether criminals or not.

This is not "The Bill" where D.I Burnside comes along and batters the crap out of them to instill "fear".

They should always fear the consequences of their actions should they commit a criminal act, but fearing the police themselves, either as individuals or an institution? Never.

*Edit* What they should be fearing is being arrested and charged for their actions, this is where the system is falling down. Those who are clearly breaking the law are not being punished appropriately (or even at all) by the entire system, from arrest through to the courts. Thus they lack the "fear" of the system they should have.

 

[labbby]

This whole mentality of "They should fear them" is both regressive and frankly stinks of "tough guy attitude" that really is not helpful at any level of the legal system.

If you had any idea what 99% of what a police officer does during a shift then you would understand most of it isn’t tough guy stuff but certain types need the tough guy stick. (Yes I agree a few officers think a uniform gives them certain rights but it’s not as many as you think).

Most officers are basically social workers or talking people out of suicide. But when it comes to people breaking the law they should indeed fear the Police.. if they didn’t there is little point having them.

 

[labbby]

No, but I have been friends with several over the years and not a single one of them ever expressed a sense that people should fear them, whether criminals or not.

So what you’re saying is billy burglar on a night out looking to break in shouldn’t fear police until he has committed the crime ?

Not being funny mate but you are nuts. Police should be feared it doesn’t matter if they get caught or not. If police are feared it actually acts as a deterrent…

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

The police should only be catching the criminals. They do not punish the criminals. The criminals should only fear being caught by the police. They should not be physically afraid of attack from the police.

 

[Devilman]

If you had any idea what 99% of what a police officer does during a shift then you would understand most of it isn’t tough guy stuff but certain types need the tough guy stick. (Yes I agree a few officers think a uniform gives them certain rights but it’s not as many as you think).

Most officers are basically social workers or talking people out of suicide. But when it comes to people breaking the law they should indeed fear the Police.. if they didn’t there is little point having them.

The deterrent we employ in this country (and almost all other civilized countries) against criminality is arrest, followed by prosecution, leading to fines, jail time etc...

This is what prevents most people from committing crimes, we do not want to have to suffer the consequences that would come for committing said crime.
While it maybe true that the initial "fear" (if you want to call it that) may be about the police themselves and getting caught (Run, it's the Rozzers!!!) ultimately they serve a pretty small opening section of the whole gambit and are in many cases effectively the "messenger" for the beginning of bad things.
The idea that you should fear the police, rather than fear the consequences of your actions is fundamentally stupid quite frankly. The police arrest you and collect evidence against you, but it is the court system that doles out the punishment and as such it is that which should be feared, not the copper arresting you for breaking the law.

You seem to have this notion that criminals should cower in fear of a police officer in case they get a swift beating, rather than fear the prospect of facing (potentially) years in prison for their actions.


Or to put it in a more succinct way...

The police should only be catching the criminals. They do not punish the criminals. The criminals should only fear being caught by the police. They should not be physically afraid of attack from the police.

 

[robfosters]

Have you ever been a police officer ?

Read what I wrote. You are saying criminals shouldn’t fear the police.

I grew up with parents telling me if I was a bad boy the police would get me. I turned out pretty good.

Back in the days when a copper would clip you round the ear if you was being a dick

 

[labbby]

The police should only be catching the criminals. They do not punish the criminals. The criminals should only fear being caught by the police. They should not be physically afraid of attack from the police.

Seriously ? Right all you keyboard warriors go sign up to be specials and see how you get on being nice when you have someone up in your face.

Of course police punish criminals.. the whole point of being arrested is you remove civil liberties from a human being ffs. Which is a big deal.

 

[Devilman]

So what you’re saying is billy burglar on a night out looking to break in shouldn’t fear police until he has committed the crime ?

Not being funny mate but you are nuts. Police should be feared it doesn’t matter if they get caught or not. If police are feared it actually acts as a deterrent…

No, I think i've made it very clear time and time again by now that they should fear getting caught and punished for their crime(s).

You seem obsessed with the idea people should fear the police themselves, as individuals.

 

[labbby]

Back in the days when a copper would clip you round the ear if you was being a dick

This and also there was a bond between organised crime and old bill to keep the steers clean of rapists and what not.. it would be dealt with..

Not saying it was a good thing as it wasn’t but it’s gone far to much to the other side. Being in the job late 90’s early 2000’s was when the balance was right.

 

[labbby]

No, I think i've made it very clear time and time again by now that they should fear getting caught and punished for their crime(s).

You seem obsessed with the idea people should fear the police themselves, as individuals.

So they shouldn’t fear wanting to commit a crime just worried about when they do it they get caught ?

 

[Devilman]

Seriously ? Right all you keyboard warriors go sign up to be specials and see how you get on being nice when you have someone up in your face.

Of course police punish criminals.. the whole point of being arrested is you remove civil liberties from a human being ffs. Which is a big deal.

Just no.. to all of this. no. you are flat out WRONG.

The court system PUNISHES criminals.. The police ARREST them and collect evidence to charge them for a crime.

People are arrested for suspicion of breaking the law and to investigate further, NOT to remove their civil liberties, that is what prison is for.

You seem to be very misinformed on how our legal system works and truly fascinated with this notion that people should "fear the police", it's like looking into the mind of a bully.

 

[robfosters]

The deterrent we employ in this country (and almost all other civilized countries) against criminality is arrest, followed by prosecution, leading to fines, jail time etc...

This is what prevents most people from committing crimes, we do not want to have to suffer the consequences that would come for committing said crime.
While it maybe true that the initial "fear" (if you want to call it that) may be about the police themselves and getting caught (Run, it's the Rozzers!!!) ultimately they serve a pretty small opening section of the whole gambit and are in many cases effectively the "messenger" for the beginning of bad things.
The idea that you should fear the police, rather than fear the consequences of your actions is fundamentally stupid quite frankly. The police arrest you and collect evidence against you, but it is the court system that doles out the punishment and as such it is that which should be feared, not the copper arresting you for breaking the law.

You seem to have this notion that criminals should cower in fear of a police officer in case they get a swift beating, rather than fear the prospect of facing (potentially) years in prison for their actions.


Or to put it in a more succinct way...

In the 60’s, coppers dragged my dad and uncle out of their house and literally got them to the ground and kicked **** out of them and then arrested them for something they didn’t do.

They didn’t say anything because in them days coppers could literally do what they wanted and no one said a thing.

He still is mad about it to this day and still bears the scar of a kick to his forehead.

They were known tearaways but this was done without a shred of evidence

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

Seriously ? Right all you keyboard warriors go sign up to be specials and see how you get on being nice when you have someone up in your face.

Of course police punish criminals.. the whole point of being arrested is you remove civil liberties from a human being ffs. Which is a big deal.

Yes, but in this case they are afraid of the removal of civil liberty, not the agent administering such.

Edit: in / on typo

 

[Devilman]

Yes, but in this case they are afraid of the removal of civil liberty, not the agent administering such.

Edit: in / on typo

Precisely this...
They should fear the punishment for their actions, not the individuals themselves.. This is what keeps most of us from committing crimes... It is NOT the fear of the police or the officer(s) themselves, it is the fear of the punishment that will follow, which comes via the courts not the police.

Should we fear the mailman when they bring us a parking fine for that time we parked on double-yellow lines? Should we fear the traffic warden that left the parking ticket? Or should we fear the fine itself?
What prevents most people from illegally parking? Is it "OMG THE POLICE!!!111" or is it "Urgh, I really don't want to get a fine for this" ?

I think it's fair to assume that most people would say it's the latter of the two.

 

[labbby]

In the 60’s, coppers dragged my dad and uncle out of their house and literally got them to the ground and kicked **** out of them and then arrested them for something they didn’t do.

They didn’t say anything because in them days coppers could literally do what they wanted and no one said a thing.

He still is mad about it to this day and still bears the scar of a kick to his forehead.

They were known tearaways but this was done without a shred of evidence

aye this is very true if you know anything about the history 60’s 70’s and 80’s were mega shocking but stuff like that always (mostly had to do with money) it’s why I say late 90’s early 2000’s is a balance we need.

Sorry to hear about that Rob could tell you some messed up stories but not for on here.

My point being is that if you are a criminal or you want to go out breaking the law you should indeed fear the police and I think they need to move away from this nice softy image they have…


There is a balance but we have gone way to far the other way

 

[Uther]

One things for certain, the idiots gluing themselves to roads, climbing bridges, vandalising paintings and buildings, and pouring human excrement over monuments have no fear of the police or courts.
I'm not sure that's a good thing really.

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

I'm all for a police officer defending themselves within the law, but never outside the law. If we don't like that, we should be changing the law, not allowing indemnity, which so often leads to abuse of privilege.