Soldato
The FIA should publish their final race results before the race starts, would save me a good amount of time on race Sundays.
Malaysian Grand Prix 2011, Sepang International Circuit - Race 2/19
- Thread starter Glaucus
- Start date
The RBR car is unbelievably fast.
If a driver in another car can finish within a few seconds of Vettel/RBR, they deserve credit. Over the last year or so very few drivers/cars have been able to achieve this.
Say what you like about Vettel, for me, he is one of the best time triallers I have seen in a long time. Give him an empty track and he is equal to any top driver in F1. Today, he was allowed to time trial and Button still got close to him. Furthermore, Button was able to drive away from Hamilton (I know Hamilton had problems, but even in this scenario, it is not easy to do what Button did today).
What McLaren and Ferrari need to do is prevent Vettel from time trialling. If somebody could get in front of him and force him to race for position, then you will see him crack. Otherwise, you may as well give him this year's title. Force Vettel to race and stop him time trialling from the front - this is the key.
Easier said than done, as Vettel seems to be pretty good at race starts. Alonso, Hamilton, Button, Webber - have all given up places on their race start, but Vettel, for some reason, is able to always get into the first corner first and then begin time trialling.
If a driver in another car can finish within a few seconds of Vettel/RBR, they deserve credit. Over the last year or so very few drivers/cars have been able to achieve this.
Say what you like about Vettel, for me, he is one of the best time triallers I have seen in a long time. Give him an empty track and he is equal to any top driver in F1. Today, he was allowed to time trial and Button still got close to him. Furthermore, Button was able to drive away from Hamilton (I know Hamilton had problems, but even in this scenario, it is not easy to do what Button did today).
What McLaren and Ferrari need to do is prevent Vettel from time trialling. If somebody could get in front of him and force him to race for position, then you will see him crack. Otherwise, you may as well give him this year's title. Force Vettel to race and stop him time trialling from the front - this is the key.
Easier said than done, as Vettel seems to be pretty good at race starts. Alonso, Hamilton, Button, Webber - have all given up places on their race start, but Vettel, for some reason, is able to always get into the first corner first and then begin time trialling.
Soldato
Btw you wanted an example where Button manages his tyres better than Hamilton during a race, well here it is.Both drivers had the same strategy today and on a day of high degradation, Hamilton had to pit again at the end.
Did you not hear what Button said?
He was told to slow down but did not and his tries lasted and he said that if you did slow down they got worse.
Lewis was told to slow down and he did so that's why his tires went off fast.
Btw you wanted an example where Button manages his tyres better than Hamilton during a race, well here it is.
LOL yes.
In fairness though,as you stated, the moment Hamilton went on hard tyres, he was going slower, so I doubt what we saw today was down to tyre management - more down to the fact that Hamilton's car was not setup properly to use the hard tyre. I was amazed to see his team put on hard tyres for the penultimate stop, especially when he was already shown to be going backwards on hard tyres (Alonso, Vettel and Button were all faster than him on hard tyres). There just wasn't any need to bring him in so early for his 2nd pit stop, especially when they were going to, yet again, give him the same hard tyre.
...another poor McLaren strategy call.
Seriously, Hamilton needs to start making all strategic decisions himself.
I don't think Hamilton's tyres actually went off.
If you saw, the moment he switched to hard tyres (even when they were fresh), he went very slow. The effect of tyre degradation occurs after the tyres are used up, not from the word go (ie. on new tyres).
Soldato
Well if Vettel wasn't starting on pole so often, it would be interesting to see if he keeps colliding into other cars during the season, especially Webber 
really don't get the penalties stupid stuff from the stewards again. Can't see any reason to punish Alonso as much as I dislike him he didn't do anything wrong and it now sets a precedent that you clip someone in an overtake and you get a punishment are they trying to force all the drivers to only use the drs zone or something
As for Hamilton's penalty it was marginal at best and not even the worse case of weaving I'm pretty sure Webber did worse a few times
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnAdeKFZhIU Vettel at the start
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L61_AevsjMs what hamilton was punished for ?
As for Hamilton's penalty it was marginal at best and not even the worse case of weaving I'm pretty sure Webber did worse a few times
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnAdeKFZhIU Vettel at the start
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L61_AevsjMs what hamilton was punished for ?
Soldato
I paid attention, thanks.
Button was told to slow down as they hadn't known anyone to go past 16 laps on the hards, Button at first didn't slow as he had a good feeling in the tyres and was catching Vettel at 6 tenths per lap. He then got another message to slow down and he did, I was watching live timing and he suddenly started going 0.5-1 sec a lap slower matching Vettel for pace.
Lewis just plain struggled for one reason or another on his 4th set, he was slow on the out set with those tyres and is the reason why Alonso caught him before the collision.
Caporegime
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- 18 Oct 2002
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- 33,188
Yes, no idea why Hamilton was on hards, though again I really do think they didn't plan to bring him in for a second set when they did. Did they make the wrong call, did someone think he was on softs when he was on hards, did a massive error get made.
Or did something go wrong with the car and they just don't want anyone to know what it is, I don't know.
But they were on different tyres in the 3rd stint so daft to say they were on the same strategy. Button lucked into where he was, again, its rather boring and crap happening to drivers behind Vettel left him all on his own to cruise to the end, again.
Alonso vs Hamilton was entertaining but silly, it was a car at proper pace against a car lacking over a second a lap other than Alonso making a massive meal of passing a much slower car, realistically he caught up, didn't get the straight right, then the next real chance smashed into the back of him, hardly breath taking stuff.
The better stuff was really Kobyashi, against Webber with the back and forth, and did the same with Michael, and a couple other people.
Bah, I'd love to see one race where points are awarded for qualifying, and then 1st in quali starts at the back.
The weaving, when I saw it I thought, borderline, he did move a lot, but realistically he just moved to the inside for the straight then moved once to the outside to get the right line for the corner.
I said earlier though, it was a hard call as to when Alonso is actually trying to pass and whats a move and whats a defensive move. Personally I think only the switch to the outside of the track is "defensive" and also the racing line for the corner, should he not try and take the corner properly because Alonso is kinda close? I wondered at the time if they might screw him, but on replay I think its ridiculous. If Alonso pulled out trying to pass him at any stage and THEN Hamilton weaved, thats one thing, but Alonso just never made his move.
Or did something go wrong with the car and they just don't want anyone to know what it is, I don't know.
But they were on different tyres in the 3rd stint so daft to say they were on the same strategy. Button lucked into where he was, again, its rather boring and crap happening to drivers behind Vettel left him all on his own to cruise to the end, again.
Alonso vs Hamilton was entertaining but silly, it was a car at proper pace against a car lacking over a second a lap other than Alonso making a massive meal of passing a much slower car, realistically he caught up, didn't get the straight right, then the next real chance smashed into the back of him, hardly breath taking stuff.
The better stuff was really Kobyashi, against Webber with the back and forth, and did the same with Michael, and a couple other people.
Bah, I'd love to see one race where points are awarded for qualifying, and then 1st in quali starts at the back.
The weaving, when I saw it I thought, borderline, he did move a lot, but realistically he just moved to the inside for the straight then moved once to the outside to get the right line for the corner.
I said earlier though, it was a hard call as to when Alonso is actually trying to pass and whats a move and whats a defensive move. Personally I think only the switch to the outside of the track is "defensive" and also the racing line for the corner, should he not try and take the corner properly because Alonso is kinda close? I wondered at the time if they might screw him, but on replay I think its ridiculous. If Alonso pulled out trying to pass him at any stage and THEN Hamilton weaved, thats one thing, but Alonso just never made his move.
Still fell asleep in bits of this, really cant cope with waking up on a sunday morning for fly aways 
(probably not going to make China as well as its another silly o'clock start). Should have more European and American Gp's....
Can not believe Hamilton and Alonso got penalised! (needs some victor meldrew for that) just so so stupid. Though on vettel at the start eveyone knows unless you basically break test someone on the first corner almost anything is fair game...
Driver of the day Heidfeld as he's proven me and quite a few other people wrong and doing some sensible racing in a car that could really push for good results (and Petrov was just a good laugh).
(probably not going to make China as well as its another silly o'clock start). Should have more European and American Gp's....Can not believe Hamilton and Alonso got penalised! (needs some victor meldrew for that) just so so stupid. Though on vettel at the start eveyone knows unless you basically break test someone on the first corner almost anything is fair game...
Driver of the day Heidfeld as he's proven me and quite a few other people wrong and doing some sensible racing in a car that could really push for good results (and Petrov was just a good laugh).
Glad someone's chirped up and said that, don't often get people in these threads holding their hands up. Heidfeld got so much abuse on this forum for getting the Kubica seat and the problems he had at Melbourne only fueled the fire.
He's always been a very competent driver, not particularly exciting or blindingly quick but certainly the best option for Renault to lead their team in absence of Kubica.
Soldato
Jenson Button 
Absolutely fantastic race to watch with my son Jenson for his second Grand Prix ...
So I was right Sunama, Lewis did 4 stops, Jenson did 3 - therefore the rumour mills true, Jenson is a smoother driver
Brilliant drive by Mark Webber
Excellent drive by Nick Heidfeld
Great duel between Alonso and Lewis
Superb drive by Jenson Button
Vettel just coasted
Really enjoyed this Grand Prix and I for one am loving DRS on the pit straight.
Now for a Sunday dinner and time to watch the F1 Forum
Absolutely fantastic race to watch with my son Jenson for his second Grand Prix ...
So I was right Sunama, Lewis did 4 stops, Jenson did 3 - therefore the rumour mills true, Jenson is a smoother driver
Brilliant drive by Mark Webber
Excellent drive by Nick Heidfeld
Great duel between Alonso and Lewis
Superb drive by Jenson Button
Vettel just coasted
Really enjoyed this Grand Prix and I for one am loving DRS on the pit straight.
Now for a Sunday dinner and time to watch the F1 Forum
Soldato
I will laugh if it's related to the coming together with Alonso, if only to watch JRS fly into rage when everyone calls the FIAs bias into question again
Sorry I'm late, been out getting some sun. What did I miss?
*reads back*
Meh. Not like it's much of a shock, is it? The race stewards want to stamp out racing, so they punish Hamilton (a racer of the first order) for moving around a little bit. I didn't think Alonso would get dinked for that collision though, partly because he's Alonso (sometimes it seems like he can do whatever the **** he wants!
) and partly because other drivers have gotten away with clipping or even plain running into the back of cars before. Case in point - Brazil '09, Lewis punctured Rubens' rear tyre in a slightly misjudged overtake, no penalty resulted. Hey ho. Another race, another WTF? moment from the stewards. Roll on China, and the next bat-**** insane decision!Pity really, as I quite enjoyed that race.
Associate
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- 10 Mar 2005
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- 1,766
Soldato
Agree, the stewards ballsup of the Hamilton/Alonso incidents is taking away from the fact that this was quite an enjoyable race. (Well, it was for me anyway)
Looking forward to China.
Looking forward to China.
Soldato
The whole Ferrari International Assistance stuff didn't really kick off like I expected (hoped) JRS
Sorry to disappoint. But sunlight and gardening (well....pulling dead bits of tree out of the ground and stuffing them into the brown bin if that counts as gardening) mellows me right out, and in all honesty what would be the point in me trying to say that this is not necessarily Yet Another Example Of Pro-Ferrari Bias™?