Yes but the jihadist would argue they arwnt true muslims as the quran is literal text from god and has to be interperated literaly
Manchester Bombing *** Please remain respectful and refrain from antagonising posts ***
- Thread starter omnomnom
- Start date
indeed - thus why I questioned the apparent assertion from the Bishop of Manchester that this has nothing to do with any religious ideology or faith
I would suggest you watch some Douglas Murray videos on YouTube to explain what is the logical reaction when some people try to claim that such terrorism has 'nothing' to do with the fanatics religion or culture. The clue is two fold 1) their fanatics and 2)the fundamentals of the religion matter there's a reason why we don't get scared by fundamentalist Jains....
Associate
We should be going in hard with the people on the watch lists for a start.
Problem is we don't have the resources and we live in a stupid country where people are not even prepared to pay more tax for essentials like a decent top tier health service.
If you want to go after these people you're going to have to pay for it. We are not spending or doing enough at the moment.
Problem is we don't have the resources and we live in a stupid country where people are not even prepared to pay more tax for essentials like a decent top tier health service.
If you want to go after these people you're going to have to pay for it. We are not spending or doing enough at the moment.
No the only sure way of defeating islamic terroists is to have a policy like saddam hussien enforced. Any suicide bomber blew himself up in Baghdad in his day and he'd make sure his friends and family died a very slow, horrific death and being tortured for a prolonged period. Not saying this is something i condone but once message gets out what will happen to your loved ones, family, children that will deter evem the most feverant nutjob.
And the amoralist would argue in defence of this p9licy that if you dont want to see you own family brutaly murdered you shouldnt blow youraelf upin public places.
It can take upwards of 10 people just to run surveillance on one suspect (unless you want them to know they are under surveillance).
Caporegime
Are you actively trying to ignore facts? Where were his family from before they came here, why might he be aggrieved...
Even that is only so effective against fundamental Islamists. Places like Egypt at times have had to take extreme measures against them.
Caporegime
Firstly, I doubt that would deter them. Secondly, you sound awfully keen on something you aren't condoning.
It worked in iraq and a similar but more toned policy worked in libya and syria under gadaffi amd assad. It wasnt until we destabalised these nations that they went down the pan.
Caporegime
It has to do with a minority of adherents to that faith.
Education?
Or just cut all the financial ties in
Um his family escaped a dictator, we provided shelter food etc. Then toppled the dictator and installed democracy. Yes the democracy went to he'll but that wasn't are fault.
So he bombed us for saving his families lives? Sounds like a fair trade.
Permabanned
The guy who done it was not on any watch list.....
Call me a conspiracy theory nut but If ISIS really were taking revenge or defending Islam then one of their prime targets would be Isreal due to the Palestinian oppression, etc. It seems rather suspect that they have never attempted to attack them yet attack everyone else. I haven't even heard of much news about them attacking the Syrian regime either.
Who are they really and what is their agenda is open to debate but it sure doesn't look like they are furthering the cause of Islam in a positive way.
Who are they really and what is their agenda is open to debate but it sure doesn't look like they are furthering the cause of Islam in a positive way.
Man of Honour
Doubtful. Islam was created for the purpose of taking power by violence and has done so since its creation. Dressing lust for power up with an excuse is often politically useful and often done, but it's rarely the real reason and probably never the real reason when it's part of propaganda from a power-orientated ideology. That statement from IS isn't even vaguely plausible to anyone thinking straight - what are the chances that the people killed at the concert were medieval soldiers fighting a war sanctioned by the Pope? The claim that they were crusaders is just nonsense to appeal to believers. The only bit of that statement that rings true is their hatred of a pop concert.
You can see the same sort of thing from various power-orientated ideologies of bigotry throughout the world and throughout history. Pick a group identity, pick a target group, write anything and everything against them to blame them for everything including and especially your own actions. Protestants against Catholics and Catholics against Protestants during that conflict in Europe. Revolutionaries against aristocrats in France after the revolution. Whitists against "blacks" in the USA in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Nazis against Jews in the 1920s and 30s. Communists against the bourgeousie in various places in the 20th and 21st centuries. Stalinists against everyone else. Maoists against everyone else. Just a few examples off the top of my head.
Im not condoning it and thankfully ill never be in a position where ill have to decide to enforce such a policy. But these are the tactics used throughout ages to deal with insurgents and terroists.
It worked with the romans and mohammad himself used a similar policy to deal with some jews who plotted to kill him
so let me get this right you saying hes annoyed that the west helped topple Gadaffi's regime who his parents apparently fled from for a better life in the UK ? Yes that makes perfect sense....
so if i was to go and bomb a mosque and stated the reason was because Christians were being persecuted in some Muslim countries (true) I presume you would at least partially rush to my defense?
Permabanned
The main goal of ISIS I think is to set up their own state pretty like what the jews achieved with terrorism.....
Soldato
****** off that you're using an atrocity to try and score internet points to confirm your own prejudices.
Now that's passed, I still feel revulsion for the act that targeted children and families. Profound sorrow for my fellow Mancunians (and visitors to our fantastic city) who have been killed and injured, both physically and mentally.
What can we do to stop it? I put forward the suggestion that we stop meddling in Muslim countries and turning them into war zones.
Western sentiments have definitely turned against this sort of meddling....but sadly you can't undo the last two decades overnight. We'll be paying the price of our failed foreign policy in blood for years to come.
Western sentiments have definitely turned against this sort of meddling....but sadly you can't undo the last two decades overnight. We'll be paying the price of our failed foreign policy in blood for years to come.