My Test of GRAW running with and without physX

[[ui]ICEMAN]

Well Bet on Soldier: Blood Sport and City of Villains are both listed on Ageia's website as being PhysX Optimized... any chance of getting them tested too?

Getting the demo for Bet on Soldier now, might not have support but we'll see. As for CoV, I'll test it but I'd require a copy of the game... so unless someone's feeling generous with a key I won't be able to help.

Site I worked for is www.bit-tech.net , don't write as a main member of staff any more since I don't have the time now I'm a pilot.

 

[Cyanide]

Getting the demo for Bet on Soldier now, might not have support but we'll see. As for CoV, I'll test it but I'd require a copy of the game... so unless someone's feeling generous with a key I won't be able to help.

Tbh I can't see either of them having any better implementation than GRAW as they're older games, but it's gotta be worth a try

 

[Fulcrum]

Whats wrong with just using the cpu, which game overloads the cpu so much that we need a special card now

 

[G.O.A.T]

Watched both the vids and it looks pretty much the same (the grenade one looks a bit more funky) , only the PPU ones run 10fps slower.

 

[[ui]ICEMAN]

Demo of Bet on Solider doesn't have support, will try and get hold of the game tomorrow. From what I've read/seen Bet on Soldier is the one with the fluid dynamics on the flamethrower, so its a nice test.

 

[chaparral]

Whats wrong with just using the cpu, which game overloads the cpu so much that we need a special card now

You got it all wrong there mate...
These PhysX card makers are thinking your wallet is overloaded with money so they want help you sort that problem out..

 

[Cyanide]

Demo of Bet on Solider doesn't have support, will try and get hold of the game tomorrow. From what I've read/seen Bet on Soldier is the one with the fluid dynamics on the flamethrower, so its a nice test.

Awesome, from what I've seen it should only cost around a tenner, and it doesn't look like too bad of a game anyways

Those fluid effects look good from what I've seen of them - and they do look to be well implemented this time (ie, they've bothered to add texture to the extra effects!), but I wonder at what cost they come at... Another big test for PhysX!

 

[ihatelag]

Whats wrong with just using the cpu, which game overloads the cpu so much that we need a special card now

It's not so much about overloading the CPU, it's that the PPU can create faster calculations of physics than a CPU. The CPU uses a standard logic for calculations whereas the PPU uses a specialised logic which will calculate more faster the physics effect.

The additional benifit of a PPU is that the core output will purely be dedicated to the physics whereas CPU's are load-balancing between other things. (such as active programs/OS/and everything else)

Although im no fanboy of PPU, it has it's benifits. But to be honest the downside of PPU is that it runs on a PCI slot, which means that there is a three way communication happening(cpu/gpu/ppu) at a fair rate(nothing great - although I wonder how well PhysX works on a PCI-X slot? ). Whereas, a HavocFX solution, which would be running on a graphics card will just have a two way comms between the CPU and graphics card. The obvious effect of having PhysX in the system has been the poor fps experienced by everyone (which has been demonstrated by everyone who posted here with PhysX in their system). Having said that, I can't vouch that the fps will not be reduced when HavocFX gets implemented with the graphics card...maybe it will be the same like the PPU because of the increased amount of calculations it is doing. Only time will tell im afraid

Let's hope we can see some more results from testing with PPU to see the full scale benefits of having one.

 

[Mr Spew]

I'm sorry but those 2 games you've listed as demonstrating what the PC is capable of I don't agree with.

Both bring high end systems to their knees! If developers spent more time on optimising they could get it running suberbly on lower, more main stream hardware with nice eye candy and even more breathtaking on higher end systems.

Its so easy for the developers to not optimise the engine and game safe in the knowledge that there are people out there with ninja PC's able to play it. Never mind us folk who can't afford to spend money on an X1900XT and £200 PPU.

It really does seem as if they use the PC platform as a testing ground for console games, especially with the 360 out and the ease of use of XNA.

But personally I wouldn't want my brand new product to be showcased by a poorly implemented bolt on to a game. I can't see why Ageia didn't just wait untill it was fully ready and they had devised a way for good implementation and some better drivers.

It's like saying "Hey, look at our new sports car! It works and it's really fast... it just has 2 wheels missing but it'll be fine in a month or 2!"

But releasing it now gets them extra sales, and seems ahead of the curve if you will - despite annoyances from early adopters.

 

[Angilion]

PhysX was hyped a while ago. The physics-on-graphics-card idea is more recent. I get the impression that Ageia, a small company, has been in headless chicken mode to get their one and only product in the shops with something suppoting it right away, right now, aarrrggh panic sell it now, sell it now so that it's established before ATi and nvidia get into the physics market.

I'm thinking that either (a) PhysX is inherently flawed in some way and Ageia have thrown it into the market quickly to hook enthusiasts because they need to sell enough to stay in business for the next generation or (b) PhysX hardware is fine but it's currently being very badly utilised even ignoring the fact that the player-gameworld interaction aspect of it isn't being used at all. Tack-on support doesn't do the job.

 

[Falkentyne]

I knew this would happen. Saw this coming last year.
The card is nothing but a "decelerator" aka S3 ViRGe.
The s3 virge was a "graphics improver". a decelerator. Just like this card.
It improves the physics yet slows down everything that matters.

Nothing but a gimmick.

All for the price of a mid range video card
What we SHOULD be seeing is framerates 10-20 FPS **HIGHER** with the physics card, not lower.

Remains to be seen what havokFX does.

Oh while I'm at it, try a test
Set the settings to lowest details, 640x480 if possible, but highest physics, disable all AA and AF. Vsync off

Then do a test with PPU on and off.
If PPU Off gives faster fps than PPU on, then I was right all along....

 

[Reality|Bites]

Can't they just intergrate the PPU onto the Graphics card instead of buying a separate £200 card?

 

[HangTime]

I reckon they should put them on soundcards People change graphics cards quite frequently and you don't want to keep having to pay out for a PPU over and over again.

It would also give a welcome boost to the soundcard market which is quite stagnant, generally speaking people either use onboard sound or buy an addon card and then use it for several years until there's a leap forward in technology (e.g. SB Live! -> Audigy -> X-Fi).

 

[[ui]ICEMAN]

Oh while I'm at it, try a test
Set the settings to lowest details, 640x480 if possible, but highest physics, disable all AA and AF. Vsync off

Then do a test with PPU on and off.
If PPU Off gives faster fps than PPU on, then I was right all along....

There's no point in me doing that, I did a short test run before hand to ensure the resolution and settings weren't interfering with the results. We will see when I get the other game today (hopefully) if it is adding effects and hurting performance, don't judge anything by just one game, we all know how bad game developers are at optimising code when its been put in at the last minute.

 

[[ui]ICEMAN]

800x600 with all lowest options enabled, same story.

On

Explosion 35
Grenade 55
Gunshot 80

Off

Explosion 60
Grenade 90
Gunshot 110

 

[Kabaala]

I'm sorry but those 2 games you've listed as demonstrating what the PC is capable of I don't agree with.

Both bring high end systems to their knees! If developers spent more time on optimising they could get it running suberbly on lower, more main stream hardware with nice eye candy and even more breathtaking on higher end systems.

Its so easy for the developers to not optimise the engine and game safe in the knowledge that there are people out there with ninja PC's able to play it. Never mind us folk who can't afford to spend money on an X1900XT and £200 PPU.

Neither bring my sytem to it's knees even on max settings

 

[Cyanide]

800x600 with all lowest options enabled, same story.

On

Explosion 35
Grenade 55
Gunshot 80

Off

Explosion 60
Grenade 90
Gunshot 110

Damn that's a big drop in framerate! Especially for such a low res

 

[Falkentyne]

800x600 with all lowest options enabled, same story.

On

Explosion 35
Grenade 55
Gunshot 80

Off

Explosion 60
Grenade 90
Gunshot 110

Thanks for proving my point, Iceman ,and for testing that out.
And also sorry that you had to waste $(200 300 USD?) to just be scammed like this. I will not be buying this card to be the physics version of the S3 Virge.

Because that's all it is.....i mean wow, look at the HUGE reduction in framerate when the video card is completely removed from the picture ! That's **Exactly** what the S3 virge did back then. (I should know--I had one).

 

[[ui]ICEMAN]

As a reviewer I always do my best to remain impartial, you can't judge the performance of this card on one game, whicht could possibly be one very badly implemented game at that.

I'll post back with more scores/vids of other software as and when I get it. On the other hand I can't say I'm particularly annoyed at having spent £220 on it, if it turns out to be terrible in later software too, oh well

 

[JonnyGLC]

I can't say I'm particularly annoyed at having spent £220 on it, if it turns out to be terrible in later software too, oh well

If only i had the money to throw around like that