Nurse arrested for murdering babies

bingham67 said:
Should have CCTV fitted in every ward from now on should have been there anyway.
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Not sure that's going to go down well on a maternity ward with new mothers in various states of undress and doing things like breastfeeding.

For that unit (my girls were both born there, but before Lucy Letby was employed) you would have needed a shedload of cameras to cover it all, it was a right rabbit warren of a place. There were cameras covering the entry/exit doors and you had to be buzzed in, but nothing inside.

EDIT: Someone will always be able to find a blind spot and hospital beds all have privacy curtains.
 
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ANDREW GREEN said:
The public should know about her in case she somehow ever comes back into society. Prison inmates should know about her, so they can take procautions to protect themselves against her. Lobbying groups should know about her, so they can pressure the government not to release her.

There's no logic to assume her friends would suffer from guilt by association. This seems like a none argument. Will her family suffer? I doubt they'll get physical attacks, it seems unlikely and very rare. I imagine many people wouldn't want to associate with them, probably questioning what Letby's upbringing was like.

Her name and pictures been released is a large punnishment to her in the form of public humiliation.
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But they already are. The doctor she was "friends" with is having his name dredged through the mud at the moment.

Her family are already being vilified in the press.

She should have anonymity like they do in other countries.
 
One thing that is being exposed in all this is the weakness of the NHS system when people were reporting her. Their complaints were not only dismissed, but the people reporting her were made to say sorry to her.

That stinks of a conflict of interest between the running of a hospital and exposing issues. I think reporting of incidents need to be done by an outside organisation like school inspector's with education.

Big organisations are susceptible in covering up their own faults. In this case the faults included lives being lost.
 
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Dialup said:
But they already are. The doctor she was "friends" with is having his name dredged through the mud at the moment.

Her family are already being vilified in the press.

She should have anonymity like they do in other countries.
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Anonymity is the wrong solution here. Why should the gutter press be able to make snide allegations about the families with impunity. Unless they're rich enough to take them to court, they're stuffed.
 
BowdonUK said:
One thing that is being exposed in all this is the weakness of the NHS system when people were reporting her. Their complaints were not only dismissed, but the people reporting her were made to say sorry to her.

That stinks of a conflict of interest between the running of a hospital and exposing issues. I think reporting of incidents need to be done by an outside organisation like school inspector's with education.

Big organisations are susceptible in covering up their own faults. In this case the faults included lives being lost.
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Yeah, it's the sort of thing you would expect heads to roll for, but I doubt anything will actually happen as these sorts of organisations are quite cozy "caring" organisations. It's absolutely shameful that the whistleblowers were effectively forced to apologise for raising the concerns, presumably under the threat of a disciplinary.
 
peterwalkley said:
Not sure that's going to go down well on a maternity ward with new mothers in various states of undress and doing things like breastfeeding.

For that unit (my girls were both born there, but before Lucy Letby was employed) you would have needed a shedload of cameras to cover it all, it was a right rabbit warren of a place. There were cameras covering the entry/exit doors and you had to be buzzed in, but nothing inside.

EDIT: Someone will always be able to find a blind spot and hospital beds all have privacy curtains.
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Surely where she killed these babies the parents were not present, you wouldn't need a shedload only on the parts where nurse administer stuff.

But get what you say it a big privacy issue if mum are in state of undress.
 
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bingham67 said:
Should have CCTV fitted in every ward from now on should have been there anyway.
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This would probably be the biggest breach of GDPR ever.
What should have happened was that upper Management should have taken the concerns of Medical Professionals seriously.
if somebody like our own @Minstadave went to management with concerns it should be 100% looked at and not fobbed off.
All the cases I've worked on over 13 years have all been found out by whistleblowing and Management taking it seriously.
It is also true that even though they are Medical Professionals they can also act like young teenagers at times.
 
bingham67 said:
you wouldn't need a shedload only on the parts where nurse administer stuff.
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I look at Maternity Notes all the time searching for stuff and the Prescription Chart would be the first place to look HOWEVER no murderer is going to put on the Chart they have administered air or Insulin, the only way that was found was by Blood (Pathology) tests.
 
Wizzkidy said:
Entitled to your opinion and I get it, but they have ruined this persons life and I just hope its not just on circumstantial evidence. It's quite plausible these babies died due to the NHS being in the worst state its ever been in.
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Dialup said:
But they already are. The doctor she was "friends" with is having his name dredged through the mud at the moment.

Her family are already being vilified in the press.

She should have anonymity like they do in other countries.
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I've not heard of that, which countries give murderers anonymity?
 
The media must now condemn Lucy Letby as a terrible monster without going near the idea that she is a terrible monster that hospital managers allowed to get away with her crimes for so long.
And that now this terrible monster has been caught and convicted the NHS is once again clean and free of all sin to remain the national treasure that is the envy of the world.
Despite malpractice payoffs eating huge chunks of the budget that executives haven't blagged or wasted on diversity and outreach and equality and liberalism that allowed Letby to apparently thrive. And despite so many of the imported medical professionals having no qualifications to practice, and they shut up shop when there's a pandemic then go on strike for more money.

But yeah. Get Letby out of the way and it's all good.
 
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Dialup said:
What would your solution be?
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Some combination of:
- Better privacy laws governing press content. France seem to do it quite well.
- A press complaints complaints commission with a backbone and the ability to impose punitive fines and real apologies (not the ones buried on page 37 in a 4 point font).
- Burn them them to the ground and salt the earth after a third offence. This may seem extreme, but its the language they use and understand so what's good for the goose ...

A bit off topic though so perhaps I should stop here and put the flammenwerfer down. Blaming the family is sheer malice and ignorance and makes me angry.
 
Dialup said:
That's slightly irrelevant to what I asked. Why is naming her so important? Just keep her anonymous.
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One of the principles of the criminal justice system is that justice needs to be seen to be done, so unless there's a particularly sensitive or compelling reason then anonymity isn't justified. Collateral damage on friends/family is unfortunate but isn't grounds to protect the identifies of those found guilty of crimes, otherwise everyone would be granted anonymity. What's probably needed are restrictions on the press to stop them naming or harassing friends/family members.
 
Dialup said:
But they already are. The doctor she was "friends" with is having his name dredged through the mud at the moment.

Her family are already being vilified in the press.

She should have anonymity like they do in other countries.
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The doctor who had an affair with her was given anonyminity though, his evidence was behind a screen wasn't it? That aside he was very unprofessional having an affair in the workplace with a subordinate. If it wasn't for that affair she may not have commited these murders. That is the suspected reason for her killings.

The family have been barely reported on and I've tried to read everything I could. The only reporting I've seen is the mother being in disbelief at the verdict. Which points to her not bothering to research her daughters case or point to the denial of a person with a Cluster B Pesonality Dissorder. Which would point to her helping form her daughters personality dissorder.

These people all have little sympathy from me after Letby has destroyed so many people's lives.
 
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ANDREW GREEN said:
The doctor who had an affair with her was given anonyminity though, his evidence was behind a screen wasn't it? That aside he was very unprofessional having an affair in the workplace with a subordinate. If it wasn't for that affair she may not have commited these murders. That is the suspected reason for her killings.

The family have been barely reported on and I've tried to read everything I could. The only reporting I've seen is the mother being in disbelief at the verdict. Which points to her not bothering to research her daughters case or point to the denial of a person with a Cluster B Pesonality Dissorder. Which would point to her helping form her daughters personality dissorder.

These people all have little sympathy from me after Letby has destroyed so many people's lives.
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They have not committed a single crime.
 
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