NVIDIA 4000 Series

Dicehunter · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:20

Neil79 said:
I have £800 to spend I want a 4080 damn it!! Over £1000 is WAY too much

Hopefully black Friday will have some proper offers on.

Hostile_18 said:
Judging from the comments Gibbo makes from time to time, I get the feeling Retailers don't have much margin to play with, plus the poor exchange rate. I hope I'm wrong and we get some amazing deals... but I can't see it

All joking aside that many of us do on here, The margin on GPU's for retailers is absolutely tiny. Profit on most GPU's is only in the double digits.

Ayahuasca · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:22

I think an £800 4080 is very unlikely, even on Black Friday. We haven't had any real BF deals for years.

The only way the 4080 will go down to that price is if/when these new "super" cards come out, and that's if they don't discontinue the regular 4080.

Apex · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:39

Hostile_18 said:
Judging from the comments Gibbo makes from time to time, I get the feeling Retailers don't have much margin to play with, plus the poor exchange rate. I hope I'm wrong and we get some amazing deals... but I can't see it

He always says that, but they're also always expanding...

Hostile_18 · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:42

Apex said:
He always says that, but they're also always exapanding...

There's so many revenue streams than just graphics cards. The highest margin is on 4090s I believe at around 200. Take into account delivery, packaging and fixed business costs, RMAs etc.

Apex · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:44

Ayahuasca said:
I think an £800 4080 is very unlikely, even on Black Friday. We haven't had any real BF deals for years.

The only way the 4080 will go down to that price is if/when these new "super" cards come out, and that's if they don't discontinue the regular 4080.

They can discontinue them sure, but they've still got mountains of cards they can't sell. Especially 4080 i'd say as they were a disaster.

What are they going to achieve by releasing the non gimped editions at a premium when they can't sell cards that are slightly cheaper unless they're going to seriously cut prices?

It looks to me like they'd just end up with another mountain of unsold cards next to the mountain of unsold cards they already have.

Ayahuasca · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:48

Apex said:
They can discontinue them sure, but they've still got mountains of cards they can't sell. Especially 4080 i'd say as they were a disaster.

What are they going to achieve by releasing the non gimped editions at a premium when they can't sell cards that are slightly cheaper unless they're going to seriously cut prices?

It looks to me like they'd just end up with another mountain of unsold cards next to the mountain of unsold cards they already have.

nVidia are quite happy to hold stock and manipulate the pricing of a new tier, rather than heavily discounting cards for sales. They don't want to give the game away until they absolutely have to.

They have pretty much no competition at the moment so they'll just do as they please.

Apex · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:48

Hostile_18 said:
There's so many revenue streams than just graphics cards. The highest margin is on 4090s I believe at around 200. Take into account delivery, packaging and fixed business costs, RMAs etc.

Sorry, but i'm never going to take pity of poor retailers selling GPU's when I see them moving prices up daily and then claiming it's due to the exchange rate, because it clearly isn't.

Apex · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:50

Ayahuasca said:
nVidia are quite happy to hold stock and manipulate the pricing of a new tier, rather than heavily discounting cards for sales. They don't want to give the game away until they absolutely have to.

They have pretty much no competition at the moment so they'll just do as they please.

We really get to see behind the curtain these days. We can predict their moves like clockwork.

Hostile_18 · 19 Oct 2023 at 11:58

Apex said:
Sorry, but i'm never going to take pity of poor retailers selling GPU's when I see them moving prices up daily and then claiming it's due to the exchange rate, because it clearly isn't.

I mean even Nvidia are changing their prices back higher for the FE. Even if you cut out the retailers cut completely, so they are selling you a product at cost would -200 make you happy? The earlier talk of a 4080 was -400 and that makes less margin than a 4090.

AIBs make little margin as well. Really you want to direct your critism at Nvidia itself.

Apex · 19 Oct 2023 at 12:04

Hostile_18 said:
I mean even Nvidia are changing their prices back higher for the FE. Even if you cut out the retailers cut completely, so they are selling you a product at cost would -200 make you happy? The earlier talk of a 4080 was -400 and that makes less margin than a 4090.

AIBs make little margin as well. Really you want to direct your critism at Nvidia itself.

They're as bad as each other, and I didn't see retailers crying during Covid when they were scalping the **** out of GPU's - prices going up even when people had them in basket and were paying...it's the AIB's who really got screwed by Nvidia.

Hostile_18 · 19 Oct 2023 at 12:08

Apex said:
They're as bad as each other, and I didn't see retailers crying during Covid when they were scalping the **** out of GPU's - prices going up even when people had them in basket and were paying...it's the AIB's who really got screwed by Nvidia.

Yeah it's not a good situation. Only comfort is no one is taking performance away from us. So when the 5090 comes out the 4090 will still be good and hopefully drop by quite a bit. Just reinforces non commercial users should upgrade every other gen or a generation behind.

Dicehunter · 19 Oct 2023 at 12:26

4070 Super apparently getting 16GB memory.

https://twitter.com/Zed__Wang/status/1714891667927679206

TNA · 19 Oct 2023 at 13:17

Dicehunter said:
4070 Super apparently getting 16GB memory.

https://twitter.com/Zed__Wang/status/1714891667927679206

Good. But let's see if they keep the same price or up it by $100.

I have almost zero interest, but bodes well for the 5070 which with the information available to me right now will likely be my next card.

I say that because naming and it's order in the stack might change, pricing might change etc.

Like when the 3080 FE came out, at the time my intention was to go for a 3070. But due to the pricing it was a no brainer to get the 3080 FE.

Who knows what Nvidia will do next gen. The 5070 might be $799 or $399 and be what traditionally been named a 5050 Ti :cry:

******* Jensen!

Dicehunter · 19 Oct 2023 at 13:56

TNA said:
Good. But let's see if they keep the same price or up it by $100.

I have almost zero interest, but bodes well for the 5070 which with the information available to me right now will likely be my next card.

I say that because naming and it's order in the stack might change, pricing might change etc.

Like when the 3080 FE came out, at the time my intention was to go for a 3070. But due to the pricing it was a no brainer to get the 3080 FE.

Who knows what Nvidia will do next gen. The 5070 might be $799 or $399 and be what traditionally been named a 5050 Ti

******* Jensen!

Well this Super refresh is likely Nvidia's lineup for 2024 with the 5000 series coming 2025 but my concern is the price increase, You just know the Supers are going to cost more than the non Supers and eventually leading into 2025 the 5000 series is going to cost more again what with TSMC's prices going up and Nvidia will pass that price increase onto the general customer.

markoboyo11 · 19 Oct 2023 at 16:58

Apex said:
Sorry, but i'm never going to take pity of poor retailers selling GPU's when I see them moving prices up daily and then claiming it's due to the exchange rate, because it clearly isn't.

I find it amusing when I see some retailers complain of only 10% ish margin on gpus.
10% on a £1500 gpu that takes up very little space, sell in their 1000s and go back to manufacturers for rma is printing money.

mrk · 19 Oct 2023 at 21:10

Dicehunter said:
4070 Super apparently getting 16GB memory.

https://twitter.com/Zed__Wang/status/1714891667927679206

Hmmmm.

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER rumored to feature 16GB memory and AD103 GPU - VideoCardz.com

NVIDIA planning new RTX 4070 (SUPER) models NVIDIA might incorporate the AD103 GPU into the series. As per information from MEGAsizeGPU, the upcoming RTX 4070 SUPER variant is rumored to be equipped with the AD103 GPU and boast 16GB of 256-bit memory. This might be a substantial upgrade in...

videocardz.com

Apex · 20 Oct 2023 at 01:41

Dicehunter said:
Well this Super refresh is likely Nvidia's lineup for 2024 with the 5000 series coming 2025 but my concern is the price increase, You just know the Supers are going to cost more than the non Supers and eventually leading into 2025 the 5000 series is going to cost more again what with TSMC's prices going up and Nvidia will pass that price increase onto the general customer.

5090 will be 2K minimum.

:cry:

Tinek · 20 Oct 2023 at 08:52

Ayahuasca said:
nVidia are quite happy to hold stock and manipulate the pricing of a new tier, rather than heavily discounting cards for sales. They don't want to give the game away until they absolutely have to.

They have pretty much no competition at the moment so they'll just do as they please.

Plus with all the real money they get from the enterprise and AI, they can take the hit from unsold gaming cards and not even notice much. There's really no leverage against them now and this is a monster that gaming community (at least partially) created themselves. And yet still so many people wish AMD be gone for some reason.

Tinek · 20 Oct 2023 at 08:56

Hostile_18 said:
Yeah it's not a good situation. Only comfort is no one is taking performance away from us. So when the 5090 comes out the 4090 will still be good and hopefully drop by quite a bit. Just reinforces non commercial users should upgrade every other gen or a generation behind.

If we are to trust Nvidia CEO's own words, 4090 is too cheap as is and new GPUs of that class will never be that cheap anymore. I expect them to keep 4090 price as is and just put 5090 above it and slot other cards around it as needed, keeping effectively 2 tiers at once (5k and 4k series) in stores, same as they did with 3k and 4k.

TNA · 20 Oct 2023 at 08:57

Tinek said:
Plus with all the real money they get from the enterprise and AI, they can take the hit from unsold gaming cards and not even notice much. There's really no leverage against them now and this is a monster that gaming community (at least partially) created themselves. And yet still so many people wish AMD be gone for some reason.

Who? Not noticed anyone here say that. Most just wound up about their underwhelming effort from what I can see.