Oscar Pistorius thread

[semi-pro waster]

There are no jurors in the South African system they were booted over 40 years ago, it is only the judge now and no one else that decides the outcome.

I stand corrected on that point then although learning that is not something that fills me with any greater confidence. I believe that the right to trial by jury is an important one and a strong point for UK law - I obviously realise that the reasons for the removal of jury trial in South Africa might have been valid but equally there could be consideration of reinstating it.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Actually I missed a bit of his quote out, it was 'Kill or be killed, shoot first ask questions later'.

So presumably lots of people accidently murder family members whilst following this mantra and should therefore not be jailed for murder as a result?

 

[manic111]

I stand corrected on that point then although learning that is not something that fills me with any greater confidence. I believe that the right to trial by jury is an important one and a strong point for UK law - I obviously realise that the reasons for the removal of jury trial in South Africa might have been valid but equally there could be consideration of reinstating it.

Although one of the big issues in the OJ case was finding unprejudiced jurors. As you've said above, surely that's the same here, in which case a trial without a jury is probably as fair as one with a jury?

 

[Jono8]

Actually I missed a bit of his quote out, it was 'Kill or be killed, shoot first ask questions later'.
He said that many times he had been sitting on his tractor or out in his fields, heard a rustling in the bushes and shot first. He would then send a worker to investigate and quite a few times he had shot somebody. Although he was saddened by it he said that he had no option, that's how it worked, nobody should be sneaking around his property.
I asked him what if it was one of his workers who had 'strayed' for some reason and he said they knew the rules and they would shout me to tell me what they were up to etc.
We didn't have it that bad in Nigeria and I never heard of ex pats killing Nigerian trespassers but we knew it was still shaky ground if they had got into the house. These Teef Men are not interested in TVs or gizmo's but know that the owners know where the proper valuables and money is.
Probably none of you here have any experience of being flagged down every single night by the Police or Army and having a rifle shoved in your head just because they want 'dash' (a bribe). We never kept money on our persons but always made sure we had sandwiches, crisps and chocolate in the car every night.

If, as you say, it is so dangerous and a murderer/rapist/thief could come into their house at any moment, why would he and Reeva not have some sort of system or special way of identifying if it was an intruder or just either of them ( like the farmer in your post said "they knew the rules and they would shout me to tell me what they were up to")

His story just doesn't add up...at all.

 

[semi-pro waster]

Although one of the big issues in the OJ case was finding unprejudiced jurors. As you've said above, surely that's the same here, in which case a trial without a jury is probably as fair as one with a jury?

Probably but then that's something that would merit consideration on an individual basis rather than the current position of no jury trials at all.

It might well be the media reporting which is skewing the impression given but I'd hope the trial itself is conducted in a way that appears to be slightly less of a three ring circus. If that means holding it in a closed court then that might be better provided it leads to a comprehensive and fair examination of all the evidence.

 

[nick.lidgett]

If i heard a noise in my house thought it was an intuder the first thing id do is **** myself, the second thing i would do is check for my wife, one to make sure its not her making the noise and to to smuggle her into the wardrobe nice and safe, then and only then, with my wife in the wardrobe would i go on the offencive. The safety of his woman should have been and i believe would have been his first priority if he is telling the truth. Clearly he isnt.

Anyone on these forums who are pro Pistorius are almost as stupid as the people who are pro AMD FX-xxxx.

Everyone is talking about how corrupt the SA judicial system is, well has anyone stopped to think that maybe it will be Pistorius who will be using this to his advantage, i mean he is a national hero with powerfull alies and buckets of cash.

 

[manic111]

Probably but then that's something that would merit consideration on an individual basis rather than the current position of no jury trials at all.

It might well be the media reporting which is skewing the impression given but I'd hope the trial itself is conducted in a way that appears to be slightly less of a three ring circus. If that means holding it in a closed court then that might be better provided it leads to a comprehensive and fair examination of all the evidence.

Yup, totally agree - I thought you were suggesting bringing back a jury for this trial specifically.

If i heard a noise in my house thought it was an intuder the first thing id do is **** myself, the second thing i would do is check for my wife, one to make sure its not her making the noise and to to smuggle her into the wardrobe nice and safe, then and only then, with my wife in the wardrobe would i go on the offencive. The safety of his woman should have been and i believe would have been his first priority if he is telling the truth. Clearly he isnt.

Anyone on these forums who are pro Pistorius are almost as stupid as the people who are pro AMD FX-xxxx.

I'm not pro anyone, but as others in this thread have said, you're talking as somebody who lives in this country. In SA, where it is legal to shoot intruders, your reaction may well be different.

Most people here who appear "pro Pistorius" are actually trying to be pro justice, to not condemn a man before he's found guilty, and to not jump on the bandwagon like everyone else. There are two sides to this case.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

I admit that I have no idea what it's like to live in such a dangerous place but honestly, while you were living there, if you heard a noise in the ensuite bathroom, would you fire 4 shots at the door without even checking it's not the person who you live with? I can't see that being a rational thing to do apart from in a paranoid, delusional and dangerous mind.

Apparently he was sure she was next to him. I can't count the amount of times I wake up in a morning and I think my wife is next to me but I'm usually fondling & talking to her pillow. A few posts back I posted how I nearly caved my wifes skull in with a fighting stick over 25 years ago because I was 100% convinced she was next to me when I heard noises downstairs.
I reckon everybody with a partner who they sleep and wake up with have experienced this several times
I have no idea if he is guilty or not.

 

[DampDog]

I posted how I nearly caved my wifes skull in with a fighting stick over 25 years ago because I was 100% convinced she was next to me when I heard noises downstairs.
I reckon everybody with a partner who they sleep and wake up with have experienced this several times
I have no idea if he is guilty or not.

And that says it all, you nearly did it. People just don't use that level of violence unless they are 110% sure. I can believe someone would possibly fire a gun once. To fire it 4 times, not a chance.

 

[Jono8]

Apparently he was sure she was next to him. I can't count the amount of times I wake up in a morning and I think my wife is next to me but I'm usually fondling & talking to her pillow. A few posts back I posted how I nearly caved my wifes skull in with a fighting stick over 25 years ago because I was 100% convinced she was next to me when I heard noises downstairs.
I reckon everybody with a partner who they sleep and wake up with have experienced this several times
I have no idea if he is guilty or not.

That isn't what happened though according to Oscar. He said he went out to the balcony to fetch something in and close the door and then came back in and heard a noise. Anyone's immediate reaction to this after leaving a room and coming back into it would be " oh maybe the other person who i live with and who was in my bed has got up and is making the noise". Instead, he just assumes it is an intruder, doesn't even check whether Reeva is still in bed, grabs his gun and fires four shots through his toilet door?

It is BS.

 

[Azza]

I'm sure there are some easier and less self risk ways of getting some one killed in SA.

 

[zenf]

Apparently he was sure she was next to him. I can't count the amount of times I wake up in a morning and I think my wife is next to me but I'm usually fondling & talking to her pillow. A few posts back I posted how I nearly caved my wifes skull in with a fighting stick over 25 years ago because I was 100% convinced she was next to me when I heard noises downstairs.
I reckon everybody with a partner who they sleep and wake up with have experienced this several times
I have no idea if he is guilty or not.

I've been sleeping and waking up with a partner for about 6 years and it's not something I've experienced, it seems obvious whether she's next to me or not to be honest. And no, she's not a heffer.

 

[nick.lidgett]

Oh come on now SA might be a bit like the wild west but that doesnt mean common sense is not applicable there. You go outside, hear a noise, come back in and walk past the bed (without checking its your mrs having a ****) get your gun, goto the bathroom door (without checking its your woman taking a ****) and open fire.

Im jumping straight on the band wagon and if this guy is found innocent then that just shows you how corrupt and how little justice there is in SA

 

[nick.lidgett]

I've been sleeping and waking up with a partner for about 6 years and it's not something I've experienced, it seems obvious whether she's next to me or not to be honest. And no, she's not a heffer.

And thats another thing, if his girlfriend was a fat ugly old cow i would be all for shooting her dead and making some burgers out of her but the fact of the matter she wasnt all i can think is what a terrible waste of sexy vagina

 

[SexyGreyFox]

And that says it all, you nearly did it. People just don't use that level of violence unless they are 110% sure. I can believe someone would possibly fire a gun once. To fire it 4 times, not a chance.

That isn't what happened though according to Oscar. He said he went out to the balcony to fetch something in and close the door and then came back in and heard a noise. Anyone's immediate reaction to this after leaving a room and coming back into it would be " oh maybe the other person who i live with and who was in my bed has got up and is making the noise". Instead, he just assumes it is an intruder, doesn't even check whether Reeva is still in bed, grabs his gun and fires four shots through his toilet door?

It is BS.

I'd just like to say I haven't got one thought either way about Pistorius because I'm not your average OCUK Judge Dredd who think they are an all knowing Judge, Jury & Executioner. I'm just throwing a few things into the pot that you can be 100% sure your partner is next to you when they're not.
Would I fire 4 shots through a bathroom door? - I don't know unless I live in SA and know what the daily threat is like.

 

[nick.lidgett]

Judge Dredd pmsl no mate just a normal guy that dont need a **** and bull trial to see the guy is guilty as sin, who knows she might have been a right **** that night and said some **** to deserve getting shot but to say he didnt know it was her and thought it was an intruder is ********.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

I love OCUK armchair detectives who get all their evidence from the tabloids & news.
It's quite scary.

I'll wait for the proper experts to give a verdict.

 

[Jono8]

I love OCUK armchair detectives who get all their evidence from the tabloids & news.
It's quite scary.

At least we have an opinion. Hows the fence? comfortable?

No one here can completely 100% say he or has not done it and what we say here doesn't matter in the slightest.

I am however of the opinion that his story is farcical and makes no sense. i don't have to be any sort of "armchair detective" or anything like that. I have read the account of his official story and i think it is a blatant lie.

 

[manic111]

Oh come on now SA might be a bit like the wild west but that doesnt mean common sense is not applicable there. You go outside, hear a noise, come back in and walk past the bed (without checking its your mrs having a ****) get your gun, goto the bathroom door (without checking its your woman taking a ****) and open fire.

Im jumping straight on the band wagon and if this guy is found innocent then that just shows you how corrupt and how little justice there is in SA

So, to clarify, you're saying that there is absolutely no possibility that he is not guilty?

 

[nick.lidgett]

None