Project: Two storey/part single storey side and rear extensions

More issue

1. Plumber messed up and didnt cap radaitors correctly from end of old house - new ceiling ruined, this is the 4th leak that has caused damage. Developer blamed our boiler :confused:

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2. Our quote states

2 x new bathroom suites (en-suite) and main. Supply & Fitting (mid-level pricing) a. Tiled and finished (floor to ceiling) b. Includes vanity units, Electrical wall Mirrors c. Similar spec to Dan’s home we viewed as client reference. Factoring in free standing bath / taps. . Bathroom and ensuite same standard as (Forest Lodge) £2,500.00 per suite.

Not sure where we stand legally; but he has now fitted one bathroom suite we outlined i.e we wanted free standing taps; a freestanding bath and vanity (way way before final quote stage). This morning; he has turned round and said we way way over budget we are up to £5-6K already. He went ahead and purchased items and fitted without us seeing any pricing or indications and is now saying the suite (£2,500) fee amount is needed to include floor to ceiling tiles; fitting etc.

He has provided an unrealistic figure as even before purchasing a single product he would be over that threshold and is now asking for a LOT more money (fixed price project). He is also refusing to show us any price breakdown of product. He want's us to take his word for it :confused:

Even things like Electrical wall Mirrors highlighted in the quote. He refuses to purchase as that's a client preference and "he does not do mirrors".

It's only a tiny ensuite; we have not even got the main bathroom yet :(

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tom_e said:
I'm getting angry for you and it's not affecting my life in the slightest. I can't believe how frustrating this must be for you.
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Agreed. Each time I see you update the thread I have my fingers crossed you have some good news and am following the thread with interest.

What happened to the project manager you tried to appoint? Did the builder just refuse to work with them?
I notice in your above post you referenced a previous customer the builder had.... did they mention any issues they had during their build?

From your posts it seems like the builder is just trying to get the work done asap with as minimum spend on materials, etc as possible. What has his response been when you've reminded him of the original completion/move in date? Do you have much in the way of leverage from pending/outstanding payments to the builder from the total cost?

As above, can appreciate this is a horrible situation to be in. I think I would have probably sacked the builder by now and be looking to find another one to finish the works depending on how much money I had left of the budget and how much I had paid to the current builder.
 
dlockers said:
£2.5k is a laughable estimate for a bathroom.
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Indeed, I think I spent that much doing mine DIY. We didn't even replace the loo or sink (old ones were fine). New bath, fixtures, and refurb from studding back for 50% or plasterboard on other 50%.
I would say £2k might just about be possible if its a minimal refit, using the cheapest everything.

The guy who normally sells xmas trees near us is actually a bathroom fitter. He says its a week job for him to strip back, and fit a full bathroom.
Hes going to charge £1kish for just labour in that time. I suspect it would be more if you have numerous trades coming in just doing part since they will have minimums for each job.
 
Matt-Page said:
From your posts it seems like the builder is just trying to get the work done asap with as minimum spend on materials, etc as possible.
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With respect, one should anticipate this with any fixed price quote. You can't move time but you can move scope. And a £2.5k estimate wouldn't pass the straight face test - go and price a suite on Bathstore.com and you'll be at that just for basic stuff.
 
dlockers said:
£2.5k is a laughable estimate for a bathroom.
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Yes, agree but the quote says per suite and what we discussed verbally all aloing so thats just bath, and a small vanity unit. He now expects this to be including everything (including fitting). The houses we visted as client reference all was told under this threshold for the suite only. He does get huge discounts at a supplier he uses and kept assuring us this was more than ample.
 
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Matt-Page said:
Agreed. Each time I see you update the thread I have my fingers crossed you have some good news and am following the thread with interest.

What happened to the project manager you tried to appoint? Did the builder just refuse to work with them?
I notice in your above post you referenced a previous customer the builder had.... did they mention any issues they had during their build?

From your posts it seems like the builder is just trying to get the work done asap with as minimum spend on materials, etc as possible. What has his response been when you've reminded him of the original completion/move in date? Do you have much in the way of leverage from pending/outstanding payments to the builder from the total cost?

As above, can appreciate this is a horrible situation to be in. I think I would have probably sacked the builder by now and be looking to find another one to finish the works depending on how much money I had left of the budget and how much I had paid to the current builder.
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He refused to work with the project manager and told him to **** ***. This was part of the very heated debate and things got nasty.

Yes, we visted two seperate customers and spoke with one at length. Both houses large developments (couple million pound developments), but something is a miss. Hearing to many horror stories.

Re completion date, he knew full well the 18th December was the final day of our house rental; and said im going as fast as i can and it's not really my issue :( As for sacking the builder its our own fault yes, we put ourselves in this position but there is only 10K left; we need him to continue as much as possible as we still do not have all our glass, even outside brickwork complete. He seems to think there is only a 1-2 weeks worth of work left (there is a lot more left, confirmed by our QS who he refuses to work with)
 
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So Christmas deadline not met as predicted. Perhaps - and I'm just trying to take something positive here - the quality of workmanship will improve and be smoother when they are not time pressured in the new year?
It honestly comes across like a bunch of cowboys are chopping up your beloved family home. Is there no way to abort and get someone else?
 
I would say reading this line from your quote "2 x new bathroom suites (en-suite) and main. Supply & Fitting (mid-level pricing) a. Tiled and finished (floor to ceiling) " that the price included everything in the bathroom.
As others have said that is simply not enough unless you go the DIY route and choose cheaper products.
Did you choose the tiles and fittings in the bathroom and was any mention made of cost implications in those decisions.
 
jaybee said:
So Christmas deadline not met as predicted. Perhaps - and I'm just trying to take something positive here - the quality of workmanship will improve and be smoother when they are not time pressured in the new year?
It honestly comes across like a bunch of cowboys are chopping up your beloved family home. Is there no way to abort and get someone else?
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To be fair, the overall quality of workmanship has been good, but the project has suffered from being done out of order and poorly managed. The developer has relied heavily on third-party companies to complete various elements, and unfortunately, painting and plumbing have been significant areas of concern.

In fact, we made the decision to ask the painter to leave this week and not return due to the abysmal quality of his work. The developer has assured us that a new painter will be brought in after the New Year. Several contractors have informed us that the individual he plans to bring in is excellent, albeit expensive. It seems the initial painter was brought in for cost reasons, hence the dissatisfaction with the quality of the work.

This was the final staw; when we asked him to leave. New plaster.

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964rs said:
I would say reading this line from your quote "2 x new bathroom suites (en-suite) and main. Supply & Fitting (mid-level pricing) a. Tiled and finished (floor to ceiling) " that the price included everything in the bathroom.
As others have said that is simply not enough unless you go the DIY route and choose cheaper products.
Did you choose the tiles and fittings in the bathroom and was any mention made of cost implications in those decisions.
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We were initially inclined towards using FIBO waterproof boards instead of tiles. However, the developer suggested finding something similar in tile form, assuring us that it would be more convenient for everyone as he had a tiler who could work over the weekend to get it completed. We agreed, especially since he provided a sample and committed to using this tile over our preferred board, as indicated in the quote that included tiles.

Regarding fittings, we provided pictures of styles we liked and communicated our preferences based on fittings from other houses completed and sourced by the developer. Unfortunately, it seems that there has been mismanagement, leading to attempts to cut costs on his part.
 
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kai said:
Not the case unfortunately, due to his deviation from the plan. Steel was not used in that section per the drawing and orginal calcs. The steal beam was suppose to bolt into a new brick wall. The developer instead used a timber frame wall and tripled up the joists; as such building control made him add addtional support frames hence the bulkhead.
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Not sure why they couldn't have added some flitch plates to the timber to strengthen them.
 
kai said:
To be fair, the overall quality of workmanship has been good, but the project has suffered from being done out of order and poorly managed. The developer has relied heavily on third-party companies to complete various elements, and unfortunately, painting and plumbing have been significant areas of concern.

In fact, we made the decision to ask the painter to leave this week and not return due to the abysmal quality of his work. The developer has assured us that a new painter will be brought in after the New Year. Several contractors have informed us that the individual he plans to bring in is excellent, albeit expensive. It seems the initial painter was brought in for cost reasons, hence the dissatisfaction with the quality of the work.

This was the final staw; when we asked him to leave. New plaster.

FPn404A.png





We were initially inclined towards using FIBO waterproof boards instead of tiles. However, the developer suggested finding something similar in tile form, assuring us that it would be more convenient for everyone as he had a tiler who could work over the weekend to get it completed. We agreed, especially since he provided a sample and committed to using this tile over our preferred board, as indicated in the quote that included tiles.

Regarding fittings, we provided pictures of styles we liked and communicated our preferences based on fittings from other houses completed and sourced by the developer. Unfortunately, it seems that there has been mismanagement, leading to attempts to cut costs on his part.
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That's on the plasterer not the painter. Id imagine the painter is relieved to not be on the job anymore.
 
We are honestly at breaking point; today the plumber who we is unreliable has caused several major leaks has done something beyond belief. Both my architect and QS have not seen anything like this in the trade before. My wife is completely distraught; tomorrow with the developer should be fun.

Two issues with the following photo

1. A towel rad you are unable to use; its blocked by the bath. I am not sure, but i also think its the wrong pipe work.
2. A freestanding tap that does not reach the bath :o (we can't move the bath we need it flush to the tiles for the room)

Both need fairly large compoents of work; tiles off the wall and flooring to come up back to this point as it's been drilled in

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Oh and the pipework under the stairs to fix the head-height issue. However, we have just been told by our QS this needs to be checked by building control and might not even pass. I also do not want an ugly bulk-head. the pipes should have been recessed.

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Jesus wept. How and why did the plumber do any of those?

Was the bath already in situ when he fitted the towel rail? Was it not realised the towel rail would be there before the tiling was done? The pipe work for the towel rail looks awful. The tap situation is comical. He wants shooting.

Who sourced the plumber? Did he arrive on a horse?

Really feel sorry for you. I saw your budget was £160K. Minus the 10K you said is left to pay, you must be at your wits end.

What's the honest opinion or your QS friend? Do you have any other funds to sack the current tradesman and get new ones in to sort everything?
 
Christ on a bike. :mad:

What the hell is going on with that radiator pipe coming out of the wall at that angle?!

This is the sort of thing that would end up on The Ferret if it was still going.


Guessing cutting ties and getting a solicitor involved isn't going to work due to the contract / agreed works?
 
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