Project: Two storey/part single storey side and rear extensions

Matt-Page said:
Jesus wept. How and why did the plumber do any of those?

Was the bath already in situ when he fitted the towel rail? Was it not realised the towel rail would be there before the tiling was done? The pipe work for the towel rail looks awful. The tap situation is comical. He wants shooting.

Who sourced the plumber? Did he arrive on a horse?

Really feel sorry for you. I saw your budget was £160K. Minus the 10K you said is left to pay, you must be at your wits end.

What's the honest opinion or your QS friend? Do you have any other funds to sack the current tradesman and get new ones in to sort everything?
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No. It was an empty room; he had pipes ready for the towel radiator so was fully aware the location of both bath and rad. We even provided a diagram to follow.

I’ve now got to go tell them I’m not accepting the rad position, the thermostat being horizontal and well they really can’t argue about the tap not reaching. It just screams amateur.

We have not told the developer we are going to have it professionally snagged; but I’m not sure if it’s worth saying something now as the penny might drop it’s not going fly. When I’ve queried items before I’ve been told “am I builder, NO, I don’t tell you how to do your IT job, so **** ***”

I’m also thinking of starting to just film our interactions and put a camera in his face. He might walk though!
 
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As mentioned above I cringe a little every time I get a notification for this thread updating. Really feel for you and your family kai.

We got to a standoff with our first "builder" (certainly not a contractor or developer) on the loft conversion. Ticking down to Christmas and one window (large floor to ceiling) in one of the kids new bedrooms.

He was blaming the supplier and dragging out finishing up. I called a favour and found out the window was (and had been for days) ready for collection - he knew we had carpet fitters booked in for two days time right ahead of Xmas.

Went ballistic when I called him out and refused to pay him anything else until the window was fitted. He walked off site. Long story short we came to an agreement, in writing and shook on it and he still then held me to ransom at the death over a very full skip on our drive wanting another £3k to remove it.

Luckily I'd seen it coming and had fudged some formulas in the spreadsheet so had some bunce which almost covered it. The thing is he is a local builder who now now has a shocking reputation in the area and has to look for work further afield.

We were one of 3-4 jobs he had on at the same time and on reflection that was the issue. There was no oversight or coordination / management from him which we would have got if he only had 1 or 2 jobs on.

Sounds a lot of what you are experiencing is possibly down to the same issue. End of the day he is (regardless of calling himself a developer) likely a jobbing builder who uses a string of one man band / small / self employed trades people he has worked with in the past, has had recommended or are (was in my case) family members. Very few builders, contractors, developers or even tier 1 contractors have directly employed trades, or even staff over their management team (pre con, QS, site staff / project and site managers). Without that coordination, pride in their work and a huge dose of common sense and giving a **** this is all too common. He should have coordinated and managed it better and I'm pretty certain he knows that too.

Given where you are at and levels of stress and frustration there will, undoubtedly, be a huge urge and desire to get it done and him off site, but rushing things will end up with more errors and reduced quality.

Genuinely hope you get this resolved quickly, amicably and to your satisfaction. People like him give the industry a bad name
 
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{SAS}TB said:
As mentioned above I cringe a little every time I get a notification for this thread updating. Really feel for you and your family kai.

We got to a standoff with our first "builder" (certainly not a contractor or developer) on the loft conversion. Ticking down to Christmas and one window (large floor to ceiling) in one of the kids new bedrooms.

He was blaming the supplier and dragging out finishing up. I called a favour and found out the window was (and had been for days) ready for collection - he knew we had carpet fitters booked in for two days time right ahead of Xmas.

Went ballistic when I called him out and refused to pay him anything else until the window was fitted. He walked off site. Long story short we came to an agreement, in writing and shook on it and he still then held me to ransom at the death over a very full skip on our drive wanting another £3k to remove it.

Luckily I'd seen it coming and had fudged some formulas in the spreadsheet so had some bunce which almost covered it. The thing is he is a local builder who now now has a shocking reputation in the area and has to look for work further afield.

We were one of 3-4 jobs he had on at the same time and on reflection that was the issue. There was no oversight or coordination / management from him which we would have got if he only had 1 or 2 jobs on.

Sounds a lot of what you are experiencing is possibly down to the same issue. End of the day he is (regardless of calling himself a developer) likely a jobbing builder who uses a string of one man band / small / self employed trades people he has worked with in the past, has had recommended or are (was in my case) family members. Very few builders, contractors, developers or even tier 1 contractors have directly employed trades, or even staff over their management team (pre con, QS, site staff / project and site managers). Without that coordination, pride in their work and a huge dose of common sense and giving a **** this is all too common. He should have coordinated and managed it better and I'm pretty certain he knows that too.

Given where you are at and levels of stress and frustration there will, undoubtedly, be a huge urge and desire to get it done and him off site, but rushing things will end up with more errors and reduced quality.

Genuinely hope you get this resolved quickly, amicably and to your satisfaction. People like him give the industry a bad name
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I had issues with my roofer which is well documented on one of my home renmovating threads I started a year ago. Took 4 months to finish my roof which only needed a underlay, new battons etc. That was it... 4 day job turned to a 4 month job
 
kai said:
No. It was an empty room; he had pipes ready for the towel radiator so was fully aware the location of both bath and rad. We even provided a diagram to follow.

I’ve now got to go tell them I’m not accepting the rad position, the thermostat being horizontal and well they really can’t argue about the tap not reaching. It just screams amateur.

We have not told the developer we are going to have it professionally snagged; but I’m not sure if it’s worth saying something now as the penny might drop it’s not going fly. When I’ve queried items before I’ve been told “am I builder, NO, I don’t tell you how to do your IT job, so **** ***”

I’m also thinking of starting to just film our interactions and put a camera in his face. He might walk though!
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Can't believe the builder chirps that line at you. I'd be reminding him who the customer is, who's house it is and who's the one paying his wage. Additionally if he told me to *** ** in my own house I'd send him packing.

IT worker or not, if you were performing badly or doing things how the customer didn't want it, you'd be open to discussion and work with them to get the desired result. Particularly as he's been constantly deviating away from the Architects plans and going against Building control.

Have Building control visited to see the fudge up with the stairs yet? There's no way they would accept that amount of head clearance.
 
Matt-Page said:
Can't believe the builder chirps that line at you. I'd be reminding him who the customer is, who's house it is and who's the one paying his wage. Additionally if he told me to *** ** in my own house I'd send him packing.

IT worker or not, if you were performing badly or doing things how the customer didn't want it, you'd be open to discussion and work with them to get the desired result. Particularly as he's been constantly deviating away from the Architects plans and going against Building control.

Have Building control visited to see the fudge up with the stairs yet? There's no way they would accept that amount of head clearance.
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I think one of the bigger issues was the the builder was paid ahead of works being completed so OP never had the leverage to fire him without being significantly out of pocket and having to scrabble around to find a new builder to step in on a tight deadline. There might be some trade bodies/guilds he could be reported to but that comes after.
 
Today was quite eventful. I began the morning by calling the developer to express my dissatisfaction with the situation – it's challenging to use the bath suite when the tap can't reach the bath, and placing a towel on the radiator is problematic. These are basic necessities!

In response, he immediately became defensive, blaming my wife and me for being difficult customers. He insisted that he had repeatedly warned us that the chosen style bath (he picked the bath mind) wouldn't work, suggesting we should have opted for a shower to fit the en-suite (this was news to us). Tensions rose, and he claimed to be outside our house, urging us to speak face to face.

Feeling angry and upset, I promptly called the QS to pop round and join the conversation as an independent witness. To cut a long story short, the developer attempted to bully his way out of the situation but soon realized my experienced QS wasn't easily deceived. Backtracks ensued, and despite growing irritation, my QS controlled the conversation, securing a commitment to specific completion dates in January (though we're skeptical about their actual realization).

The developer labeled us problematic clients, accused us of being compulsive liars, and interfered in matters beyond our understanding, such as our kitchen order with Howdens (presumably to conceal the final price). Despite the accusations, I remained composed, letting my QS handle the situation and occasionally laughing at the developer's lies.

He was constantly bringing up money and how much we are over. It’s all itemised and clearly hasn’t read the quote - he signed.
how many extra’s we have had. All of which are contained with the quote. He has an answer for everything !

Fifteen minutes later, after the meeting a call followed, with the developer offering profuse apologies and expressing remorse for our inconvenience, acknowledging that we won't be in for Christmas. It seemed the realization dawned that bullying tactics wouldn't work on us, as reportedly experienced with his other clients.

Upon my return tonight, the entire site had been cleaned, things left in order, and protective matting laid down for the first time in eight months. While uncertain how long this improvement will last, the ultimate goal is progress toward completion.
 
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Either that or his multiple personalities are finally kicking in!

Hopefully he's going to keep his head out his arse for the rest of the project and it's smooth sailing from now on
 
tom_e said:
Either that or his multiple personalities are finally kicking in!

Hopefully he's going to keep his head out his arse for the rest of the project and it's smooth sailing from now on
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It’s a horrible thing to say; but his men call him “the bipolar boss”.

It’s just we never know what developer we get from day to day and feel like we are walking on egg shells in our own home :(

As I’ve said a few times now; this is the most stressful, toughest thing we have ever ever done!
 
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kai said:
Today was quite eventful. I began the morning by calling the developer to express my dissatisfaction with the situation – it's challenging to use the bath suite when the tap can't reach the bath, and placing a towel on the radiator is problematic. These are basic necessities!

In response, he immediately became defensive, blaming my wife and me for being difficult customers. He insisted that he had repeatedly warned us that the chosen style bath (he picked the bath mind) wouldn't work, suggesting we should have opted for a shower to fit the en-suite (this was news to us). Tensions rose, and he claimed to be outside our house, urging us to speak face to face.

Feeling angry and upset, I promptly called the QS to pop round and join the conversation as an independent witness. To cut a long story short, the developer attempted to bully his way out of the situation but soon realized my experienced QS wasn't easily deceived. Backtracks ensued, and despite growing irritation, my QS controlled the conversation, securing a commitment to specific completion dates in January (though we're skeptical about their actual realization).

The developer labeled us problematic clients, accused us of being compulsive liars, and interfered in matters beyond our understanding, such as our kitchen order with Howdens (presumably to conceal the final price). Despite the accusations, I remained composed, letting my QS handle the situation and occasionally laughing at the developer's lies.

He was constantly bringing up money and how much we are over. It’s all itemised and clearly hasn’t read the quote - he signed.
how many extra’s we have had. All of which are contained with the quote. He has an answer for everything !

Fifteen minutes later, after the meeting a call followed, with the developer offering profuse apologies and expressing remorse for our inconvenience, acknowledging that we won't be in for Christmas. It seemed the realization dawned that bullying tactics wouldn't work on us, as reportedly experienced with his other clients.

Upon my return tonight, the entire site had been cleaned, things left in order, and protective matting laid down for the first time in eight months. While uncertain how long this improvement will last, the ultimate goal is progress toward completion.
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Hi. What is QS?

And i am glad you made some progress
 
A QS is usually cost based in terms of both preparing cost plans prior to works being priced / quoted for but then can also "manage" the cost / evaluate cost of works on site (exact role is dependant on who they are working for - client / contractor or third party).

Most QSs will have a good understanding of building processes / techniques / methodology and sequencing as well as understanding of contracts and clauses (especially those which affect cost or time and therefore cost)

A QS, Architect or Project Manager would usually administer the contract but in terms of conflicts / dispute resolution a QS may be used or it could be escalated (usually) to the RICS for adjudication.

It's rare on domestic builds and literally non existent on domestic builds without a contract but believe it's a neighbour of Kai's who is giving some advice and challenging some of the info and comments from the builder
 
Just opened this thread as it's been popping up a bit recently (more so than over the last year at least) and oh boy, I wish I hadn't! Hopefully things go better with the project here on out, they can't get much worse at least!
 
DampCat said:
Bloody hell.

Do you have somewhere to stay?
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We do; we are very fortunate to be staying at a freinds home within 200 yards (who is currently away).
Zefan said:
Just opened this thread as it's been popping up a bit recently (more so than over the last year at least) and oh boy, I wish I hadn't! Hopefully things go better with the project here on out, they can't get much worse at least!
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Welcome to the madness.


As an update, we decided to stay away from the house during the Christmas period to take a break and not dwell on the ongoing project, which has been quite overwhelming. However, when I went in on Christmas day to retrieve some stored presents, I noticed a leak in the kitchen. Consequently, both my wife and I found ourselves on the ladder on Boxing Day, attempting to attach a tarpaulin. It appears that the lead flashing was installed incorrectly, and the new glass roof installed last week is also leaking :mad:. We promptly informed the developer via SMS on the 27th , and he was understanding. He sent someone today to assess the situation and assured us that the necessary repairs will commence next week.

On a separate note, our boiler, which is only 9 years old, has been constantly breaking down (with over £1,000 spent on parts during this timeframe, lucky we have boiler cover). Despite British Gas visiting seven times in the last three weeks, it continues to malfunction. Being a Ferroli, it is temperamental at best. Consequently, the house has been without heating. Today, we made the decision to purchase a Worcester Bosch Greenstar 4000 30kw for £2,700—a purchase we could have done without.

New downstairs floor starting to go down; over the underfloor retrofit.

4xqGXb2.png


Our utility room, which was initially intended to be a standard part of the project, ended up being provided to us at no cost. Howden's made significant errors, leading to numerous inconveniences, and as a gesture to make amends, they gave us the utility room for free. Including the heat pump dryer.

o4JR96f.png


New Roof Light.
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The leak is clearly tracking under the flashings :(

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On a more postive note; i finally got round to building our new bed yesterday and hanging the light.

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Plus what i feel will be my favorite room! a bed with a view (we also aligned the bath tub; so it's directly looking out as well from here)

xSXT6DJ.png
 
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Nightmare about that leak but that bedroom view looks great! I'm sure it'll be great in the end but like a lot of these projects the journey isn't one you want to repeat.


That left hand side of your utility what's going there? First thoughts are looks like an outside tap/ plumbing looks naff and not ideal for a dishwasher/washing unit either as will push them further forward into the room.
 
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